Boris has been fined - Part 3

[Roussette]

Here we are.

And here is Part 2

www.mumsnet.com/talk/_chat/4529283-Boris-has-been-fined-Part-2?reply=116839783

@JaniieJones Can I just check something?
You do know that these seats were last contested 4 years ago, when it was also the middle of a parliament?
I suppose the Tories did have the inspirational Theresa May leading them then, which may be why they won more seats on that occasion.

I note that the caption refers to English Councils, and so perhaps that the Tories only lost 342 councillors and not the 350 required for a disaster, then perhaps @JaniieJones is right and Johnson isn't a turkey.

'IF KS is issued with a fixed penalty and resigns (which tbh, he has too or just be forever more accused of being a hypocrite), Bojo wont, he'll just carry on and say KS resigning is up to him'

Well yes. Starmer is the only one proclaiming fpn equals resignation, not Johnson.

'Um they expected to eat during the course of the evening. I expect to eat at some point this evening.'

Starmer said it was all spur of the moment. Working hard, stopped for a bite to eat, carried on working. There is a leaked memo allegedly stating it was all preplanned. He has so much egg on his face.

Sam Coates Sky
Mail on Sunday obtain the operational note for April 30 2021 - “beergate” day

The curry at the heart of the police investigation features on it as a preplanned event
twitter.com/SamCoatesSky/status/1522977416037208064?t=jNJduWIOtH7TsWuJMuLQiw&s=19

Adam Wagner
Just seen this - don't see how it being pre-planned makes a difference to original reason, they were feeding staff & I assume volunteers.The fact it was pre-arranged with social distancing guidelines makes it more likely to be reasonably necessary not less

@JaniieJones You have great wisdom when it comes to all things political.
The Tories did poorly because it is the mid-term of the Westminster parliament.
I understand it is also the middle of the term of the Welsh parliament, and Wales has also had a pandemic, cost of living crisis and so on, so how come the party in government in Wales has added so many seats?

@JaniieJones To be clear you do not think that the Prime Minister breaking the law is a resigning matter?
Wow.

It would have been strange if they hadn't lost any. Post pandemic, cost of living crisis due to global energy hikes, constant media smears, partygate. With the terrible 2 years we've had including mistruths 'highest death rate!' Remember that? Yet now we know we didn’t (media strangely quiet on that) so losing seats at a local election was to be expected. Mid terms also

But its not a mistruth, the stats do not lie and the UK has a total of 176k deaths, Italy, the next highest European country is 164k (i ve excluded Russia, we cannot believe anything they say and its arguable if they are a complete European country, unless you think europe has a border with China?)

The UK has the 7th highest death toll in the world.

Johnson was also found guilty for acting unlawfully over the release of patients back into Care Homes.

The media has gone quiet on CV full stop, despite 100s dying every day from, 7 day average is 330, grim really considering vaxx and we are into Summer.

Of course a meeting where one of the countries leading politicians visiting is pre planned! what else would anyone expect?

I don't see the equivalence with KS and BJ at all, BJ attended several events at the heart of Government, with family and tradespeople in attendance doing.

However, the public and right wing media wont see this distinction.... i asked one of Plymouths Labour activists should KS resign if fined and she said he would have too, he would become the story, if he didn't... its already happening.

"Well yes. Starmer is the only one proclaiming fpn equals resignation, not Johnson."

Starmer is basing that on the Ministerial Code of Conduct - which Johnson signed to authorise when he became PM.
I suppose Codes and Laws are meaningless to Johnson,

I wonder what the average turn out was, I read somewhere it was very low?

We are usually very low (35% ish) but locally our turn out rose nearly 5%.

Tory stronghold area and our local Tory counsellor who has just retired has been amazing for decades. He's very hot on socio economic issues and I thought he was a Labour councillor for my first few years of living here (from abroad) before our local elections because of his priorities and policies.

We are still Tory. However for the first time in over 2 decades they had less than 50% of the vote (a drop of 9% since last elections) and although they held their seats Labour had an increase of 10%.

We also had a greater amount of spoilt ballots.

'To be clear you do not think that the Prime Minister breaking the law is a resigning matter?'
'Wow.'

'Wow'?

I'm very able to look at context so no, an fpn for a 10min happy birthday greeting with others is not a law breaking incident where resignation is proportionate. If he'd burgled a house as you oddly often try to compare it to, yes that would be a resignation matter.

