For stopping a man taking his daughter in swimming pool changing room?

[Anotsolittlemermaid]

I am a regular user but changed name for this as I’ve spoken to a few people about it so it could be outing. I apologise it’s quite a long post but couldn’t cut it much shorter as context is needed.

I have a monthly subscription to a gym with a swimming pool that’s part of a hotel, on a Wednesday there is women’s aqua aerobics from 7-8 then adult only time from 8pm till 10pm.

Yesterday evening I got to the pool at about 8.15 after aqua aerobics and there was a man who was just arriving at the pool with his young daughter who was about 4/5.

He was being quite annoying letting her disrupt people by jumping in where people were swimming, getting in the path of other swimmers, throwing floats used for aqua across the pool and he was picking her up and throwing her.
The little girl was shrieking and screaming and a few people gave annoyed looks over at him but he carried on getting in everyone’s way.

In the end after about 20 minutes a member of staff came over and asked the man to leave the pool as children’s hours had finished, he argued a bit saying he was trying to tire his daughter out so she would sleep but the staff member was firm and said there had been two sessions of children’s hours for 2 hours at a time earlier in the day that he had been welcome to use but people who wanted to swim properly deliberately avoided them and came later.

The women’s changing room was still busy after aqua and it was mostly women swimming in the pool who had stayed after aqua to continue swimming. The changing rooms are right next to the pool so you can hear when people are in them. The men’s seemed empty but the man and his daughter were also hotel guests so he could have wrapped a towel around her and gone back to the room. He had towels and a hotel robe for himself with him.

When he got out of the pool he put the robe on but took his daughter by the hand and walked towards the women’s changing room obviously intending to go in.

The changing room is open plan with only one cubicle, it had 8 showers, 4 are in cubicles but the other 4 are open, when I had undressed before swimming the changing room had been busy with lots of women using the showers and changing after aqua, there were obviously a few women still in there as I could hear chatting and the hairdryer going.

I had been swimming lengths at the edge of the pool opposite the changing room entrance so when I saw him heading to the women’s I called out to him “sorry but that’s the ladies and it’s busy, you can take your daughter to the men’s I’m sure it’s empty or can you not just put your towel around her and go to your room?”

The man glared at me and said he wasn’t taking his daughter into a room where men might be undressing and he had taken her into changing rooms before where no one had ever had a problem.

I said it was more likely they did have a problem but didn’t feel comfortable saying so, I was getting angry at this point so I said I’d go and get the member of staff to see what he said.

The man obviously knew the staff member wasn’t going to approve this and started ranting about how awful it was that first his daughter had been asked to leave the pool and now he couldn’t even get her dry and dressed again because of busy bodies sticking their oar in. Another women who was swimming and had overheard backed me up that it was completely inappropriate and no one over 8 is allowed in the opposite sex changing room. The man wasn’t happy but wrapped his daughter in the towel and took her his hotel room as I’d suggested. As he was wearing the robe I have no idea if he had planned to use the women’s changing room to shower and get changed himself or not.

I hate confrontation but the other women thanked me for saying something, I spoke to the staff member when I’d finished my swim and he agreed that the man should have used the men’s changing room where there was a free cubicle. He said he’d been cheeky enough bringing his daughter during adult hours when he’d been told earlier he wouldn’t be allowed when he’d asked about it.

I assumed most people would agree with me but my friend said I was completely out of order, she said the little girl was the one who was important and it was much safer and more appropriate for her to get changed in the ladies, she said most mums would be understanding about a father bringing his daughter in and could have got changed under a towel, when I mentioned he had also been in the pool and was possibly planning on getting undressed himself she said “well no one has to look if they don’t want to”
I didn’t want to keep discussing it with her as we had argued before years ago about her bringing her 11 year old son and nephews into ladies changing rooms and I realised she was the wrong person to mention it to.

I also mentioned it to DP and he said that I was right to stop the man going in the ladies but he equally feels uncomfortable when men bring their daughters in, he also swims and said the previous week a little girl had been running naked round the changing room whilst her dad was looking at his phone and he would never allow his daughter to do that as you just don’t know what other men are thinking.

There are no family changing rooms as it’s not really a kids pool with it being attached to a gym and it’s mainly set up for members comfort. The majority of people who bring kids are hotel guests who have rooms.

I don’t feel IABU really but after hearing my friend and DP’s opinion I just wondered what others thought about it. Was I wrong to suggest the man takes his daughter into the men’s changing room? On this occasion a cubicle was free but if it hadn’t been then do some people really think that women should be expected to get showered and undressed in front of a man when he could take her into the mens changing room?
I’m just interested in others thoughts.

There is also a disabled changing room but only one and in my opinion it’s wrong to take that over if you don’t have a disability.

And no, I don't want a man in a women's changing room. Daughter or not. I don't walk around naked and no one would see a thing, I just don't want men in there. Nor do a lot of women. Those who 'don't mind' can't decide for the rest of us, who prefer things as they always have been, thanks.

100%

If there were no cubicles he should have taken her back to the room. He sounds like a dick in general though.

A male does not have the right to walk into a female changing room, because it suits him.

He should have waited for a cubicle to be free in the men’s. But given he was a hotel guest he didn’t need to do either of those things. He cannot expect to go into the ladies changing room, some ladies could have been naked, and he walks in. Massively inappropriate.

