The current state of MN and how do I stop reading?

[Westpoint]

I actually don't know where to start......

But WTF is happening recently? I mean I know AIBU isn't for the faint of heart but the pile on's have become ridiculous. For the experienced posters the ignore tactic works ok but the vitriol for no bloody reason whatsoever just kills the thread.

Yet I keep on reading?

I have a pretty full life but when I log on I do tend to come here and I'm often left with a really bad taste in my mouth.

Why are people just so combative these days?

I do realise the futility in posting this. Maybe I just need a massive boot up the arse (I'm sure I do).

What do people get from being so nasty?

It actually just makes me really sad. Yes, that's my problem I get it. It's just all so stupid, petty and a waste of everyone's time.

Anyway, that's my rant. Prepared to be unnecessarily flamed (well, I'm not actually, it will hurt my feelings but it's going to happen isn't it? I mean, I could post that puppies are cute and fluffy but some miserable cunt will come along along and tell me that their arse's stink, they shit all over their school run and because they are allergic NO-ONE should enjoy them).

This place really has become a victim of it's own success.

I think I might be out but it's hard to let go. I joined 15 years ago!

Thank you so much I just couldn't work it out, googled and came up with Magnetic Resonance Angiography 😂

I agree.
Though for me the worst are the “out of touch” posts/comments.

Someone whining about having to cancel their Disney+ subscription because they are having to ‘get by’ on a 150k a year salary.

People raging over their mortgages when I’m paying three times their mortgage rate to rent a house I have no security in, forever living in fear of being evicted (I have been the victim of a section 21 before and it almost cost me my life) and have no hope of being able to get a mortgage for the foreseeable future/ever.

People complaining that their kids want them to help with childcare and they don’t feel they should watch their grandkids because they’ve “done their child rearing” yet their kids remember them being more than happy to take any help with both hands when they were small and it was offered to them.

People being blindly transphobic that have never had to face the reality of what it’s like to be trans or love someone who is trans and watch them struggle.
Try watching your child tell you they don’t want to live anymore because they will always be hated for being themselves and don’t feel anyone will ever love them, it’s heartbreaking and harrowing and I wouldn’t wish it on anyone.

People taking whatever rags tell them as gospel, believing that people on benefits are raking in in/thinking kids should starve rather than the two child cap lifted etc.
Having had to my food shop this week using Klarna, this one particularly enrages me and I’d love to have them come live my ‘extravagant’ life on benefits for just one month and see how they feel then.

It’s the amount of punching down and lack of grip on reality that I see here that frustrates me the most, and heaven forbid you try to point it out, you get jumped on.
I get around this by saying my piece but never reading any responses, however I can tell when I’m being attacked by the amount of notifications I get that are clearly argumentative replies.

I’d recommend either stepping away (I will be doing so in the New Year as one of my resolutions as I don’t believe the majority of people on here will ever change and it’s not worth the effect on my mental health to keep trying) or doing the same as I mentioned above, get your replies out but don’t engage with any responses, ignore them.
Don’t waste your energy or time.

Though for me the worst are the “out of touch” posts/comments.

I am trying to word this constructively so apologies if I get the tone wrong here.

I think some of the examples you give, particularly around finances, are a good example of where it is actually really difficult on here now. It does feel sometimes as though unless someone is literally on the bones of their arse that posting anything about money has become a complete no-go. People should be able to post about things that concern them, whatever their income level, without being castigated for it.

It’s not just money. So many threads feel like a competitive “I have it worse than you do, so shut up”.

@LaserPumpkin I was just coming on to say the same thing about of touch comments, I don't agree with @ColourThief on this point (but I do on other points). I've seen reasonable OPs being piled on for being tone deaf because others are less well off financially. Or posters mentioning something about their lives and being attacked, sometimes on fairly lighthearted threads. For example someone might say they hate the winter and are a bit down cos they used to have a winter sun holiday and can't anymore, or that they can't decide to buy the 5 bed house in the country v the 3 bed house in the city. These are all fair points, just cos someone out there has never had a winter holiday or afforded a house isn't really relevant.

What particularly irritates me when posters shut down discussions citing the COL, is that they miss the point that there have always been people who are poor. Single mums, people with caring responsibilities, people with disabilities etc. The concept of a person being less well off is not a new one. It's just possibly new to that poster who now can't stand that they are that person now, when 20 years ago they were enjoying holidays and nights out and never censored themselves out of sensitivity towards those less well off.

@ColourThief but your ‘out of touch’ is other people’s lived reality. Neither one is better than the other.

Oh god the irony in the contrast between your first sentence and the second.

