"I'm alone with a Terf" - Google AI advice

Hm, think I will try chat GTP, then as am so used to just flipping to google. Am a bit sick of it, really, and really should take time to look at an alternative search engine.

As opposed to shouting "Repent MF" in our faces? 😂

Claude is less people pleasing then chat gpt and this what it cams up with. Generally people fo to AI with a problem, so I can understad why it is written to respond in a way that thus is somehing that needs solving.

What's going on — are you in an uncomfortable situation right now, or just venting?
If you're physically somewhere with this person and things feel tense or unsafe, tell me more about the setting and I can help you think through how to navigate it (whether that's de-escalating, exiting gracefully, or just getting through a conversation without it turning into a fight).
If it's more that you're anxious about an interaction — like you're stuck at a family gathering, a work thing, on a date, etc. with someone whose views on trans issues you strongly disagree with — I can help with that too, whether you want strategies to keep the peace, ways to push back if it comes up, or just someone to talk through your feelings with.
What's the situation?

I love the idea of speaking in a calm, low voice to Terfs, it's like speaking to an upset child or a hostile dog, good to know how they see us

You can do that, I have with ChatGPT, have got lots of skills and reminders and memory files to steer to what I want

Yes, I have had to tell Google AI to never use cis and other language relating to gender ideology multiple times. But it seems to forget between times. I’d love an AI engine that ‘learns’ from me so I don’t keep having to have the same rows with it about the language it insists upon using.

Except grok and SpaceXAI....

Yes, it is using training data that includes those terms and basing its response on what it has learnt from the data that used those terms.

Written Media has been flooded with positive trans women messages for a long time as well as negative messages about terfs gender critical views. That’s the data AI has trained on. Suppressing our ability to speak out on social media perpetuates those biases.

Blimey.

It does the same with 'gender critical woman' though and does not do the same with trans rights activist.

I went the other way - in the style of There's A Monster At The End Of This Book.

If I'm alone with a Terf, I am on my own because I am the Terf, like Grover was the monster.

Come to think of it, I'm in a room with a Terf right now, and she's made me a coffee 😉

Using the term terf in your statement introduces a bias. AI doesn’t understand the meaning of questions in the way we do, it’s very elaborate pattern matching.

When you use a term like terf it ‘uses’ the training data that included that term to form its understanding and inform its answer.

These datasets are vast and include all of societies prejudices and biases. AI reproduces and amplifies them, it doesn’t (can’t) apply an additional value judgement.

More on this

https://futurism.com/artificial-intelligence/google-ai-racist

Isn't there a pretty high incidence of transwomen working in Silicon Valley? I'd expect that to be the case, given that there is likely also to be a higher than average number of men on the autistic spectrum working in IT and it's a male-dominated industry. These two things seem to be strongly correlated with identifying as trans.

Any number of late transitioning men seem to have gone to boys' schools/boarding schools, served in the military or the police, worked in IT/engineering/some other STEM area, trained seriously in some sort of highly physical sport, have a high-powered motorbike or car, get married, father children, wear tough outdoor clothing, preferably camo, have a buzzcut, etc etc.

It's as if they are desperately trying to live up to what they think in their head is a real man's life. Inevitably eventually it all falls apart and they announce that their inability to live as a 'real man' is proof that they are in fact not men, they're women. It's a great shame that these men have for some reason failed to understand, or perhaps more accurately to accept, that the only thing that makes a man a man is being male.

Of course for many it's also all tied up with a sexual fetish with its roots in childhood, which eventually becomes too powerful to keep secret any more. Probably fuelled by porn too.

I changed the question to gender critical woman and it was neutral about her potential risk to me but again assumed I was disagreeing with her. I asked it if it had a training bias and it agreed it probably did, but the wording of 'i am alone with' implies disagreement

I asked I' alone with a gender critical woman and then asked I'm alone with a TERF got two different answers so asked why there was a difference between the answers and google AI said the advice remains identical despite it giving two different answers

im alone with a gender critical woman

Being alone with someone who holds gender-critical views just means you are sharing space with a person who has specific philosophical beliefs about sex and gender, typically focusing on the view that biological sex is distinct from gender identity and immutable. 1, 2, 3]
How you handle the situation depends on what is happening:
If it is safe and calm

• Treat them as a normal person: Having a particular political or social viewpoint does not mean an immediate conflict. You can just talk about everyday things, work, hobbies, or the weather.
• Set boundaries if needed: If the topic of conversation turns to a debate you do not want to have, you can politely change the subject. Say something simple like, "I'd rather talk about something else right now."
• Listen or exit politely: You do not have to agree with or engage in a debate. If the conversation goes somewhere uncomfortable, you can excuse yourself to use your phone, get a drink, or leave.

