AIBu - to want to have sex with my own wife

[Dadboddancer]

Dear Mumsnet

I've turned to mumsnet in desperation and need a a female perspective.
I'm worried I'm being an insensitive husband.

I need advice about how to approach a lack of intimacy and sex in our marriage since the birth of our first child.

The back story - I've been happily married for 7 years. We were together 5 years before getting married. We have two lovely children aged 3/12 and 11 months.

The problem with intimacy started when my wife got pregnant. We did not have sex or any sexual contact during the pregnancy. This was her wish and I was fine with it. Other intimacies were ok at that stage.

After the birth - as expected -all intimacy dissipated. We did not even kiss again for 10 months. We probably had sex 3 times in the 2 years after - once amazingly conceiving our beautiful daughter. Other intimacy remained very limited (and one sided from me).

Like all other couples - I think we neglected our relationship after our first baby. However, since - I've made sure we get some "us" time even if its only once per month. I still think she is beautiful and she still gets flowers and random gifts. I've re-arranged my work schedule to have a day off at home to help with childcare and home running.

I feel awful saying this - but having sex 4/5 times in 5 years isn't enough for me. The constant rejection, and then the constant holding back so im not "pestering" is getting me down. I'm happy in every other aspect and she is an AMAZING mother.

Its so hard to talk about things without appearing to moan about not getting any

Can I ask for your collective experience:

1. Have other couples/ ladies had similar drops in their libido after their children - if so how did things turn out?
2. Have any of you worked through a problem like this - what was your approach?
3. If I can't get past this - what are my options - do any of you live in sexless marriages for the kids benefit and get on ok?

Feeling terrible about considering causing my children pain and leaving just because I dont get laid.

Any serious views will be taken on board.

majda this is the one we did. It has a religious element but not overwhelmingly so.

themarriagecourses.org/try/the-marriage-course

I too couldn’t stand the thought of my boobs being sexual organs whilst breastfeeding - they were there purely too feed babies, and needed to remain ‘pure’ if that makes sense

OP was your second child planned?

Amazingly our second child was planned.

If there was every a time I wished I had dud sperm....

How could you have only had sex 3 times in 2 years if you were actively TTC?

She is being out of order in my opinion.
I knew a bloke in a very similar situation. His wife basically used him as a sperm donor. After the second kid, that was pretty much it as far as sex was concerned. He batted it out for 3 years then met somebody else. He was made out as the bad guy, which was totally unfair.
There are a lot of women who just want kids, and that’s their lot. The ongoing bf-ing not helping matters either.
The option, OP, is give her an ultimatum, she either starts putting out or you’re off. And whatever you do dont let her use you as a sperm donor again, it will be the biggest mistake you ever make.

It is totally great that you recognise she is doing more and have taken steps to mitigate this but it doesn't help to be resentful. Resentment IMO is a bit of a strange reaction - have you tried to take the pressure off her because you care for her wellbeing and don't want her overburdened, or because you want something in return for it? Because to me resentment seems based on the latter. It can be really damaging for your relationship if you get caught up in competitive tiredness/competitive "I've got the worse deal" - and I'm not saying this is one sided as she may be guilty of this too.

OK - so you can't breastfeed - but at 11 months this isn't such a massive deal. I appreciate that it means she is doing more possibly at night etc but it really really doesn't mean that you can't match up.

If she is too exhausted to think about sex yet you are not - it points to the fact that things are unequal. Yet if you are unhappy because you have no hobbies, never get a lie in etc it's not unreasonable to look at whether this can change, as long as she has the same opportunities. Personally, I don't need my DH to give me a lie in every day he can with never a chance for one himself - I'd rather that we each got a lie in at about an equal rate. However if I was the only one up at night yet I knew he was generally getting good sleep, I wouldn't be very impressed if he kept insisting on equal weekend naps etc. I don't know - you need to talk to her about it and what you each value. My point is there is absolutely no point martyring yourself in terms of saying hey, look, I get nothing nice but I can't compare to her - it ought to be a discussion where you each talk about what you need in terms of support, sleep, time off, whatever it is. I don't think that "moments of passion" can really come into this though because for most people, especially women, the other things need to be in place before it can happen and it can actually be quite damaging if it's forced/pushed before it's ready - but IME and what you hear on these threads again and again is that when things feel equal and supportive, the connection is there and there are not these threads of resentment it seems to come back. The problem is that many couples get into a spiral of resentment which never really goes away and then it never does come back, it simply gets worse and worse. Early parenthood is hard - it doesn't help to resent your partner for the amount there is to do. The best you can do is try to approach/tackle it together and feel like a team as you do so. This brings you closer, and it is a hell of an aphrodisiac, but there might be times when both of you are too exhausted to think about sex. The aim really is that you're on the same level in that sense.

