Keziah, City, Choc et al support thread

[Keziahhopes]

Hi - found us a new home. Just didn't like the title of my old thread - and have found your support so helpful but would also like this thread to be less egocentric .

Choc -hope cbt assessment goes well.

City - how are you doing?

My physio exercises are helping me, but don't see stroke consultant until beginning of July. Still not had OT assessment, but dont' think will need it by then - just been horrible for dh to do everything for me since Easter. Now more independend - just had my first shower by myself!!

Choc - how frustrating, well if you don't like them, you know what to ask for!! Wow, a run with your dd on her bike, I am so impressed by that!

city - your nice day sounds much better than sensible housework. I was taken out for lunch yesterday by someone not seen properly for ages, which was so nice. Then the supermarket shop and today the garden after church. Well, actually have sent dh into the garden so even better.

Not forgotten recipe, just need dh to tell me where on this computer my files like that are!!

Need to phone physio up tomorrow to see her again for more exercises - I just can't stand on one leg for 30 seconds or walk backwards as if on a tightrope, but can do all the others now!!

Your weekend sounds lovely, Keziah, especially the seeing someone you hadn't met up with for too long - my favourite thing . You sound like me , sending dh into the garden ... I'm always trying to get him to scythe through the jungle get some extra fresh air .

Glad you have a place of worship you attend which hopefully helps you feel more supported through hard times ( and good ). Is it a dynamic , fearsomely welcoming church like most places have become in recent years , or a bit more low key ?

Those couple of exercises you can't do are so difficult , so it seems you've made excellent progress , brilliant to hear . Please don't worry about recipe atm , I well know the joys of things being safely filed away !

Aha , I'm picturing choc becoming a church organist - that would be fabulous . Hope you've had a nice weekend , choc , with improved sleep , though perhaps it will take your body a while to resume its sleep pattern .

Peaceful evening all

city, ah your weekend sounded lovely (well apart from the migraine). Strangely mine is distant blur . I did get out to enjoy the sunshine, also today. But...

New pills ok I think. Actually felt ready to sleep about 8pm yesterday evening (though still took me until 2am to manage it). Tonight weird. Just got home. Have been through all the emotions today. I'm still struggling with CBT. Thinking I might just give it up a loss but am scared I'm making the wrong decision - I know people wait years for this . But then I just don't trust my own judgement.

That's pretty good going with the physio, Keziah. Hope you managed to arrange to see her again.

Sorry it's so hard atm , choc , but I'm sure you won't do anything in haste re the therapy - you know CBT isn't "enough" for a lot of types of issues . Could your subconscious mind be working through issues at a furious pace atm , making those days feel a bit of a blur ? That could be positive - perhaps your mind is reaching important conclusions about what exactly you need , which is hard but helpful in the long term ?

My gut feeling is you might want to keep reading up exhaustively on the issues you're dealing with ( when you feel up to it , obviously, which I doubt you are atm ) and eventually you'll see in someone else's experience something that will help you work out what might help you . That's what works for me , so maybe it's worth persevering with exploringng about related issues ... Sorry , bet not one word of that makes sense to you [hblush]

I'm wondering too - again- whether the medication may be causing you some truly unacceptable side effects , in terms of your state of mind - very difficult for you to find the best / least worst options with that , but Keziah is the one who advises you so ably there.

Glad you've been making sure to enjoy time outdoors and it sounds very hopeful that you were ready for bed so early , albeit sleepless for hours

Sending vast amounts of positive thoughts and prayers for you this week . Keziah .

Thanks - really need positive thoughts/prayers - as high chance of miscarriage, now on lots of immune drugs thanks to a wonderful private gynae who interpreted my level 1 and 2 immune tests - but fear I saw him too late and losing it. Some pink spotting - booked hcg tests privately for wed and fri (well fri if wed ok) as nhs do nothing till lose it or get to standard scan time and my anxiety is too high for that. Also need infusion if get positive hcg's. going to call in work sick tomorrow as got to go to a hospital hour away and find out if lost pregnancy adn can't cope going in if not. Does that sound ok? I never phone in sick.