Poor Starmer has backed himself into a corner though demanding resignations hasn't he. Maybe not the last we've seen of But Jezza Corbyn afterall..

@JaniieJones Thank you very much for the clarification.
So we now know that breaking the law for 10 minutes doesn't count in some instances, for example where putting people's lives at risk is concerned, but does count if you burgle someone's house for less than 10 minutes.

We would all love to hear which other laws one can break for 10 minutes and it not count, I do hope you will enlighten us?

For example is speeding through a residential street acceptable for 10 minutes but not 11? Is beating someone up for 10 minutes but 11 ok?

It would have been strange if they hadn't lost any. Post pandemic, cost of living crisis due to global energy hikes, constant media smears, partygate. With the terrible 2 years we've had including mistruths 'highest death rate!' Remember that? Yet now we know we didn’t (media strangely quiet on that) so losing seats at a local election was to be expected. Mid terms also

So anything but the real reasons. Got it. 482 lost

And we only have Johnson's word that it was only ten minutes, or he thought it was work. This from the man who is on public record as being sacked for lying.

He wouldn't know the truth if it came up and hit him in the face!

It's strange, isn't it. Only the Tory voters suffered from the pandemic - it passed Labour/LibDem/Green/SNP by. A strange virus indeed.

It might have been better if Johnson had done a bit more of his call me Churchill act in Ukraine. Some of the seats he canvassed in lost more Tory seats than may have been expected.

He even lied to the queen

I'm very able to look at context so no, an fpn for a 10min happy birthday greeting with others is not a law breaking incident where resignation is proportionate. If he'd burgled a house as you oddly often try to compare it to, yes that would be a resignation matter

Let's wait for Sue Grey then shall we? Because I remember distinctly you saying if there were other parties like Abba or whatever, he should go.

Brace yourself!

'We would all love to hear which other laws one can break for 10 minutes and it not count, I do hope you will enlighten us?'

Happy to enlighten you anytime.

Fpn for birthday greetings not a resigning matter. Assaulting someone for example would be. Imo of course.

To the pp who seems to think we have the highest death rate we really don't, we are behind Germany Spain and Italy. Excess deaths, per capita.

Those goal post........................

Here you are JaniieJones The former chief of police in Durham knows it's just a smear campaign against Starmer by the right wing press.

"Durham’s former police chief has condemned attempts to get his former force to investigate Keir Starmer over allegations of Covid rule-breaking as “hypocritical” and “dangerous” and said there is no evidence the Labour leader flouted the law.
Michael Barton, chief constable of Durham until 2019, said the pressure on police to investigate was politically motivated. In his time in charge, Durham was rated as one of the best-performing police forces.
Barton said of those pressing police to investigate, including Conservative MPs and rightwing newspapers: “They are using operational policing as a political football, which is dangerous and ought to be condemned."

Let's keep the momentum up, because this subject matter is not going away anytime soon.

I've started a new thread as we're getting close to 1,000. Here it is

www.mumsnet.com/talk/_chat/4545092-boris-and-his-fines-part-4

Is that assaulting someone for more than 10 minutes is a resigning matter. I'm also confused, I thought you said that illegal parties were ok if they were less than 10 minutes, but now you seem to be saying that they are always ok?

And let's not forget the difference in the dates.

May 2020 was very very very different to a year later. That gets forgotten

I don't see the equivalence with KS and BJ at all, BJ attended several events at the heart of Government, with family and tradespeople in attendance.

Keir Starmer's biggest problem is Rishi Sunak -

12 April 2022
The Labour leader, Keir Starmer, has said Boris Johnson and Rishi Sunak “have to go”, calling them “guilty men” after the two were given fixed-penalty notices over parties held in Downing Street when government rules forbade gatherings during the Covid lockdown.

By all accounts Rishi Sunak (who is teetotal) was rather unlucky to have received a fixed-penalty notice - he was en route to a cabinet meeting but Sanctimonious Starmer said Sunak must resign as well.

@Clavinova Good evening, it is a delight to see you return to this thread at such a crucial moment in the story.

I have to say I thought that Rishi was Boris' biggest problem which is why he had to be discredited with the non-dom story at that particular moment, or have I misunderstood the politics of it?

Did you enjoy the local elections? Bit of a shock for the Tories to lose 25% of the seats they used to hold. Good day for all the other parties.