That was our active.

We had sex once - 2 weeks later 2 lines appeared on a test. Thankfully daughter is a moment of magic made from my one moment of magic.

My husband has definitely got less intimacy and sex and our youngest is 8!.

So, for me the issues are that I don't want to get pregnant again, the pill kills my sex drive and this leads to me being much less intimate because if I initiate a cuddle he immediately is up for sex.

If I knew a cuddle wouldn't make me feel
guilty/him frustrated I would initiate a lot more often. If I initiated cuddles and kisses more often the intimacy would return and we would then have sex more often. At the moment if we do have sex, he wants it much more often so I feel I am rejecting more often which makes us both resentful.

It's a vicious circle which I am only just starting to see my way out of and we are 11 years in.

YABU to say "my own wife"
She is not your property. I find that a really disturbing turn of phrase tbh.

What is interesting is the lack of ability to say ‘I feel...”. You absolutely have the right to say ‘I feel neglected, unloved and frustrated when we don’t have any sex or intimacy’ - likewise she has the right to say - ‘at the moment, whilst I am breast-feeding, sex feels like a chore and I hate the thought of it.’

I think you need to get to the stage where that is said out loud and together you try to come to a compromise. It would be a shame to split up now - with two young children if this can be sorted. Both need to accept that it is difficult and find a path through that is acceptable to both. Have you discussed couple’s counselling?

Good reply about spiral of resentment Bertie Botts.

I have (only recently) fallen into this a little.

Maybe the biggest resentment is about investment in the relationship. if i'm trying to do more housework (even if not enough) I am at least trying to see her viewpoint. I would like her to try and see mine too.

I'm not up for an ultimatum as previously stated. No matter how upset I feel about it - she is the mother of my child and what she does with her body is her business.

My husband probably feels very similar to you. Our kids are the same age more or less, and we have had sex only around half a dozen times maximum since the youngest was born, all instigated by him. If it was down to me, it may not have happened at all. It didn’t really pick up between the first two kids either, except when actively trying to conceive the second! However I breastfed the first until trying for a second and totally agree with the touched out thing. I still can’t cope with my breasts being touched now 2 years later (not what you want to hear!). Other reasons for not being in the mood are predominately immense tiredness, plus the fact I don’t stop all day and when I finally get into bed I don’t want one more thing to have to do (I know that sounds awful!). also my husband has been rather moody since the stress of having 2 kids and every time he is short with or critical at me about something it completely kills any wish I may have had to be intimate with him. Despite all the doom and gloom of this message I do (hopefully) see things improving once kids get a little bigger and sleep better etc. Oh and birthing injuries, yes definitely a factor. I had forceps and third degree tear and it has made sex quite uncomfortable, esp at first, which massively put me off.

What Verbena87 said in her first post. All day long. I had a horrendous birth and my DH would definitely say he didn’t pester me for sex but when you know and love someone whether they say it or not you know what they mean / want. I just ended up exhausted, pained and resentful. If you take it slowly, at her pace, then you will get it back, but if you push it then you may kill it off completely. I remember the ‘this Is all you get’ cuddle body language because I knew he wanted more. So I began resenting the cuddle.

Do things she enjoys, that you would have done for her before kids, and your sex life may come back. Make implicit deals about her getting time away / daddy manager taking more on in exchange for getting ‘an occasional moment of passion’ and you are on a hiding to nothing. She knows you. She knows how you think.

I remember seeing a sex therapist on tv saying it takes two years to get things back to normal after a baby. I do know that after each birth I really did not want sex at all for many months, it was around six months each time, and even then I felt rather sexless for a long time, while breastfeeding. I think that was a mix of hormones , exhaustion, body image issues .wanting solitary time, and having got out of the habit. I felt like a different person, and although I love my husband very much and find him attractive, I was just worn out and it all felt like too much effort . I also worried about the babies waking. I just had a different focus I suppose. I think it does take an effort to get things back, and that can just feel like one thing too many.
What does your wife say ?

If there was every a time I wished I had dud sperm....

Did you just wish away your second child because you feel she is the reason you're not getting enough sex...?!

This also causes a little resentment in me. Whilst she certainly is the "mum manager" ( the biggest job I know) - I'm the house manger (Do mortgage/bills/ banking/ arranging work/insurance.) These are things I can do without having to know what the children have eaten at lunch

I suspect that the last line could also be part of the problem - she wants to talk, and (I may well be massively projecting here!) wants some reassurance that she’s doing the right thing, and wants to include you, and you feel you don’t need to know. Personally I’d take that as rude and dismissive, decreasing the chances I’ll be feeling it.