Sorry to hear Keziah . Yes it's perfectly fine to phone in sick. Glad you got to see gynae but so hope it's not too late. Will be thinking of you tomorrow.

city I think I understood some of what you wrote. Yes fear my state of mind is med side effect. Damned if I do, damned if I don't. Today I really didn't know what to think so been doing one of my usual tricks - burying things (compartmentalising is another favourite pass-time). Just want to run away from everything. Couldn't cope at work today and so walked out (I forced myself to go back couple hours later). I've got until Thursday to apply for new job/s and it's been really tough deciding (nothing looks interesting enough- hmm this makes me sound ungrateful - but my role is being made redundant so I don't have any choice). Just finding it all really stressful and can't work out if it only feels this bad because of the depression/anxiety.

Joining you in positive thoughts and prayers for Keziah.

Thoughts and prayers , Keziah wish I could find better words to express how much choc and I are hoping you get good news . ((((( Keziah )))))

Glad you found excellent private gynae and so sorry you feel you many have seen him too late . I really feel angry for women in this position , not getting decent help on the NHS . Praying the immune therapy works for you .

Oh no choc, what a foul situation at work . It really doesn't sound as if your current emotional / mental state results only from your anxiety and depression - it sounds as if a lot of the stress is situational. Not surprised it's all come to a head for you . It's obviously serious for you if you just don't know what to do < says she helpfully > .

Is there any chance of a meeting with a supervisor to try and clarify your options ? I'm sure you 've been trying to find out more by different methods , but the way the work changes have been (mis) managed has had such an effect on your existing mental state that you've come to a stop for the moment . Hugs to you too.

You are clearly very intelligent and I feel people with that advantage do have an edge in eventually overcoming the complicated issues you are faced with - but the process seems to be extra long and exacting to fit the level of "extra" work your brain is doing on your problems , throwing up difficulties to work through , and lots of anxiety and depression as a side effect .

Love to you both xx

Choc gosh role being made redundant sounds very stressful. Hope you can choose another role that you do like, or with people that might make work easier, or a place where you like etc.

Was at hospital for 8am, had beta HcG - at 12,000 which is off the scale for 5 weeks so they said I am pregnant and booked me the intralipid. Not sure when that will be, may be Fri, Sat or Mon. About £300 a time hope not need too many of those!! So no need for blood test on Friday they said. So hope not need to miss work on Friday. Next 2 weeks to get through are crucial. So any tips on how to reduce anxiety?

That is amazingly lovely news , Keziah , thank you for posting so quickly knowing that we'd be looking out for any news you might feel up to posting .

I replied just after one o'clock , but my PC crashed when MN disabled "Threads I'm On " for maintenance and I've only just got it going again , so I'll have to keep you waiting for the benefit of my sage advice on anxiety management in serious situations ( I had lots of ideas which were probably insensitive so it's just as well my post got munched ).

Hope the staff you saw were supportive at this stressful time and I'm so glad you've found a consultant who prescribes these expensive - but - priceless infusions .

Have been bouncing about this afternoon at your news and so wanted to congratulate you . Hope the hormones aren't causing extra tiredness yet , though I'm sure any symptom will be a treasured part of your pregnancy .

Hope choc is OK - I'm sure she knows we're thinking of her - and that we all have a peaceful evening

That's fantastic news Keziah. I got in from work 20 minutes ago and rushed straight for the computer looking for your news . As for reducing anxiety I'd recommend the usual deep breathing, nice baths, relaxing music (anything really that you'd normally find relaxing) plus lots of visualisation about really positive things/beautiful places etc. That should do it.

I'm about done for tonight. I've just had some valerian tea (didn't want to risk the zopiclone as I've got to be up and alert and commuting to a conference at 6am ). Am trying not to think about it. Thanks for the support city and Keziah. Will try to catch up with you both on Friday - I don't think I'll be fit for much tomorrow either as will be another late one home by the time I get the train back. Hope you have good day tomorrow x

Aw - you two are so lovely - sending you huge ((((((((hugs)))))))) AND I wanted to tell you asap, as know life isn't always nice.

All best choc for your commute. Have good rest tomorrow and really hope you have good journeys both ways. I tried green tea with lemon tonight - as prednisolone's side effect is insomina, joy when already have it!

city - am sure you have sage comments. I am having infusion (2hrs I think of actual infusion) on Friday, so dont' know time yet or whether miss work (work half of it), but really don't know what to tell work.

Am seeing gp next week, so hopefully he will fund the thryoxine, steroids at least. The pessaries and intralipids are expensive enough as they are. Keep telling myself it will be all worth it.

