To find the silence about UNRWA being Hamas hypocritical

[Muthaofcats]

I entirely understand the discomfort seeing images coming out of Gaza; but what I don’t get is those who choose to post about it on social media or campaign expressing their horror but being totally SILENT after October 7th (before Israeli had even responded), after evidence of the sexual violence suffered by those murdered in Israel and now, after finding out that UNWRA who they have all been sending donations to, are actually Hamas who perpetrated the atrocities.

Where is the outrage from these people at UNRWA?

Why are none of these vocal people not screaming from the roof tops at how horrendous this is !?! If it was true you care about humanity, why aren’t you horrified to learn you’ve all been donating to an organisation so closely linked to the rape and murder of innocent civilians ? (And this isn’t the first time unrwa has been linked to Hamas; their HQ is a Hamas building and they’ve famously been linked to training terrorists in their schools / got into hot water for removing the hollocaust from their curriculum)

if you are one of those white privileged women who posts on social media about a cease fire (I’m talking to those of you who have never been to the ME, or studied ME history and never taken up the cause of any of the other global conflicts); why is your outrage so one sided and blinkered ? Why don’t you acknowledge the horrors of the Israeli/ Jewish people too ? If you’re really the virtuous person you purport to be by taking up this cause, why don’t you care ? Or do you believe what Hamas did and are doing and promising to keep doing (murder all Jews) is justified ?

Genuinely find it bewildering.

Just saw this. Another country increasing funding to urnwa

Malaysia announce they are to increase funding to UNRWA in Gaza .

also read today that Spain is going to increase it , unsure whether this is what they announced a few days ago or on top of it as it appeared as breaking news in local newspapers today

I think you would have read what the post was about ~ the poster was claiming that I had said something in a post (that is visible from a few hours ago) that I had not said or even hinted at.

Again, the poster quoted several of my posts on this thread, from today, which said nothing of the sort. That particular word was not mentioned by me whatsoever on any of the posts which the poster directly responded to. The poster took a couple of my words and attempted to make it into something else (that was not even related to that word to begin with)

I think that should be obvious from reading the posts on this thread, from today, as you clearly have done.

Errr if you care to read the thread you will see the derailing certainly didn’t come from me - I have tried on multiple occasions to bring it back to the hypocrisy of people screaming moral outrage on one hand and then ominously silent on the other. The derailing comes from the minority who don’t seem to understand that point and just use it for yet another opportunity to push their own divisive agenda. My mistake is probably to engage with it.

Yep

Replace israel with palestine? From the river to the sea?

Delighted to see people asking genuinely curious questions…

do take a look as there is reliable and verified evidence out there if you’re interested.

Look at the opinion polls which show something like 90% of Palestinians support Hamas and what they did on October 7th. there is also verified footage of people on the streets of Gaza celebrating 7/10 attacks. I wonder if this is why you are seeing it come out that unrwa have direct and indirect links to Hamas and it’s because it’s all so intertwined with society and the fabric of their identity at this point? But perhaps it’s hard to truly get a grasp of any dissent because of the danger in standing out against Hamas. You do see some videos of civilians criticising Hamas stealing all their aid but I often wonder what happened to those people and how brave (or desperate) they must be…

Obviously it’s very hard to know for sure, but don’t forget Hamas were elected by Palestinians and whilst it won’t be children that voted, you have to remember what is taught in schools (see the reports of unrwa’s anti Jewish curriculum and then getting into hot water for removing the Holocaust from the curriculum etc). Look also at the transcripts of the Hamas men calling their families to brag about how many Jews they’d killed and the pride their families responded with.

I think we as westerners are naive to view ‘Hamas’ as rogue actors.

Hamas is ultimately an ideology and you can see how this war is only likely to perpetuate that mentality. I think everyone can agree that the conflict will only serve to radicalise the next generation too.

What is weird about the numbers reported by Palestinian health ministry (Hamas) is that they never include any Hamas fighter in their dead… it’s weird that nobody questions why that is…

one must also acknowledge that even if it’s true that a significant majority of Palestinians support Hamas and 7/10, that still doesn’t mean Israel or anyone else must not abide by international law in their response….

From the river to the sea?

I am sorry, but how did anyone ever do an opinion poll for this?
”Look at the opinion polls which show something like 90% of Palestinians support Hamas and what they did on October 7th.”?

Gaza has been under constant bombing since October 7th with no independent journalists allowed in to do anything other than a military tour with no Palestinians in sight? Who did this poll in Gaza during the war? How many Palestinians did they ask? do you have a link?

