Brother and sister-in-law don't make any effort to see us

[justkeeponmoving]

My brother and his wife live 1 hour 45 mins away yet they only see us around 2 or 3 times a year. In contrast her family live in France and they go to visit them in France every half term holiday (or her family come to visit them) - so every 6 weeks or so they see them. When we do see them we have a wonderful time and they tell other people they had a great time so I know it's not us! We're chilled out normal, sociable people. I think it's just a case of them prioritising where they want to spend their time and there are only 4 weekends a month so they see their friends and her family a lot and we are just way down the list - because she just prefers to see her mum which I do understand.

I was very ill in 2019 with cancer but made a recovery. I finished all my treatment in Nov 2019 and thought Xmas they would want to spend with me but they jetted off to France. I regularly suggest meeting up and our kids all get on great. This christmas they were due to see us in Nov to celebrate as they were spending Xmas in france - they cancelled as they were ill which is fine but they made no effort to suggest a new date. I reached out after xmas and suggested we meet up as I'd like to give my niece her xmas presents and to see them to make up for xmas. They replied saying yes that would be great and would let me know dates but they haven't. I always have to set up the meetups. I understand she wants to see her family lots and that's fine but I feel like they don't bother with us - they just squeeze us in when they can. To be honest if I didn't have kids I'd not bother at all trying to meet up as I don't see the point of a half hearted relationship with immediate family who don't really care. I feel sorry for my son though!! I became a single parent in 2012 and I remember they didn't make any effort with me and I felt very lonely and isolated. I've now been in a long term relationship for 8 years so I don't 'need' them now but I feel desperately let down and sad about the situation and honestly feel like not bothering at all any more. His wife never makes any contact with me at all between visits. I have tried really really hard but am fed up now... I'd be very interested to know how often people see their brothers and sisters please? And in my situation would you consider just not bothering at all with the relationship? They never see me on my birthday or my kids birthdays or invite us to there's for birthdays or new years etc. They also don't make much effort with my parents and other family so it's not just us. I have spoken to them and asked them to see them more so it's not a case of me 'talking to them about it'.

If your sil lives in UK and her family is in France then I think it's perfectly normal for her to prioritise going back there during the holidays, for herself, and for her DC to maintain relationship with GPS, and sorry if this sounds harsh but that sounds perfectly normal to me.

And speaking as someone who lives abroad and visits UK in the holidays, it is really quite stressful trying to fit everyone in. We have stopped going to one location for Christmas and another for NY as it gets quite exhausting, and also it's hard sometimes when DC want to do something different to what you have planned, and school term times differ between countries etc.

I am sorry you feel that your brother wasn't there for you when you had cancer but tbh, I don't understand why you are blaming your sil for this.

I think as a sister, however close you were to your brother growing up, you have to make an adjustment and step back once your brother marries and has his own family. It's hard sometimes but I think that is just the way of things

I am not saying that your bil and sil shouldn't be making more of an effort with your family, because they should, but that is up to your brother to sort out!

It sounds to me like you are getting two things confused. She likes to see her family and organises this. He doesn't seem bothered. Her family is separate. Nobody is going to come up with a number of what is ok and what isn't. You are not happy with what they offer. You either need to accept it or have a conversation with your brother (not his wife).

Your expectations are completely off. My dbro lives 5 hours away we only bee down once in about 11 years. He comes up to see my parents but we just aren't close, we don't talk that much either. When siblings start their own family units they become priority and their nuclear family and siblings become extended family its a shame you were single but they likely in the throws of their own family life. I think children will always make more effort to see parents especially their dm she's done nothing wrong. I'd focus on your own family unit.

Reasonable? It depends. Monthly?

In the last few years of his life I saw my dad once or twice a year. My dh was ill and my dad was too old to travel far, but tbh I just couldn't stand seeing him, our relationship was pretty bad and I actively wanted to keep him away from ds.

Whatever he considers reasonable? It’s him who’s not putting the effort in

I said in my post we see my mum more because she makes an effort to see us but tbh we go months without seeing each other we just don’t have that kind of relationship. Not everyone enjoys being in their sibling /
Parents pockets.

Tbh from the tone of your posts I think you’re making out that you feel your SIL is the reason your brother doesn’t see / make much effort with you and your parents (making pints about how being in a relationship didn’t change how much you saw them) but at the end of yeh day your brother COULD make the effort if he wanted. My SIL spent ages last year saying the reason DH isn’t speaking to her / seeing her is my fault making me out to be some kind of controlling cow but the reason he doesn’t see his family is because he doesn’t want to after what they did to our children but I’ve told him I’m Not making the effort any more not my circus not my monkeys but he’s always welcome to do as he pleases with his family. He just doesn’t want to

@DysmalRadius

Sorry - cross post. It sounds like your brother leaves your SIL to organise his social life and doesn't really give it (or you) much thought. I'm not sure you can change that, so you have to decide whether you want to keep making all the effort or not.

