To wonder how the U.S can claim to be a civilised society whilst there is such a thing as Death Row?

[BupcakesandCunting]

There's probably been threads about this already...

But I just don't see how capital punishment can be an underpin of what the world regards as a civilised, modern society/country. What they did to Troy Davies yesterday can't be reversed. His supporters are still trying to prove his innocence and are confident that the gaping holes that they are finding in the case will prove it. So what will he get? A posthumous pardon? Yeah, great stuff that, America.

Totally agree. How do we teach people that killing is wrong but putting them to death? How many miscarriages of justice have there been in cases like this where the result is totally irreversible? What on earth gives anyone the right to take the life of somebody else?

It is ridiculous that this still goes on. If you look at the list of countries that still have the death penalty it's not one that you would want to join.

YANBU. The death penalty doesn't even act as a deterrent (I don't agree with it anyway though, it has no place in a civilised society).

"It is ridiculous that this still goes on. If you look at the list of countries that still have the death penalty it's not one that you would want to join."

Exactly.

Also, they're standing on shaky ground when dismissing many Middle Eastern countries as barbaric when they allow this to go on. How can Obama let this go on? He seems so reasonable. :(

YANBU I also agree that whatever the crime and the certainty of guilt, killing a person in cold blood as a "punishment" has no place whatsoever in a civilised society.

YANBU. It's all about vengeance, not about justice, and is an unimaginative and ineffective response to violence.

I agree, and have always been amazed.

YANBU.

Horribly sad that they would rather execute someone without adequate proof of his guilt than take the time to re-examine the case. I wonder whether his last words had any effect on the victim's family, one of whom said they just wanted it over and done with. If a member of my family was killed, I would like to think that I wouldn't be so desperate for someone to pay that I would condone this happening. (Although it wouldn't happen because thankfully we don't have capital punishment in the UK)

The President, and the rest of federal government, have no control over this - it's a state issue (and in the current climate in the States, fighting on state rights is not going to be a priority for Obama). Some states/districts/territories have banned the death penalty.

What Midnight said.

Last night makes me a bit ashamed to be human.

I wasn't sure if the government had any control over it. But surely if congress had something to say about it, individual states can't just by laws unto themselves, can they? Or can they?

" I wonder whether his last words had any effect on the victim's family, one of whom said they just wanted it over and done with."

The victim's mother said "yadda yadda" or words to that effect.

A member of my family was murdered, in China, where the death penalty is widely used. The man convicted of his murder was hanged. We have no real way of knowing the safety of the conviction as the amount of information we got was very limited. The authorities would have been under some pressure to find the person who killed a westerner in an important business area, so who knows? I do know that my family was, and still is, distressed that the death of my relative (a kind and peaceful person) resulted in the death of another, guilty or not.

I really do genuinely believe that if someone in my family was murdered I would not want the person who was convicted (not always necessarily responsible) to be killed, and I don't think any of my family would. I would rather they spent their entire life in prison and had an opportunity to regret what they'd done - I think it would be worse to live with that weight of guilt and regret than to die.

The process is totally barbaric and inhumane, it is not painless or easy. It is bizarre to me that this continues in the US but as NotJust says, it is a state issue and they are fiercely protective of their 'rights' to self-govern (and kill people if they feel like it).

It is very very rare that you can be 100% sure that the person convicted is guilty, and I would rather we never take the chance of killing an innocent person.

yanbu.

At one point there was a Federal ban on the death penalty in the United States, I believe this was in the 70s. However it didn't last long, the law was repealed and then individual states slowly but surely started to re-introduce it. A Federal ban has happened before and could happen again, but I doubt Obama will even try to go down that route as it would piss the gun-toting Republican right far too much.

Has anyone else found it bizarre that the pro-death penalty people are also the most ardent "pro-lifers"?

Sorry Stiffy I cross posted with you - mine was not in response to yours. I'm really sorry to hear about your family member.

I feel the same as you - am very thankful I have never had to have those beliefs tested though.

I don't think he'd go for it as the current climate and fight he is having is that the federal government is too big. If he started trying to push his party to put something through Congress, it would be seen as further treading on the state's rights by federal government and a massive backlash would happen. He could consider it if he gets a second term, but even then it is shaky. The current US climate is one where people want more control away from federal government.

Bupcakes Just as the UK has some areas that are devolved to nations, and some local authorities have laws that only affect their area, the States has many areas that are under state control (and even further to local control in some cases) rather than federal control. The entire history of the States can be seen as a fight between the two - I mean, the American Civil War was pretty much whether or not a state had a right to leave the States of it's own will if it didn't like the decisions of federal government.

Basically, the fight to rid the states of the death penalty has to be, and is being fought on a state-by-state basis. The federal government isn't going to touch that again with a barge pole for quite some time, it can only lead by example with DC having banned it.

Stiffy :(

Thank you, NotJust. You'd think I'd have remembered something from my American Studies minor at university, wouldn't you?!

YANBU - I think this often.

im all in favour of the death penalty

The thing is that LOTS of prisoners who go to their death have been convicted under shaky evidence. The stats show a large skew in the amount of young black men on death row and that their IQ levels are often very VERY low.

It's shaming.

I have mixed views. I do think if there is absolute 100% irrefutable proof of guilt, and the guilty person is never going to be released into society again, that to keep them in prison for the rest of their life seems a huge waste of money though.

My personal opinion is that they should be used for medical research. Surely a human body would yield more accurate test results than an innocent animal, and it would also at least make one part of that persons life worth something to society.

Which crimes would attract being used as a human guinea pig squeaky?

squeaky I think that is absolutely disgusting. You can't use non-consenting live bodies for medical research. What an awful idea.

YANBU. Its revolting.