“unrwa have direct and indirect links to Hamas”
The last report on this that I saw stated that the UN and US have yet to receive any evidence from Israel to back up these alleged links between UNRWA and Hamas. Has there been verified evidence reported?

Surely they meant replacing Israel with Palestine in this sentence that they were quoting?
”It’s just too simplistic to think that Israel is responsible for Hamas.”

As in it is also too simplistic to think that Palestine is responsible for Hamas?

I have no idea

Hopefully they will clarify for us both!

Literally google will help you answer this. The poll was conducted by a well respected Palestinian research force: The Palestinian Center for Policy Survey and Research (PCPSR)
The poll has been widely reported on by a variety of neutral news sources - but I agree I had similar questions about how they can have gathered such data given the situation

Look at the opinion polls which show something like 90% of Palestinians support Hamas and what they did on October 7th.

An opinion isn't a fact. Where is your evidence for this? When was the poll and who exactly did they ask?

Hamas were elected by Palestinians

Not by the generations of Palestinians today.

you have to remember what is taught in schools

Have you seen what Israelis are being taught in school about the Palestinians?

I have googled and have not found any survey that showed
90% of Palestinians support Hamas and what they did on October 7th.

I would not ask for a link if I hadn’t looked first.

The last poll that I know of was carried out during the last cease fire in December in it 44% in the West Bank said they supported Hamas, up from just 12% in September. In Gaza, the militants enjoyed 42% support, up slightly from 38% three months ago. If it is at 90% now then that is a major jump.

Ok, so the latest survey by Palestinian Center for Policy Survey and Research (PCPSR) doesn’t say that
90% of Palestinians support Hamas and what they did on October 7th.

It states that 85% of respondents haven’t seen any videos of Hamas’ attack on Oct 7th and 93% don’t believe they did any atrocities. Only 481 people polled were from the Gaza Strip, so too small a sample size really at 0.02%. https://pcpsr.org/en/node/963

”It is clear from the findings that believing in the “correctness” of Hamas' decision does not mean support for all acts that might have been committed by Hamas fighters on October 7. The overwhelming majority of respondents say that they have not seen videos from international or social media showing atrocities committed by Hamas members against Israeli civilians that day, such as the killing of women and children in their homes. Indeed, more than 90% believe that Hamas fighters did not commit the atrocities contained in these videos. When asked what is or is not allowed in war, under international humanitarian law, the findings indicate that the vast majority believes that attacking or killing civilians in their homes is not permissible. The majority (except in the Gaza Strip) also believe that taking civilians as hostages or prisoners of war is also not permissible.”

This is context to these findings of

• ”72% of the public believe that Hamas' decision to launch the October 7 attack was correct
• 85% have not seen videos showing atrocities committed by Hamas against Israeli civilians on October 7, and only 7% say Hamas committed atrocities against Israeli civilians.

So, essentially 3/4th of Palestinians support armed resistance, but not atrocities.

This is really evidence of how effective propaganda is within Gaza, if there is a strong belief that Hamas have not done war crimes.

I have seen similar views coming from inside Israel regarding war crimes being committed by IDF.

My apologies, a genuine typo, should be 72% Palestinians in favour of Hamas.

but 72% is still an insane majority in support no!?

https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/poll-shows-palestinians-back-oct-7-attack-israel-support-hamas-rises-2023-12-14/#:~:text=JERUSALEM%2C%20Dec%2013%20(Reuters),respected%20Palestinian%20polling%20institute%20found.

@MercanDede yes the report is much more nuanced. And there is evidence of dwindling support for Hamas before 7/10. Gaza war: how representative is Hamas of ordinary Palestinians? (theconversation.com)
My main question was why aren't civilian Palestinians joining the armed militias? And why aren't the armed militia's conscripting them? Lack of support? Lack of equipment (unlikely as presumably guns etc. would become available as fighters were killed)?

No, not in that context at all! I did quote the poster and it was in reference to her post!

It’s not insane when you read from the poll that Hamas has also convinced 93% of Palestinians that they haven’t committed any atrocities/war crimes.

Brainwashed into thinking terrorists are freedom fighters. It’s what propaganda does to a captive population.

Thanks @MercanDede for clarifying that. I think it’s really important to make sure that any survey results are reported correctly and within the context of what was actually asked, who asked it, and how the sample was obtained. The phrasing of questions and even the order in which they are placed can lead to different results. It looks as though this has been framed as meaning something very different than what it actually does.