Views on androgen insensitivity and women’s sport participation

That's the eternal question isn't it? Why so much concern about whether we are being fair to one male person and so little concern about whether we are being unfair to four billion female ones.

Men should have the right to take part on women’s sports if they feel like it

No

What about these men?

No

or these men?

No

what about those men?

No

these men must surely be allowed?

No

this group of men are an exception?

No

ad infinitum

I can say what I want Thankyou very much. And the threa is actually about VSD. Did you not read the OP. I know you’re a bit salty I pointed out the flaws in your argument but we all should accept feedback gracefully.

Yes, from the point of view that physically there would be no reason not. If you want a thread discussing how to get more girls into sport, start one. This is a thread about trans issues and sport.

You were the one advocating for mixed sex teams and how it would be good for children.

I think that's a completely different question and a cultural one not a physical one.

The Q angle in some men is higher than the Q angle in some women.

There will be women with a throwing action more like a man's and men with a throwing action more like a woman's.

It isn't helpful, imo, for skeletons to be brought into these discussions of how you tell men from women, because unlike testosterone, there is always an overlap and the argument can always be defeated.

If CAIS is over represented in elite sports, then it is giving an advantage. That’s the bottom line, and nothing you say can change that or make it ok.

Completely agree, CAIS is rightly banned, and I think PAIS should have joined it.

That is fair. But then how would you encourage girls into sport? We are not just talking physically, but especially in primary/early secondary schools, boys want to “play with the girls”. You see it in primary school playgrounds everywhere. It’s not often the boys and girls play the same games.
school teams yes, but again, we would have to unpick a lot of social conditioning for both groups to ensure girls get equal opportunities in mixed teams.

That's the point, LTF.

The whole point. No specific thing makes anyone male or female except their genes, and those can't be changed.

Did you watch the video you pointed to?

It says the testes aren't removed these days.

Age 5 to 10 girls are better than boys on balance and flexibility.
Age 11 to 13 girls can be stronger than boys because of earlier puberty.

I think mixed teams in team sports at a young age are a very good idea. A school which can't put together 11 boy footballers plus subs of a similar age can't play 11 a side football. A school which can put together 11 children can.

Chromosomal blueprint is precisely how sex is determined. The chromosomes are the hard drive.

'Male' is a biological category, not a personality or 'lived experience' category.

You are talking primarily about male people with CAIS.

Female only categories are for female people only. It is unfortunate for the people who have this condition, but that doesn't mean we should under-mine the integrity of female only categories, services, spaces or sports.

Because their body isn’t female. The Q angle will be different, the hip angle will be different, the shoulder will have a different for throwing action.

A man with a health condition that makes him superficially appear female is not a woman.

If CAIS is over represented in elite sports, then it is giving an advantage. That’s the bottom line, and nothing you say can change that or make it ok.

So some people should be allowed to compete in sporting classes they are not eligible for because it’s not their fault and we (women) should #bekiiind?

It’s not any man’s fault that he’s a man so let’s let them compete so they aren’t excluded and get hurty feelz?

Why? Why is a male with a VSD not a male? What sex is he then? Can’t be female otherwise he would not have CAIS, so if you don’t believe he’s male, what sex is he?

In response to someone else proposing that the ability to go through menstrual cycles will have to be taken into account, not the presence of periods.