Maybe he hadn’t anticipated the lack of family changing facilities?

Given this place's set up he should have gone back to his hotel room.

Second option the disabled (accessible) changing room.

Third option the cubicle in the men's.

The hotel should have been stricter & should have a family change area though.

I feel like, if men are uncomfortable taking their 8 and under child into a room of their own sex, men should probably do something about their own sex being predatory and creepy.

my dh takes our girls swimming at a pool with no cubicles, he’s just very careful when dressing them so not to expose them - poncho towels etc

As hotel guests....in their room, obviously.

No. Because a man SHOULD NOT BE IN THE WOMENS CHANGING ROOMS. Full stop. Yes, ideally there would be a separate space that he could use. But that is pretty standard with a hotel type pool facility to have a women’s and a men’s area. The girl should be in with her dad with her dad making sure that situation was safe for her. This situation does not and never should mean a grown man (no less, one that deliberately does what he’s already been told he can’t do), enters a female changing rooms, where women are likely to be completely naked.

A 4 year old girl is at more risk surrounded by men getting changed than a room full of fully grown women with one dad who's there with his daughter. Common sense. There should be a family room for this scenario though.

But surely if a mother took her little girl into the women’s and this man (and maybe others) was in there, her little girl is now getting changed in front of a man and being exposed to a naked man.

So instead of one man taking his one daughter into the men’s and being responsible for her and “exposing her” to naked men, he is now making potentially many other little girls exposed to him? Where is the logic in that?

People always say they don’t want their little girls (or even little boys) exposed to naked men. But yet in the same breath say it’s fine for men to bring their children into the women’s changing rooms where they too will be getting changed….. in front of all the small children their parents want to protect from that exact thing.

I agree there should be communal mixed family facilities available. It’s the only way to avoid issues.

At 4 I expect she wouldn’t question which changing room she uses. I think you were right. But there should be family rooms for people to use. It would be the same issue if he decided to take her into the women’s toilets because he didn’t want her in the men’s.

In the men's changing room. Her father would be with her the whole time; it's not like he'd be sending her in alone!

But she's not, is she? Because HER FATHER would be with her the whole time.

My opinion on this isn't a popular one on MN but I think it's worse to expect a young child to change with the wrong sex than to expect a fully grown adult to change with the wrong sex.

BUT it's not up to the dad to make that decision on behalf of all the women there - he shouldn't just saunter into the ladies. This situation crops up so often that even small swimming pools should have at least one separate "family room" for this scenario.

Witn regards to the actual swimming, if he was a hotel guest he likely wasn't around during the children's hours. He'd probably promised his little girl they could go swimming when they got to the hotel. So I can see he's in the wrong, but I have sympathy for him. How tiny is the pool that one 5yo made swimming impossible for the adults?

What men who think they are being heroes by taking daughters into women's changing rooms and toilets should remember is that a few years their little girl will be the one in the toilet/changing room when a strange man walks in. Are they still happy with that scenario?
Be father doesn't mean you can't also be an abuser.

Parents complain if 9/10/11yos have to change in a classroom together... butvtjink its fine to take boys into womens swimming changing rooms... I agree there should be another option, but taking an option away from other people isn't a solution

A gym I used to be a member of had the Team changing rooms designated as Father+child and Mother+child during swimming lessons times, which I thought was a good solution.

He sounds like a c*.
No other explanation.

A 4 year old girl is at more risk surrounded by men getting changed than a room full of fully grown women with one dad who's there with his daughter.*

At risk of what, ffs?

Its something you have to plan before you go. As a single mother with a 9yr old DS, it can be awkward depending on the situation. Often its not desirable (or safe) to send DS into male only spaces by himself but I'm aware that others may not feel comfortable with him being in a women's/girls space or for me to go into the men's. So we go at quieter times and use either the women's toilet or accessible toilet. At swimming we use the family/baby changing cubicle or we go to the larger venue with the 'changing village'.

A man shouldn’t be in the ladies no.
My dad took me swimming 4 x a week growing up - we always changed in the mens. Wasn’t an issue at all.
I never saw anything that concerned me. There was usually a cubicle free if needed. If someone was being creepy, well my dad was with me to sort it (not that this ever happened).
we have become OTT scared about children being naked in changing rooms etc in my opinion.

I refuse to believe that a group of naked women in a changing room would give a cheery wave to a man walking in. Particularly those posting here.

I've been swimming for 30 years and it's just not even a question. Children under 8 go in with their parent's sex.

little girls shouldn't see a man naked.... unless he's in the women's changing rooms with his daughter? Work out the logic on that one for me.

I think this is a tricky one to navigate. His behaviour issues aside. My son is just turning 8 and at swimming lessons. I used to take him in the ladies to get ready. Recently iv been taking him in the men's to try and get him self sufficient. It's not a big issue as it's a small pool which only has children's lessons on at that time, so no adults are changing. But on weeks where his dad doesnt take him, in a bigger pool we would be stuck. He's not quite self sufficient enough to do it all himself and in a timely manner, he's too old for the ladies, where would we go?

Get his young daughter naked in a changing room full of naked men? I don’t think that’s the obvious solution you do.