Why some women don't identify with feminism

I think some posters revive these old threads to try and be disruptive. Pathetic, but what they're far too thick to realise is:

• these issues are as old as time. They don't stop being relevant. They never will do.
• it's heartening to see women making good arguments across the years. We like discussing these issues.
• the arguments are still rock solid and have stood the test of time, unlike ideologies that will wane eventually.
• it's nice to be reminded of posters we forgot about!

I think some women believe all the big battles have been won and to be fair, when I talk to my mum about this stuff it's shocking how recently really basic rights were actually won.
Another problem is this idea that we're all supposed to agree on everything, or we're somehow traitors to the sisterhood.
Seeing some of the posts in the feminism topic, there are some sisters who seem to spend more time bitching about other women and that's a big turn-off.

Ah bugger.

We seem to get these in waves.

This is very much the kind of thing that makes me disinclined to consider myself a feminist.

The assumption that your definition of what that means is the correct one. The assumption that anyone who disagrees with you can only do so because they are stupid. The assumption they must be historically illiterate. Who wants to belong to a movement with that level of smugness.

Did check the date beforehand, am not bothered, as it is a valid question. Also, TRAs are brigading so many topics right now, on every platform basically. I can´t even enjoy reddit/houseplants anymore. They need to invade everything by throwing that gross turquoise-pink-brown flag over it. Excuse me, I have to go and vomit.

MRA/TRA disruption, and people don't check dates before posting

Because they think it will get them love.

My mum was one of those, raised to be a doormat and thought men could love (especially submissive, motherly women). Loved her boytchik, did not give a fuck about her daughters. Died pretty much alone.

Why another zombie thread? What is going on?

I'm a woman and I don't identity as a feminist because I don't like what modern feminism has become. I appreciate the earlier iterations but the current 4th wave has gone off track with fighting for things that I just don't believe in/agree with (trans rights, sex work and quotas for example).

Sorry am addressing that to Shrieking Harpy

It's a long time since I've read that book, but are you arguing that rape hasn't played a critical function in instilling fear in women?

I seem to remember her discussing this in the context of men raping women as an act of war and pointing out that wherever there is war, rape goes hand in hand. I think she discussed the systematic rape of German women by the allies in 1945 (can't quite remember, as I said it's a long time ago), but you could easily update with Bosnia, the Congo, etc.

first marriage age gap was 2 years in 2000 accoring to here.

Interesting...

"Bizarrely my mum is older than my dad by the same gap as DH and I"

Same here, does this mean we are turning into our parents?!

I don't know minipie where the 4 years comes from, I just seem to remember it.

It certainly holds with all of my friends, I am the only one with a younger OH. The rest have older partners - quite a bit older actually. Probably averaging 7 years or so.

Bizarrely my mum is older than my dad by the same gap as DH and I, and DHs sisters are all with younger men too. Wonder what it all means... (nothing, probably )

My experience of my generation doesn't match that statistic... most couples I know are the same sort of age, I know a few where the man is older, and a few where the woman is older (though it's true that these always get commented on ).

Is the 4 year age gap an average (i.e. mean) statistic? if so, maybe it comes from lots of couples who are similar ages, and a few couples where the man is considerably older (i.e. second marriage)?

ISNT was really glad to read that in the news, hopefully it'll encourage more people to stand up for equality.

Bizzarely about 90% of the women I know personally are with younger partners. I'm hanging out with the rebels

this is pertinent - big equal pay case against birmingham city council has just been decided, female empoyees have £600m coming to them.

How can people read stuff like this in the news (there is a lot of it about) and not see that there is still discrimination. If women had won equal pay etc already, where has this case come from IYSWIM

Yes I realised that my post contained a possibly sexist comment about women maturing more quickly than men!

But seriously, if we are meeting our mates later, why this gap? is it because people stil see that the male should be the older and therefore senior member of a partnership?

With women living longer than men surely it makes sense for us to be settling down with men who are younger than us.

(am I being too logical? )

ImSoNotTelling - I could say, because women grow up more quickly than men.

But that would be sexist

and d)for childcare to be esteemed and valued no matter who does it.

I used to struggle with how being a feminist woman could fit in with being a mother who took three years off work and breastfed for two of those years (one of the main reasons for taking the time).

Then I realised that feminism and capitalism are not compatible for me.

Actually that is a good question.

Why is the usual dynamic in relationships that the man is (i think) 4 years older than the woman?

When people married very young it was more understandable, with this idea that women mature more quickly. But these days, with loads of people not meeting their mate until later, why is this differential still being maintained?

The reason that men are generally the higher earners when children come IME is due to the fact that women tend to get together with men who are older than them - and thus are earning more simply by dint of having been in the work force for longer.

And then when the sums are done the current salaries are taken into account and not the potential earnings of the respective individuals.

For eg I have a friend who was super top a-levels and degree and went to train as an accountant at top london firm ie massive earning potential. She got togetehr with a man in a much less well paid career but due to the age differential he was earning more than her at the point the children came (at the beginning of her career but when his was well established).

Now it may be that if they had taken a "potential earnings" view rather than a "current earnings" one when deciding what to do, that they would have made the same decision.

But I think couples need to understand that often the reason the man is earning more is not because he has a "better" career that thus needs protecting, but simply that he has been doing it longer.

it is an easy trap to fall into and then you suddenly realise a few years down the line that you've bungled it.

People need to (again) break free from gender expectations and learn to do what is right for them, personally and as a family unit, for now and the long term.

And maybe, as xenia says, stop marrying older men

And to have universal access to good quality childcare, which is properly remunerated.