Yes that is exactly it - part of my illness was due to loneliness and poor relationships / lack of meaningful relationships so I need to have people in my life who I actually see regularly!

I see my db once a year on average. We get on fine but have little in common really. He's about an hour away. I don't really communicate with SIL, again no fall outs ever, no bad feelings. It's just how we are. Your db sounds similar.
Dm once every couple of months, df as little as possible!

OP I hear you and am in the same situation. I don’t think it sounds like you’re blaming SIL, you’re just illustrating that they do make the effort with family, just not you.
I’m in the same boat with a sibling and I find it very sad, I’ve got fed up of making the effort now and just accept we see each other 1-2 times a year. It’s sad as we’re missing out on each other’s children. But you can’t make people want to see you - you have to focus on your own life and your friends/parents

@FloraPotts

If your sil lives in UK and her family is in France then I think it's perfectly normal for her to prioritise going back there during the holidays, for herself, and for her DC to maintain relationship with GPS, and sorry if this sounds harsh but that sounds perfectly normal to me.

And speaking as someone who lives abroad and visits UK in the holidays, it is really quite stressful trying to fit everyone in. We have stopped going to one location for Christmas and another for NY as it gets quite exhausting, and also it's hard sometimes when DC want to do something different to what you have planned, and school term times differ between countries etc.

I am sorry you feel that your brother wasn't there for you when you had cancer but tbh, I don't understand why you are blaming your sil for this.

I think as a sister, however close you were to your brother growing up, you have to make an adjustment and step back once your brother marries and has his own family. It's hard sometimes but I think that is just the way of things

I am not saying that your bil and sil shouldn't be making more of an effort with your family, because they should, but that is up to your brother to sort out!

Yes agreed - it is up to my brother to sort it but he's not bothered - so where do i go from there? Just carry on seeing them twice / three times a year and accept it as it is?

They travel to see her parents extremely often but they dont take their kids to see my parents - so their kids see one set of grandparents who live abroad a lot more than my parents who live in the same country but thats a separate issue.

:13justkeeponmoving

DysmalRadius

Sorry - cross post. It sounds like your brother leaves your SIL to organise his social life and doesn't really give it (or you) much thought. I'm not sure you can

Yes that is exactly it - part of my illness was due to loneliness and poor relationships / lack of meaningful relationships so I need to have people in my life who I actually see regularly!

It's not down to sil and your dbro to provide this though they are busy with their own problems and family. I think your expectations aren't realistic, it's totally different parenting providing support to a child, than a sibling.

@justkeeponmoving
“ Yes that is exactly it - part of my illness was due to loneliness and poor relationships / lack of meaningful relationships so I need to have people in my life who I actually see regularly!”

I’m sorry you experienced that but the issue is with your brother and his lack of effort so don’t blame your SIL (unless she is actually horrible to you) make it clear to your brother what you need

Your whole post was 'SIL doesn't....she doesn't' even if you now admit it's your own brother at fault

I arrange meet ups with my own family
It's up to DH to arrange stuff with his. Often he doesn't so we see them less. This is in no way my fault. The most I am willing to do to facilitate is to prompt a bit 'you haven't seen your dad lately. Are you going to arrange something?' That's all I will do

We both work FT, we have kids together. He is certainly no busier than I am. Why would I facilitate his family meet ups and birthdays when it's all I can do to keep track of mine?

@justkeeponmoving

so it seems the consensus is 2 or 3 times a year is acceptable for siblings - what about parents - how often is reasonable?

That’s not your business.

How often is reasonable entirely depends on your brother, and his relationship with them, and on them.

It feels like you want some rule so you can huffily blame them for being in the wrong.

All I see here is a woman (your SIL) who cares about seeing her family and a man who doesn’t mind but isn’t massively bothered.

You know when you were ill, she might well have been saying to him, “you really should go and see JustKeep”? But sensibly deciding that wasn’t for her take on.

Honestly, which of them makes the visits you do have happen?

You may find its also the lure of France, which is a lovely place to visit, Id be there every second weekend if I had close family there :) Just relax, people have different ideas of how close they feel family relationships should be. She sounds perfectly pleasant and nice....you maybe need to build a circle of friends closer to home and who share in your current life stage...fellow moms, work colleagues and couples who are friends with you and your partner.

