Views on androgen insensitivity and women’s sport participation

Explain to me why I should accept your definition of the sex of people with CAIS rather than that of the NHS or Prof Robert Winston

Ummm…..

Genes usually seen in males with genitals that look the same as most girls' and some internal male structures
So males then….

Not according to the NHS

Here's the link.

You may also want to look up how Prof Robert Winston says sex should be determined. He says that SRY gene plus functional testosterone receptors is male and everyone else is female. Hes an expert in human sex and reproduction as well as being a sex realist

.https://www.nhs.uk/conditions/differences-in-sex-development/

Because CAIS is only found in males. As has been explained often.

Unfortunately for your argument, it remains a fact only males can have CAIS or PAIS. So this person is not female. Apart from being female, how can one be a woman?

Do you have a link for that NHS quote please?

I did search for it but I couldn't find it.

Thank you

They are not female. There is no such medical consensus let alone scientific one. At most doctors may agree to ‘treat as though they are female’ but you only need to look at the various maternity scandals to see what the medical profession think of women.

Why do you disagree with the medical consensus that people with CAIS are female?

Men with medical conditions are still men.

They also lack that ability to process the testosterone. Having a male testosterone level means nothing if you cannot utilise that testosterone.

The person in the Instagram reel has said three important things - they have internal testes, they produce male levels of testosterone, they have XY chromosomes.
If they play sports, then they should be playing in the male category.

Yes it is. Not part of the women league.

I do think CAIS should be treated an exception on many fronts but if female sport is to be one of those exceptions it has to be closely monitored with the understanding that if the result of that monitoring is an over representation that it's means there is some degree on advantage and therefore the exception can no longer apply.

It is sad that talented athletes have to drop their dream if they suffer injury or become ill in a way that impacts their performance.

It is sad that people of a certain physical type will never excell at certain sports e.g. an average height man won't become a basketball star.

But either sport is fair or we do away with any ranking and give everyone a medal for turning up.

superficial means at a surface level. If externally they resemble women but internally are male then they are men who superficially resemble women.

Quite a few posters on this thread are insistent that a person with CAIS is male but this is not the medical consensus. The NHS says the following

Complete insensitivity to androgens makes a person with XY chromosomes female. Partial insensitivity to androgens can mean that some people are male and others are female.

I've seen various discussions about the studies that show CAIS is over represented in sports and there is some doubt about whether the studies correctly distinguished between CAIS and PAIS which may mean that it's PAIS and not CAIS that is over represented. (The discussions were between sex realist biologists including Emma Hilton )

In relation to sports its the difficulty in distinguishing CAIS and PAIS that is a problem. I suspect that the people who used to scout for 5ard males to compete in women's sport have already started to look for PAIS males hoping to have them classified as CAIS.

It is not ‘nuance’ to demand men be allowed to destroy women’s sports.

How do you account for their over representation then?

And the video you linked says that removing the testes is outdated and shouldn’t be done until there’s a clear need.

I understand your empathy, but don’t think it should allow men to compete in women’s sports.

what about men who have superficial resemblance to women

still No