Channel 4 News report into IDF evidence for Gaza hospital bombing

[Mammillaria]

This was released yesterday but doesn't seem to have been given much coverage, possibly because it's not been able to draw any conclusions.

x.com/Channel4News/status/1715437877604049094?s=20

I had found the evidence presented by the IDF to be fairly convincing, so I found this an unsettling watch (even though it does not prove that they were responsible).

I expect I shall get criticism from those who have claimed from the start that the IDF are liars, and more criticism from those who see posting this as siding with the terrorist narrative.

I'm still struggling to fully comprehend the enormity and nuances of this conflict.

Palestinians have lived in Gaza long before Hamas. If Israel had ever wanted to get rid of Palestinians in Gaza it didn't need Hamas's help.

If no Palestinians are able to live in Gaza after Hamas is removed, that is Hamas' fault.

@Mammillaria I'm now skeptical that even if they do find definitive proof that the audio recording was fabricated or something else that proves the IDL did target the hospital, it wouldn't get much coverage in the mainstream UK press.

You are right. There will be no coverage. It The reason it’s being denied is very obvious. It’s a war crime. What country wants to be connected to a country that has just committed a war crime with weapons and money that they have supplied?! Best to just deny it happened and hope it can be swept under the carpet. That’s why the Israeli minister quickly deleted his tweet and god knows if those priests (who testified to say that they had been warned 3 times that the hospital was to be bombed) will be alive next week. But please - there is nothing to see here!!!!!

To summarise your reply:

@WildBactrian this makes me so angry and couldn't be further from the truth. Did
You know that the Palestinians have rejected every single peace agreement put in front of them? Every single one. Now go find out how many israel have rejected and come back to me. There could be peace right now if the PLO, Hamas and all the terrorist organisations that have run Gaza and the West Bank weren't so bloodthirsty.

Ayegazumba, Israel have killed far more Palestinian every single year that Israel was created. I cannot believe how anyone could defend such cruelty to their fellow human beings. No one has suffered like the Palestinian people. What bad luck to be a kid born in Palestine. Defenders of IDF at the moment look into your cold heart and try and find your humanity for fellow human beings.

@Chaiandkaafee
Speaking of deleting tweets and things not making it onto the news, did you hear about the fuel and medical aid Hamas stole from UNWRA last week? UNWRA tweeted about it but it suddenly disappeared. Weird, eh?!

Anyway, I wonder if any of you guys on here will ever acknowledge that the bombing of the hospital (car park) was by someone other than Israel once the proof is verified, and that the casualties were nowhere near the stated 500. Or maybe you'll keep doubling down and blaming Israel because it's easier than admitting you were wrong? The amount of people on here who are also so utterly convinced they know more than experts is genuinely hilarious. Not just about this, about anything Israel-related.

Absolutely ridiculous.

The charter you quoted seems to be from Hamas. I read all 33 pages of Fatah chapter and is not there. On Palestinian state chapter even is mentioned that "who had resided in Palestine until the beginning of the Zionist invasion" is considered to be Palestinian. So is not about Jews and Muslim. I don't support Hamas , indeed I think Hamas ruling one day over Palestine will be bad news . I don't like any state to be religious like Israel and I wouldn't like Palestine to be an Islamic state either. Many Palestinians are Christians and there were many Jewish living there before. Jerusalem is the most sacred place for orthodox Christians and the key holder of Jesus tomb is Muslim. The land doesn't belong to people from one religion. Zionism has to come to an end. Let's wish the atrocities from both sides will stop and Palestinians will be able to have their own state and manage to live in peace with Israel.

I saw that tweet on here.

I’d question why if it got deleted

FYI, from the attached article:
....Distel Atbaryan assumed her position shortly after the establishment of the new government. However, the primary objective of her office, which is to enhance Israel’s public image, has been marred by persistent turmoil....

......But when Hamas initiated a conflict with Israel on Saturday, resulting in the tragic loss of over 1,200 innocent lives, the Public Diplomacy Ministry immediately mobilized its resources and efforts.

Before Shabbat concluded, the ministry obtained Hamas footage and promptly initiated its dissemination across various social media platforms. Simultaneously, it harnessed the support of a vast network of influential figures worldwide, encompassing personalities from Hollywood and even renowned sports players, to amplify the reach of these messages.