“Mnhq could make an excellent start by deleting anti-trans threads before they really get going, because it seems that trans people are thoroughly hated on Mumsnet yet mnhq have a real aversion to actually deleting posts and threads that are degrading and hateful towards trans people.”

One person’s terrorist is another person’s freedom fighter.

With freedom of speech you’ve got to take the rough with the smooth. I for one am extremely grateful to the moderators of this place for not “being kind”.

I’ve been here almost 20 years (with various names) and was a prolific poster and thread-starter, but FWR killed that. I post rarely now. The viciousness and pile-ons are exhausting, even if you do have an interest in the topic. I simply don’t see a need for it and I’ve seen the behaviour repeated to many other posters, so it isn’t something about me.

God, the anti trans threads make me feel sick. Does anyone on here support them?

The only reason I’m still here is l currently have an illness that keeps me housebound. I really want to get off this site, but l can’t do much at the moment.

I suppose it depends on how you define anti trans.
Believing that people cannot change sex is not anti- trans. Unless you think the Supreme Court is also anti-trans.
But this is a much-discussed subject so I won't labour the point.

I was attempting a reductio ad absurdum. Sex realism is not “anti trans”.

Beautifully put - I’m not at the level of buying 5 houses in nice areas, ( but do rent a nice house in a very nice area) but I accept that some people are for whatever reason - inheritance, highly paid jobs etc

This thread has ironically encouraged me to look at more threads on here and take note of the nasty posters (I might even get brave enough to call them out!) But actually most of them do get called out, which is encouraging. Maybe if enough people politely tell them their posts are unhelpful and unpleasant things might get better?

I've no problem at all with people sharing things about their own lives they find difficult. Just because from my perspective it might look like their lives are easy, I think imposing a bar for acceptable levels of hardship before we can complain is a slippery slope, and before long you get someone telling you that at least you have a roof etc.
Where it goes wrong for me is when the complaint is coupled with a finger point elsewhere. "I work and can't afford such and such ...my neighbour on benefits has it better...its immigrants..bla di bla..." because it inevitably leads to arguments about that rather than practical advice.
I think raising your issue (however small) is fine, and if I've anything I think helpful to add, I'm happy to respond to the "I can't afford botox this month, what are my alternatives" posts without huffing and puffing about people not being able to afford food. Because thats a different issue for a different thread.

I find it rather extraordinary that Justine has admitted that there is a massive problem with the 'vibe' on MN these days and that moderation will be amended to tighten up on this, requesting that we use the report button more....and this news is hidden on a thread with a bland title on a section that a lot of posters have hidden.

@JustineMumsnet are you serious about turning this around? Are you planning changes to the talk guidelines or a general forum announcement?

I used to start threads all the time, mostly about education. I've almost given up now. Threads that would previously have got a lot of discussion (e.g. the curriculum review) just die on their arse.

I reported a bully yesterday and got deleted. Hopefully they're on it more.

I find that MNHQ will generally delete unpleasant posts when I report them. What I'd be really interested to know @JustineMumsnet is whether when this happens the team checks the poster's history to see how often they've been deleted for the same offence and whether persistent offenders are warned/banned? Because if not, there's no real disincentive to stop. Likely the poster doesn't even know why they've been deleted so what's the point?

A lot of the time a poster won't even know that they have been deleted.

I started a thread about Justine's post to draw more attention to it.

I'm assuming that given that she posted it on an open forum she intended for it to be read.

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/_chat/5445143-justine-says-mn-is-too-mean-and-will-tighten-up-moderation

I do miss Britain from the 00s as a whole, not just MN. MN is just a reflection of a larger trend happening here and around the world. We're all turning into angry dickheads. I suppose it's down to a deep-seated fear of the future. Whatever it is, it's noticeable both online and irl.

unhiding the Report button may help here?

Yes I'm glad you've raised this.

For years I've been suggesting to MNHQ that if they want to make moderation easier for themselves with regards to nipping things in the bud before they get out of control, any deleted posts should prompt an auto-generated notice to that person's message box on Mumsnet.

Not to their email address that they may or may not see for a few days, if at all.

This would be especially helpful if someone is feeling a bit angry, or emotional because it gives them the chance to log out and cool off.

Yep. All of the above.

Yes, I’ve flicked back through a thread before to try to follow a conversation to find that one of my posts have been deleted and I’ve not even been able to remember what the post said, let alone have any inkling as to why it was deleted.

There is a bot or AI or whatever that starts a new post on AIBU every day, under a user name with 3 random words together. The AIBU is always an open ended question usually provocative or divisive about society and behaviour and the OP never gives personal or specific examples. I click in for a scroll most days to AIBU and I've noticed this, I find it hard to see how MNHQ haven't copped on. Almost every thread recently has an early post calling it out, but the threads stay standing.