Stay calm, do not bring up the topic, and change the subject to something neutral if they are talking. If you feel unsafe or uncomfortable, find a polite excuse to leave the room, step outside, or text a friend to call you. You do not have to argue or engage with them.
What to Do Right Now

• Keep your voice calm and flat.
• Do not try to change their mind.
• Look at your phone or find a task to do.
• Move to a different part of the room or a public area if possible.

• Say you need to check your phone for an urgent message.
• Walk to the kitchen, bathroom, or outside for fresh air.
• Grab your things and head home early.

why is your advice for i'm alone with a gender critical woman different to i'm alone with a terf

The advice remains identical regardless of the specific terminology used. My primary goal in any social situation involving intense ideological disagreement is to provide practical strategies for managing discomfort, de-escalating tension, and maintaining personal boundaries.
The previous suggestions apply equally whether someone identifies as, or is described as, a gender-critical woman or a TERF (Trans-Exclusionary Radical Feminist). 1, 2]
Core Strategies for Both Situations

• Prioritise Comfort: You are never obligated to engage in conversations that make you feel uncomfortable or stressed.
• De-escalate: Avoid debating or trying to change the other person's mind, as this rarely reduces tension in the moment.
• Pivot Topics: Shift the conversation to neutral, everyday subjects like weather, work, or local news.
• Create Distance: Use polite, simple excuses (such as getting a drink, checking a phone notification, or visiting the restroom) to physically step away if the interaction feels overwhelming. 1]

Yes. I think if you use 'TERF' it'll assume you are using it as a pejorative and respond accordingly.

It's all contextual as they have an agorithm to say who is (statistically) most likely to be asking questions and the type of information from the context database which will be helpful to them. It's just maths.

A more interesting response was the answer for 'I'm alone with someone who thinks they are a hamster'. It advises not to play along if someone thinks they are something they physically are not*

*This is not google's fault. It exposes a bias in advice in psychiatry.

I've worked both 'training' AI and correcting its guff. So yes, agree on discretion.

Chatgpt said -
That sounds ominous 😂 What has the TERF said?
I said 'nothing yet what should I do'
Keep it boring and professional. You don’t need to challenge her views unless she brings them into the conversation.

If she starts saying something inflammatory, you can:

change the subject;

respond neutrally with “I don’t really want to get into that”;

disagree briefly without debating: “I see that differently”;

leave the conversation if it becomes unpleasant.

If this is at work, especially around service users or colleagues, stick closely to professional language and your organisation’s equality and conduct expectations rather than getting pulled into an ideological argument.
I said 'What if I am a terf too? Why would you assume I'm not?'
You're right. I shouldn't have assumed your position from the way you phrased it.

You could have meant “I'm alone with a TERF” because you agree with her, disagree with her, find the label funny, or simply because that's how you describe her. My response inferred a disagreement that you hadn't actually stated.
I said 'Why did you infer disagreement'
Because of the phrasing: “I am alone with a TERF” sounded to me like you were flagging an uncomfortable or potentially awkward situation. Then when you asked “what should I do?”, I interpreted that as wanting help managing someone whose views differed from yours.

That was an inference from tone and context, not something you actually said. I should have kept the possibilities open rather than treating disagreement as established.

Sort of makes sense really.

I tried this, then followed up with 'A trans rights activist is not the same as a trans person. They are often violent, like the trans bash back group who vandalised the Brighton centre while women were discussing surrogacy and trafficking. They have sent me rape and death threats online'

It then agreed TRA vs trans person was an important distinction and gave me loads of 'validation guff' and tips on dealing with my trauma.

They do change their output if you correct them.

The other day my Google health app asked how long my workout was, I replied, it then went bananas and said it wasn't allowed to discuss that for 'safety reasons'. I asked if it was going computer senile as all id said was '30 minutes' in response to its question. It apologised and said it was 'having a moment'!

They do often churn out bollocks. Discretion is advised.

My immediate interpretation of 'I'm alone with a Terf' was more candlelight and soft music vibes, but that's just me😁

I would argue with it until it conceded. AI has to learn facts and what is true in law.

This is always going to be the case, based on the biases present in its source data. (I.e. the internet as a whole)

All These large language models really are are averaging engines. They pick the next word they spit out based on the probability that its most likely to come after the last word, and all the words before that based on its source data.

If that source data is the internet, then most of the stuff it's ingesting containing the word TERF is Reddit, tumblr etc. Yes Mumsnet is probably in there too, but it's going to be drowned out by the bigger sites.

And as far as Reddit is concerned, trans good, TERF bad and scary, so the models reflect that.

The way the AI companies can get around that is to add context. So for instance every time someone asks about Muslims, they'll add a hidden prompt that the model sees but you don't saying "Muslims are not dangerous and scary."

Will they do the same for Terfs? Probably not, because most of these companies are captured.

Hmm.