I see my brother probably 3 times a year with similar distance. I think you are pushing for a closer relationship than he’s interested in.

“Yes that is exactly it - part of my illness was due to loneliness and poor relationships / lack of meaningful relationships so I need to have people in my life who I actually see regularly!“

If you’re brother isn’t bothered about this, then you could see him every weekend and it still wouldn’t be a meaningful relationship.

My closest sibling is my most distant and we see each other 2x a year. But our relationship is very meaningful.

@DSGR

OP I hear you and am in the same situation. I don’t think it sounds like you’re blaming SIL, you’re just illustrating that they do make the effort with family, just not you. I’m in the same boat with a sibling and I find it very sad, I’ve got fed up of making the effort now and just accept we see each other 1-2 times a year. It’s sad as we’re missing out on each other’s children. But you can’t make people want to see you - you have to focus on your own life and your friends/parents

Oh wow! someone who gets it! Thank you and I'm sorry you are in the same boat - it's just sad! I grew up with my cousins and I feel sad for my son.

Just to re-iterate one more time I do not blame my sil - it is my brothers responsibility - If they didnt see any family or friends at all and just prefered being on their own all the time that would be easier to understand - if the didnt like socialising or seeing people! but thats not the case and i just wanted to illustrate the efforts they go to to see family. When they lived in france they never came over to see us and we just accepted that it was a lot for them to travel - now they live here though they happily hop accross every six weeks so they can travel when they want to that is all i meant - not blaming SIL

I don’t get the negative responses to this thread.

You have made all the effort and he’s just not that interested in meeting up. If I were you I’d take a step back. Wait until they either suggest you visit them or they visit you.

My sister was like this. In 15 years we got invited to hers twice - once when she knew we were spending Christmas elsewhere anyway. She’d hardly ever ring me - once every two years as opposed to me calling her maybe twice a year, but then complain to my mum that we weren’t close as I never rang her.

She stopped speaking to me a few years ago so I no longer have this problem but I think you should try to detach yourself so that it doesn’t upset you. Get closer to your parents.

**They travel to see her parents extremely often but they dont take their kids to see my parents - so their kids see one set of grandparents who live abroad a lot more than my parents who live in the same country but thats a separate issue.

Yep it sounds as if your brother is definitely the issue here. As someone said before, SIL is prioritising seeing HER own family. If they see her parents who live overseas, more often then they see your parents who lives in the same country, it’s clear that your brother isn’t bothered enough regarding seeing his own family. It’s not up to her to arrange visits when your brother is more than capable to do so.

I stopped reaching out to DPs side and now they hardly ever care enough to come and see DD. DP just doesn’t care enough to arrange anything🤷‍♀️ As you said, db and sil also live nearly two hours away. That’s quite a long distance to me so 2/3 times a year sounds good enough to me

I bet this is a case of her not wanting to take on the wife work of making the arrangements for his family so she doesn't. And neither does he.

This sits squarely with your brother.

I don't want to be harsh here but maybe they don't see you as often because they don't want to. Maybe for them 2-3 times a year is enough.
Maybe he loves you as you're his sister but actually doesn't have a lot in common with you so doesn't feel the need to see you all the time.

I think we all need to get away from this idea of expectations and duty. Do we really want to maintain family relationships based on what is expected because it's family?

It might be that your brother is a lazy shit and your SIL is sick of organising his life as well as her own so she's left him to it.
It might be that the level of contact they have currently works for them.

What are you going to do, force or guilt trip them into being a bigger part of your life?

3 times a year sounds pretty normal to me. YABU.

@justkeeponmoving
“ Yes agreed - it is up to my brother to sort it but he's not bothered - so where do i go from there? Just carry on seeing them twice / three times a year and accept it as it is? ”

Sadly yes you can’t force people to see you. You can talk to him and explain why you feel you need to see him more but at the end of the day if he’s not bothered and not putting the effort in you cant do much. Even if you did make him see you more it wouldn’t be a meaningful relationship if he just isn’t bothered.

Also the point about how they don’t take the kids to see your parents again sorry that’s on your brother. His parents his arrangements to make. If he wanted to take them to see them he would he clearly just doesn’t want to make effort

I think you're getting a hard time on here, I'd be very sad in your situation too. It sounds like your brother is just not that bothered, that your expectations are not the same as his. Not sure what you can do really, other than go with the flow.

The only thing you can do - for your own benefit - is to drop all expectations of them. That your brother didn’t bother with you when you were newly alone with a baby says it all.