“We opened a lot of groups with thousands of influencers worldwide, and we send them our key messages,” Distel Atbaryan told The Jerusalem Post. “Most of the time, we work under the radar and don’t take credit for our work.”

https://m.jpost.com/israel-news/article-767613

Maybe they could put boots on the ground so that they could more accurately target Hamas? I suppose it takes a bit more courage than sending drones and missiles over.

Starving children isn't exactly heroic either. Cutting off power to a sick baby in an incubator, that will be a proud story to tell the GC.

Does any Israeli thinks this will make them safer in the long run? Will the current experiences make Palestinian children grow up wanting a peaceful life with Israel or will it make them long for revenge? Unless of course the ultimate aim is genocide of Palestinians.

@BelleHathor 100% - it’s clear to see.

Maybe they could put boots on the ground so that they could more accurately target Hamas?

As far as I know, this is what 350,000 Israeli soldiers are sitting just outside Gaza waiting for.

Hamas has 30,000 soldiers on the ground, so I think many many more Palestinians will die in the ground operation.

I’m sure they’ll all suddenly turn back into civilians the moment they die though, and appear in UN reports as such.

Does any Israeli thinks this will make them safer in the long run? Will the current experiences make Palestinian children grow up wanting a peaceful life with Israel or will it make them long for revenge?

I believe there’s unanimity in Israel that Hamas must be destroyed. I don’t think there’s unanimity for what’s after that. I suppose the long term goal is to make sure that Palestinian children aren’t able to hurt Jews, even if they want to.

@ayegazumba - I'm not joining in to start a bunfight. Everyone has a right to vocalise their outrage, but to answer your question there is plenty of literature to read through on many reputable websites that backs up the refusal of peace deals by both Israel and Palestine. The House of Commons Library online for example, has comprehensive documents.

This a long standing, bloody, brutal conflict and there will only be more death and destruction. I could be typing up posts all day about my thoughts. I won't agree with what others have said and they won't agree with me but but my opinion is just that - my opinion.

There seems to be so much vitriol on these threads and in general - on social media/new channels etc. It just makes you wonder sometimes about the state of humanity.

Yes they are sitting there but as I said safer for them to send the missiles over.

I suppose the long term goal is to make sure that Palestinian children aren’t able to hurt Jews, even if they want to. Chilling.

@ayegazumba you are venting a lot of anger when someone posts something you don't agree with?

Hamas have committed heinous acts but in the same breath so have the IDF - similar acts in fact. One does not offset the other, however, it is not so wrong to think you can condemn both for acts of barbarity. Re some of your comments and in particular the 'beheaded' babies - this has been disproven on so many accounts and 'They removed babies from wombs' - this was a report from the Lebanon massacre in 1982. There are resources to actual fact check. Media propaganda is far reaching and false narratives make for more anger and hate.

It’s so awful to see it here

Historically groups and nations have tried to hide the atrocities they committed. On October 7th Hamas made sure to capture, share and celebrate them. Yet, worldwide people are still questioning whether they happened. All over the world people are making excuses for the massacre, tearing down images of the kidnapped and harassing Jewish communities. It seems Hamas knew that the toxic hatred of the Jewish people would allow them to justify and ignore a massacre

@ayegazumba the evolution of technology and ease of use of video footage being captured by mobile phones, gopros etc has meant a lot of attacks have been filmed and live streamed even…….it’s going to be a lot more
common now. I don’t think this attack is unique in that sense……the Australian guy (I can’t remember his name - pretty sure he was Australian) live streamed his attack in the mosque. There have been many other instances around the world over the past years. I’m not sure we can ever be prepared for the gross act of filming or live streaming the attacks but I suspect its about to become very common, sadly.

Is that why Israel are targeting journalists and their families? So they can try and hide the atrocities that they are committing or do you think there is another reason?

I’m finding the posts along those lines deeply troubling.

Why? What happened in Israel isn't being ignored no matter what that poster says. The US are funneling money into Israel. They've sent war ships as have the UK. How many leaders have gone over there to hug the Israeli pm? Its not being ignored at all. Israel have gotten the green light to blow the shit out of 2.2million people while starving them.

People questioning whether it happened? That's happening the other way around too. People are making excuses for Israels massacre. People are making fun of Palestinians being blown to pieces. All the rest that she mentioned is going both ways.

It's awful that people exist that will do the above but that's just the way the world is but it isn't running one way only like that poster is claiming.