Why isn't depressing seated racism on MN challenged more?

[FloweryCurtainTwitcher]

So. I am not black but I am not white. My great grandparents (as far as I know) were EE Jewish, black African , white African, Irish, North African and white British x3 . One of my parents was born and raised in West Africa until age 15ish.

As a child growing up in white rural England I was bullied about my big lips (they are luscious- no lip filler required here) and my thick black hair that has a definite kink (Jewish or African- who knows? Irish maybe? ). I didn't really think about my ethnicity until I grew up and reflected a bit more about it. But I did know that attacking people because of how they looked was wrong.

I find the subcultural of racism on MN unacceptable. The threads this weekend about Meghan Markle are indicative `(people claiming they are not racists they just dont like her- for lots of ridiculous reasons- basically she is an independent black woman )

I believe that we should all challenge deeply embedded racism constantly regardless of our ethnicity. Not just the National Front type stuff which is explicit but the deep societal implicit racism which underpins our society.

So why does no-one ever call it out on MN- why are so many posts with inherent racist views allowed to go unchallenged? Why isnt every post with racist undertones receiving hundreds of reports?

Is it pointless? Is MN like the MET police and institutionally racist ?

(5 years of commuting through elephant and castle- everyday saw MET police pull someone over. ONCE only were they not black- so 1000 approx stops- only 1 white)

I’m taking note of all of the highly suspect usernames and clearly fake posts that ultimately always turn out to be goady and racist posters.

@WakeMeUpWhenTheyHaveGone m
I'm here?

I think you misunderstood a post I highlighted in bold thinking that I actually spoke them.

Easy to confuse as my reply to that pile of shit was deleted, no doubt the person who I quoted reported it.

@DeeCeeCherry I didn't say that, I was quoting a PP, but my reply to them was deleted 😡 that's why I put it in bold (those aren't my words!)

I did thanks.
You’ll have since seen my 11:03 post that I directed to you.

@DeeCeeCherry @WakeMeUpWhenTheyHaveGone

Found the original post where I quoted it. It was a over a week ago so don't remember who the poster was but I assume it's one of the several deleted comments now in that part of the thread

So just because someone isn’t a fan of MM that makes them racist? That makes no sense.

I have heard a lot of people criticise both H and M - for going on Oprah, the treatment of certain family members etc. Yes there will be racists out there whose views of M are influenced by bigotry but I honestly believe that the majority of people who criticise are critical of both of them.

Labelling them racist and discounting the reasons they give for their dislike of them just because you don’t agree is very presumptive.

Erm…I don’t agree that I’m moving away from the issue of racism.

You seem to be fixated on the fact that I mentioned sun loungers. I mentioned sun loungers in order to illustrate the selfish obsession with sun loungers that most paler skinned people appear to have in order to obtain darker skin tones when they are holidaying in hot climates or when the weather gets hotter in the UK. I mentioned sun loungers and tanning to query why some racist pale-skinned people who hate brown-skinned people, would risk their health to have darker skin similar to the tones of brown-skinned people.

You also ignored the fact that I also queried why some of these racist people risk their health to obtain fuller lips and bigger peachy bottoms, which most Black women have. I said I was baffled and my post was littered with question marks.
So, please non-Black people disingenuously loitering in this Black space - please share why you feel the need to risk your health to look like Black people and delve in cultural appropriation when you hate us so much???

Thanks for clarifying NippyWoowoo.
I agree that it’s a minefield keeping track of the genuine posters and replies amongst the pile of shit on here.

No.
Racist people are labelled racist due to the racist things that they say, do and type. You do not have to explicitly call some someone a Black or chant monkey noises to be considered a racist.

Do you know what micro aggressions are?
Are you Black/of African descent?

Is there anyone else who is not Black/of African descent who wants to post on the Black Mumsnetters Board and tell Black people what is racist and what is not racist!????
WTF!???

Read the whole fucking thread, the fucking room or fuck the hell off!!!
Clearly, the shit that Black people have to deal with day in day out for centuries is not your lived experience!

*You do not have to explicitly call some someone a Black (enter offensive expletive) or chant monkey noises to be considered a racist.