Oh - and get to miss seeing cpn for infusion probably, need an excuse for her as not telling her the truth xx

Night night xxx

Thank you so much , Keziah - choc and I are very priveleged to share your news . Hope you've not been feeling too yucky in this heat .

Hmmm , hadn't thought of work and especially CPN ... maybe a look at the employment forum here or assisted conception / general health would show others in similar situations , trying to be discreet . Shame to have that concern at the moment .

Dear god choc , what a schedule !! Hope conference has been going well and I don't think Keziah will be expecting you to post on Fridy until you've had a looong flop out . Hope the valerian tea helped a bit - very wise not to risk the zopiclone .

Ooh yes , agree with the visualisation being helpful , & hope that suits you Keziah . Would be an outrage if NHS didn't fund those meds necessary to your basic health . Really hoping you escape the worst of the prednisolone insomnia

Very peaceful evening all...glorious day leaving me a bit "blissed out " again!

LENTIL BOLOGNESE

Preparation and cooking time : 30 minutes

4oz / 10g / just over 1/2 a cup dried red lentils or 1 x 14oz / 397 can lentils
1 onion
1 clove garlic or 1/4 tsp ground garlic
2 sticks celery
1 small carrot
1 small can (7oz / 230g) tomatoes or 3-4 fresh tomatoes
1 tlbsp oil for frying
1 tblsp tomato puree or tomato ketchup
Salt, Pepper
1/2 tsp sugar
1 tsp dried mixed herbs
1/2 tsp vegetable extract
1-2 cups / 1/4 1/2 pt / 142-284 ml water (save lentil water if cooking dried lentils or save liquid form can of lentils)

Wash the dried lentils well - no need to soak - then cook in boiling water (no salt) for 20 minutes if you are.Drain lentils and save water to use in the sauce.
Peel and chop the onion and garlic. Wash and chop celery finely. Peel and grate or finely chop carrot. Chop tomatoes (use juice as well).
Fry onion, celery and garlic gently for 5 minutes until softened.
Add carrot,lentils, tomatoes,ketchup, salt, pepper, sugar, herbs, and marmite. Then stir in 1-2 cups of water (you will need most water if you are using fresh tomatoes to make a runny sauce. Bring to the boil over a low heat, stirring occasionally. Then simmer for 10-15 minutes, adding a little more liquid if it seems too stiff, until you have a nice thick sauce.

I add tinned butter beans +/kidney beans for more nutrients. I make lots and freeze individual portions to serve with pasta.

Sorry recipe sounds complicated - it isn't it is just the way I typed it!!!!

To make it easy city I put kettle on, boil lentils and while they boil get out ALL the other ingredients. By time lentils done have chopped veg, got stuff out of cupboard and it is sorted. I find this makes 3 portions, especially if add tinned pulses for good nutrients and protein.

City - beautiful weather, I agree - in fact it has made me cope, just about, with awful letter from psychiatrist (copy of my last meeting with her, although it is not my version of events!!) Will rage about that another time. Tonight I have had sunny day, nice nurse (private obviously to do my intralipid) and have got to the weekend!!

Cool Keziah found the recipe! Very nutricious. Looks doable too so thanks for that. (Might let city try it out first ).

I survived my schedule - good commutes in both directions so can only think the angels were looking out for me yesterday . The valerian tea worked a treat but in any case I'm definitely finding it easier to sleep since not having the evening dose. I'm feeling pretty spaced out today though - but I guess to be expected. It's like yesterday was all a dream...

I'm still smiling at your news, Keziah ( at the cost of your treatment though - but as you say well worth it). Sounds like the intralipid was ok? Really hope your gp funds the rest of your treatment. As for the psych letter, don't let it put a downer on your weekend. Think happy, positive thoughts. Calm. No raging allowed (only kidding!).

city it's difficult to trump Keziah's good news isn't it . But hope you're still blissed out. Is that a similar feeling to being spaced out? Yes the work situation is very stressful - mainly because it's been so drawn out. I'm dreading the next few weeks but will be glad when it's all over whatever the outcome. Hope you've had a good day and that Keziah gets some peaceful sleep (and that I join her!).

Ooooooh thank you so much , Keziah ! All that typing after your visit for the intralipid - very much appreciated . I'll get a few items I'm running low on and get that big pan out early next week !