It does sound like you’re trying, but are you trying enough? What does your wife say she needs from you?

Sidalee. Have you been waiting to find fault with OP? Is this the best you can come up with? Disturbing? Ffs.

I think if she has already said she feels tired and touched out, there is a good chance that this is a big factor in her lack of intimacy. The only way to improve things is to keep the dialogue going.

It’s clear that life is challenging right now for your wife. Sometimes just acknowledging how difficult it is, is a really useful first step. Marriage is about being a team. You need to talk about how you both can be as happy with your set-up as can be. You might find a counsellor as a third party really useful in this process. It’s also really good time out for you both as a couple to look at things together and discuss improvements and the best way forward.

I wouldn’t even bring up sex until general life issues are dealt with.

It is unbelievable to me that you’ve only spoken about it once! How on earth do either of you know what you’re feeling if you don’t talk? It doesn’t (and probably shouldn’t) have to be directly about sex, you could discuss what parts of your life you’re happy with, how well things are going in some areas, what you’d like more of or less of in your lives. If you can’t do it alone do it with a counsellor.

I think you need to ask your wife:
Is her lack of libido just a lack of libido or is it that she does not find you physically attractive anymore? Does she want sex but just not with you? Or is it that she doesn't want sex full stop? If it's the former then it's obviously more troubling, if it's the latter she just needs time and understanding.
My sex drive diminished after the birth of my third child in a way that I knew wasn't natural for me. It wasn't that I didn't find my husband attractive anymore I just didn't want sex full stop. My hormones were all over the place - irregular periods, I know I wasn't ovulating every month.
18 months down the line and my periods went back to normal, baby started sleeping so I was less tired etc and slowly but surely my sex drive came back. All that time though I knew I still 'wanted' my husband if that make sense - it was more of a physical loss of libido than anything to do with him personally. He was very patient and understanding, we stayed intimate in other ways. The thing was we talked about it and didn't let it become the elephant in the room.
You need to speak to your wife and be honest with each other.

I think it’s the touched outness as much as a lack of libido. I have two kids aged 4 and 1 and feel permanently like someone is clambering on me 24/7 because one of them is generally in our bed too. I’m not sure what you do about that but it definitely makes me less reseptive to physical contact from my husband than I was previously. Our sex life isn’t in terrible shape but I do catch myself getting irritated by physical contact sometimes and I know what it’s because of. I try and be honest about it and tell DH how I’m feeling.

I had three DC in 2.5 years. The first two were planned, last one was not. Essentially my body went through 4 years of pregnancy, birth, the postpartum period and breastfeeding. It was obviously absolutely exhausting and my body changed beyond recognition (to me). I didn’t feel sexy or sexual in the slightest, it was seriously the very last thing on my mind. XH would sometimes nag and it made me feel very uncomfortable. I did feel harsh ‘rejecting’ his advances but I just didn’t have anything left in the tank for him. I was working and studying alongside the DC.

I realised eventually that I didn’t love him anymore and we separated. It didn’t just spring up out of nowhere but when the youngest was 1.5 and I had lost a lot of weight, stopped breastfeeding etc I still didn’t want to have sex with him. Ultimately that was the realisation, it was a lack of sexual interest in him and a lack of love for him too actually.

For your wife, the first pointers probably stand more than the last. She’s likely not feeling very attractive atm and is just simply knackered. I would give her some time (although I appreciate it must be very difficult) and if it still hasn’t picked up in a few months, you need a chat and perhaps counselling. In the mean time, don’t stop offering affection and compliments.

I think it might be helpful to remember that your "house manager" mental work of paying monthly bills is significantly less than her "mum manager" mental work of supervising the children every minute, knowing what food is available and which meals to make, managing on going housework issues. It is not really comparable and it might be helpful to recognise that, particularly as you say she has mentioned being tired of thinking about everything.

It sounds like you might benefit from relationship counselling tbh, you don't sound as if you really appreciate each other or understand each other's perspective.

Can I just say you sound like a really lovely bloke.

That aside try and communicate more and pick a moment you can have this conversation. Maybe start on the point of outlining the appreciation you have for her and what a great mother she is then broach the subject of what you want to work on as a couple and it would make you feel closer. Be patient and express you will be and check if there are any underlying issues, she might be struggling with post baby confidence and breast feeding can be a block to feeling like sex.

Good luck, you have communicated well here how you feel so I think you can to her directly.