What makes no sense is the fact that some people seem unable to grasps the simple, yes simple fact, that a lot of the negativity that Meghan gets receives is because she is half black. You know because racism does exist. Is that so hard for some to understand? Not all of it will be based on her colour, no, but a heck of a lot will.

I think that one thing that makes so many of the comments about Meghan suspect for racism is the intensity of the criticism and the fact that so many posters use dodgy sources for their "factual" comments. The comments themselves may not be racist on their face, but clearly are evidence of intense dislike or even hate far in excess of whatever purported missteps she may have taken.

And clearly many are blatantly misogynistic as in "she stole our prince." I do think that there is a strong intersection of racism and misogyny in much of the commentary about Meghan on MN, some of which posters have clearly picked up from other, often very questionable, social media.

I think that one thing that makes so many of the comments about Meghan suspect for racism is the intensity of the criticism and the fact that so many posters use dodgy sources for their "factual" comments. The comments themselves may not be racist on their face, but clearly are evidence of intense dislike or even hate far in excess of whatever purported missteps she may have taken

^^ This.

It's been going on since she appeared on the scene, even before they were engaged. The level of hate and vitriol is off the scale.

The goalposts are moved again and again in the demands of the anti Meghans.. To be honest, it's just as bad now as it was when she became known, because the pool of possible stuff to criticise has grown smaller. This incenses these people, so they have to harp back to her engagement dress, Oprah, that time in the Church, the time she was stood on the balcony and turned her head. It is pathetic.

Because there is less opportunity to lay into her, they have to focus on her clothes, her figure, whether she smiles, does she smile too much, too litte, the fact they were low key on this trip which they all wanted, then guess what... being low key was a total insult to the Queen. How dare they not show their children, how dare her daughter have a birthday on the same weekend of the jubilee... and so it goes on. Please do not say this is normal dislike, for the well known ones on here doing this, it has to be racism.

I like to give people the benefit of the doubt where possible but I refuse to do so anymore because the dislike of her (and him by default) is beyond reason.

They've left, they're happy, they don't cost you anything (except your sanity) they are making a life for themselves... just do one with your incessant vitriolic sniping.

However I do agree that comments criticising baby Lili are sinister.

How people can nit pick and comment negatively on a beautiful innocent baby girl is beyond me and smacks of racism.

@WakeMeUpWhenTheyHaveGone

I’m afraid I think you are clouding the issue. There’s no necessary link between the racists being discussed and people who tan or do certain cosmetic surgeries/procedures. There is a place for a discussion on the appropriation of black cultures but you’re trying to assume those racist to MM are the same people who are appropriating black culture, and you’re also trying to presume that all people who tan on holiday are doing the same. It’s a generalisation that doesn’t make sense and isn’t really linked to this discussion.

Well said.

Spot on.

You aren't being bullied.

You are being told to engage your critical thinking skills.

Unless you personally know someone in the public eye you cannot state that they are a megalomaniac.

So tell us how you know the Duchess of Sussex to state this?

Otherwise you are just relaying the racist and sexist comments you have read elsewhere.

The critical thinking part is fine although questionable coming from someone who thinks suntans and bagging early sunbeds on holiday beds had anything to do with it.

Being told I’m an ugly hateful troll who doesn’t understand their own Afro Latino heritage is just disgusting, all that based on the fact I’m not a fan of MM.

It’s called an opinion btw.

So it’s okay for others to speak to me like that about my heritage and calling me hateful based on that, I’d say that’s quite hateful and bullying as well as so hypocritical.

The bullying happening here is if you’re black and don’t like MM you’re treated like shit by some, told to read up and educate yourself on your heritage - nasty.

Its a very hard pill for some to swallow that you can have black heritage and dislike MM based on your personal perception. And then the phrase ‘critical thinking’ gets uttered by those unable to separate their emotions from facts.

For some at school, I was never black enough. Some Africans disliked Jamaicans, some Jamaicans disliked Africans. Some disliked me because I was neither. It’s very sad and is evidenced on this thread, if you dare to have a different opinion you’re shouted down.

I do not share your view about being shouted down. Posters, of course will have different opinions, it happens. Fair enough you do not take to Meghan, but to go on and describe her in term that you chose to use, on this board where poc are regularly having to defend themselves against all sorts of accusations, and racism, is to put it mildly, incomprehensible.