Glad the nurse doing your infusion was a kind counterbalance to ludicrous psychiatrist ( a thousand s . Honesty ? Accountability ? pah ). I don't think you and choc reaalise quite how brave you are when you face HCPs etc ... I know quite a few people who've completely given up seeking help even for serious conditions , believe it or not -anyway , you're spurring me on .

Glad you've enjoyed the lovely day too, Keziah < arranges footstool and put out soothing caffeine free > . Hope you don't have side effects from the medications , such as the insomnia you mentioned .

Yes indeed choc , I've been absolutely floating about at Keziah's huge news too , and hoping she's well .

So glad your commutes were better than expected , and you must be very pleased to have got through this week at work . I'm sure you will feel better once things are decided one way or the other .

When I say " blissed out " choc , I mean a sleepier and more pleasant feeling than spaced out , but with similar effects to the memory [hgrin] and mildly euphoric ( part of the physical health condition ). That is a fabulous result with the valerian tea , and the lessened insomnia now the dosage is once a day . Brilliant news .

Am fine but very slowed down physically by the warmer temperatures so have plenty of chores to do this evening ... am so glad of internet , cable tv etc to cheer up boring tasks . The world feels a billion times bigger than it did when I was a teenager

I know what you mean about the world city. Sometimes just seems too big for me . If the world was smaller I'd have emotionally close people physically close to me. I only cope (most of the time) with this fragmentation. I'd like to thrive. [sighs]. Hope you managed your tasks. The weather has certainly been much, much cooler today. Emotionally I'm feeling a bit flat but did at least manage most of my chores.

How's Keziah? Hope you're keeping the anxiety at bay. Keep those feet up .

Went to feed baby coots, baby moorhen, baby ruddy ducks and ducklings today - cheered me up!

A few weeks of stressful mental health appointments coming up. Ahhh!!!!!!

Choc - you are thriving (pma!) and doing lots. Most of chores is a very good statement.

Wish you could in fact be closer to your favourite people , choc, it must be very difficult - I didn't realise you were in that position . I really admire a person who's worked out how to largely cope with their circumstances and I really hope you will indeed feel more able to thrive once you've worked through a little more experimentation ( still ) in this painfully long tussle with MH ... sorry that sounds awful but there are still adjustments and possibly new things to try to help ....You work so very hard at finding ways to improve matters yet I 'm sure there will be things you haven't come across yet . So sorry , garbled as ever .

Really hope you're resting Keziah , not too stressed , and you know we're both sending you positive thoughts and prayers .

No, not garbled city. I love your positivity - I'm just feeling so negative. Nearly didn't come online but knew that'd be me 'withdrawing' so forcing myself to stay . I should be going to sleep but just unsettled. Don't think I'm getting my med timing right.

Keziah, what time did you take your venlafaxine? I'm struggling with feeling exhausted/spaced during the day (sometimes pushing myself on, other times giving up for the sofa/bed) and more awake at night. It started off so promisingly too with the first few days of feeling tired in the early evening. Should I try to take it at night? Generally with the exception of mirtazapine I've generally got on better taking ADs in the morning because of the insomnia effect.

BTW what's pma, Keziah?

A few issues if either of you have any words of wisdom:

1. I applied to work full time, now regretting decision but scared to change my mind because I've been too indecisive and don't want to make mistake;

1. dd keeps saying that she doesn't want me to die until she's really old - don't know where this is coming from but makes me feel like s* because I keep saying I'll try not to, but I'm convinced I will die before she's really old.

1. can't decide about whether to stop CBT. A week's gone and it's a week until next session. The thought of it is making me anxious because I'm struggling with it.

1. can't decide whether I want intrusive thoughts or not . It's on agenda for cbt session but now thinking I don't mind them. Then feel guilty for thinking that I might not want rid of them. Isn't it just self destructive that I recognise it but then don't care?

Is this all perfectly 'normal'? Maybe I should just stop analysing everything but stupidly the CBT is making me more analytical [grrrr]. Another reason why maybe it's not healthy for me. Oh I don't know...

Choc - I used to take venlaflaxine just after evening meal. Occasionally had sleeping tablets - my rule was no more than 2 a week so they worked. I had slow release capsules. When on 150mg I could have had 75mg in am and again after evening meal but didn't.

