What is going on on the left? Gaza/Israel conflict

[Notsuretoputit]

I am left wing, I wouldn’t consider myself anything other. I absolutely support Israel, have no problem understanding and supporting Zionism, and am absolutely horrified by the rising levels of anti-semitism in the UK.

It is to my despair that much of that anti-semitism is being perpetrated by those on the left. People I like, consider friends, who are tolerant and who I would never, ever have considered racist or anti-Semitic are plastering their Facebook walls with pro-Hamas TikTok propaganda. These are not teenagers naively believing propaganda, these are people who’ve spend years active in (left wing) politics.

I’ve read a lot in recent weeks about the far left’s historical problem with anti-semitism, but how can it be that nice, friendly, socially conscious people are indulging in this insane display of anti-semitism? Actively showing support for a terrorist organisation? Refusing to believe Hamas is guilty of any crimes, or that they have an excellent propaganda machine currently in operation. What is going on?

Yes well it's not up to Biden is it.

what would Israel do if USA stopped military aid? so I think the USA should have a say. You can’t have it both ways

Israel clearly could survive without U.S. assistance, which constitutes just 3 percent of its state budget today and less than 1 percent of its GDP, a fraction of its value when it began.

So Israel shouldn’t accept the billons of dollars in aid? They can say no if they don’t want USA to be involved in their decision making? Biden should be using the processes he set up himself to check if weapons being sold to a state are not being used for war crimes. He’s not done this so far…

https://www.vox.com/world-politics/2023/11/18/23966137/us-weapons-israel-biden-package-explained

This is a good article which explains that no US aid would be painful for Israel but not insurmountable. However, there is no way the USA will abandon Israel - it needs the State as much as it needs them.

https://archive.fo/5RFzf#selection-1213.0-1213.187

Here's a truck with some water bottles in it. Unfortunately the IDF soldier is also with it Footage appears to show Israeli troops destroying property in Gaza - as IDF says it has 'taken action' | World News | Sky News

And at the moment 50 lorries are getting through at Rafah. So absolutely miles off 200 water tankers. Rafah is the only way in or out so you'd need 200 tankers plus food.

Then the aid agencies say its impossible to move stuff because of the intensity of Israeli bombing.

It's not workable as things are.

What's your definition of left wing? Israel is so right wing that Farage could be at least a centrist!
These 3 Govts calling for a ceasefire Australia, Canada, New Zealand back efforts towards Gaza ceasefire -statement | Reuters

@Hiddenmnetter "Humans require around 2L/day (I imagine they could survive on less but let’s use the ideal)."

I'd like to see you manage on 2l of water a day for 2 months. People don't just need water to not die of thirst. People need it to cook food, wash themselves, wash clothes, prepare baby formula and lots of other things.

There is aid and also buying of bombs etc.

Aid might not be necessary- but if you are going to accept the aid you are going to have at least listen to the views of those providing the aid? Whatever the benefit to USA itself.

Biden has not used processes he set up to vet for war crimes before selling weapons to Israel. USA have asked so caution - as they have a duty not to sell weapons to those committing war crimes.

Well here's some good old 'left' antisemitism. From the far-left's favourite and acceptable Jew, Dan Finkelstein! Interestingly he's using his new slogan repetitively, because he knows a few tweets is all it takes for his social media foot soldiers to parrot it into an instant trope. But apparently he's just anti-Zionist....

Also, we need a new boiler soon so really wish I knew some of this mysterious Jewish billionaire class.

https://twitter.com/PostLeftWatch/status/1734413310383239288

@etmoiandme if you're going to quote him, at least get his name right.

It's Norman Finkelstein.

Oh pardon me.

Some interesting developments, not strictly speaking relevant to the original thread topic.

Firstly reports that Qatar is no longer wanting to host senior Hamas figures and that they will be moved to Algeria:
https://twitter.com/gaza_report/status/1734664784711221389

Secondly that Saudi and the UAE are threatening to stop aid to Gaza if a clear two state plan isn't implemented.
https://twitter.com/academic_la/status/1734662390338494469

Neither confirmed yet in MSM but starting to give a bit of a picture of what things might look like beyond the active conflict stage.

Ooh I wonder why Algeria?

Hamas has links with Algeria. I think they have an office there or something.

Netanyahu is against a two state solution is he not? Does that mean Israel is against a two state solution?

Another souce saying Qatar stating they can't guarantee their safety from Mossad. That might just be a face-save though as they perhaps can't be bothered with the hassle of hosting any more.

I get the impression that Biden's administration will bring real pressure to bear on Netanyahu with this, judging by the noises they are already making.

Then there's the rift developing in the Hamas leadership as Sinwar wants to focus on the war, the others want to co-operate with the PA with a view to joint Palestinian leadership - but how will that go down with the Israelis?
Interesting times.

https://twitter.com/AdamAlbilya/status/1734659469521367136

@SomeCatFromJapan do you think the second tweet could be because Biden said today that Netanyahu doesnt want a two state solution?
I think it's the first time it's been said openly since the war started by the US that Netanyahu opposes them in this regard

@SomeCatFromJapan just seen your above post

@Parkingt111 I'm honestly not sure. Edited to add, sounds like I'm contradicting myself a bit, but I'm speculating based on what I'm seeing at present.

Well at least it's out there now, that Netanyahu clearly doesn't want a 2 state solution.

People on these boards even today were saying that Hamas are against a ceasefire and a 2 state solution, as though the Israeli government is in favour of both things. Frustrating to listen to.

@SomeCatFromJapan so moving them hasn't been a demonstration of Qatar's prick of conscious where Hamas are concerned then?
More to keep them out of harms way?

Or do you think it's a reaction to UEA and Saudi getting involved?

They are interesting developments though. I have said on the other thread too that the idea that Qatar (however good at negotiations they are) house Hamas doesn't exactly make them neutral.

They are interesting developments though. I have said on the other thread too that the idea that Qatar (however good at negotiations they are) house Hamas doesn't exactly make them neutral.

Aye - Hamas leaders and US air bases both in one tiny country. They really like to be everyone's buddy. They irritate the crap out of Saudi/UAE though.

I'm finding it hard to guess underlying motivations.

I thought this was a thread about the left

Nah. It never has been about that. Just an excuse for some stirring up of political angst using Hamas/Israel as an excuse.