I think for me anxiety makes insomnia worse. My sleep is all over the place at present - especially early waking (not something that usually happens to me.) So how I am coping is:

• adding up my sleep so when I have a good night then I have "sleep in reserve" for those bad nights
• doing sudoko or reading when can't sleep to distract.

Your concerns sound totally normal choc. I think CBT will initially cause more anxiety and distress, however how would you be without it? I guess if lose it then it is harder to get it back again, so if it was me I would try it for longer and accept it is not easy process.

Keziah, maybe I should try to swap times. Do I go 33 hrs without or take a next dose after only 9 hrs?

I hear you with the CBT. I guess without it I wouldn't be trying so hard.

[choc repeats "I'm totally normal" to self...]

Don't think I will swap. It'll be too stimulating for me in the evening...

Choc - are you on one or two tablets a day? If one two why not try one in am and one in pm? Or more valerian tea to help?

My insomnia is back with early evening "naps", well 5pm time, and on steroids at present which has a stated side effect of insomnia. Stocked up on books, magazines, sudoko and pen by bed. Dh sleeping in spare room so he at least can get sleep. Only problem is I am on strict medication at present, so have to be up by 7am to have 2 lots of meds right now, so no lie ins - grrrr....

Choc - you might not like cbt but it sounds like it is helping.

Sorry Keziah , crossposted ( am so slow ) and didn't see your post about the baby coots / moorhen / ruddy ducks - Yes I thought you had some awful appts coming up , and am keeping everything crossed for you .
Agreeing with Keziah -I was surprised when you classe yourself as coping rather than thriving , choc.

I TOO have a lot of difficulty not withdrawing too much _ and I get most of the day in peace and quiet , so you see how much better than me you are doing !
Many thanks for saying my awful English was not garbled - helps my confidence and I must do some grammar exercises .
Afraid have no relevant experience to offer re : your ADS / insomnia / daytime tiredness and spaciness but really hope you and Keziah find your sleep patterns improve soon - I'm feeling optimistic again but of course for Keziah ,pregnancy and the medication bring their its own difficulties with sleep .
I use "sleep in reserve " , and reading / audiobooks helped me loads - and a fan or a radio tuned to almost audible as cheap alternatives to white noise

Think it was a very logical step for you to apply to work f / t , and logical to panic or to firmly change your mind as the circumstaances around the decision were so fraught . It does sound as if you know you're regretting , rather than nervous , so in the circs I doubt your work will be surprised at a change of mind - and if they were, they'll surely be pleased at your pragmatism ... sorry , I can't express the positive , desirable qualities I'm thinking of but there are several that changing your mind would demonstrate , truly .

The dreaded question from your DD , poor you - I've heard this before on Mumsnet and wonder if a search will yield an old thread ? I hesitate to post this but , although there isn't a sufficiently comforting humanist answer as to dd being able to interact with you when you go elsewhere , hopefully many years hence ,you can emphasise that your love and bond and life togeter is a living thing and will last her whole life , as part of her . ( if you're a crazed spiritualist type like me you could tell her you'll be close to her her and try your best to help the positive forces of the universe [hsmile] help her have a good life ... ahem . Oh yes - and because time is an illusion , you can be "with" her and in the spiritual realm simultaneously ) . You could point to people your dd knows well who lost a parent in later life , or far too young , and ask them to tell dd that it is possible to cope and to be happy and to feel the influence of your parent daily .

Agree strongly with Keziah that the CBT will be hard - I imagine it's the work between sessions , & the thoughts the work is bringing up which you're finding grim ? Tbh , when I was having therapy I was so low yet still felt the painful work was helping in the long run ... no help am I ... when very anxious / low / having med side effects , it's very hard to come to a good instinctive or rational judgement

Aha ...am endlessly analytical and this has been the way I manage emotions - despite it being a tool for potentially diving myself to implode mentally . It's best to strictly ration bouts of analytical thinking when feeling fragile , obviously.

I couldn't manage without some of my negative intrusive thoughts - that is , they come along with the package of usefully intrusive thoughts , which are fewer than the negative ones (!) but the negative ones and are no bother to me nowadays - when I was depressed , they were harder to cope with . I think all your feelings sound incredibly normal ( says she ...).
Many prayers and positive thoughts for you this week , Keziah . Refreshing sleep to you both xx