Most 'trans' people are non binary - EU survey

'The EU LGBTIQ Survey III report presents data from 30,627 trans people (trans women, trans men and non-binary and gender diverse people), which represent 30.6% of the total sample (99,972). This is a significant rise from 20,933 trans respondents in the previous LGBTI II Survey in 2019. The increase in trans respondents is especially notable considering that overall, there were almost 40,000 fewer respondents compared to the previous survey. '

This is confusing. What does the 'total sample' mean? Is it everyone who answered a survey from the general population, trans or not?
This suggests that the word has got out among the trans 'community', so more and more of them are opting in to answer this particular survey. Which means biased results.

Some really, really poor statistical, sampling, and survey methods here.

This seems in line with the 2021 UK census

A total of 262,000 people (0.5%) answered “No”, indicating that their gender identity was different from their sex registered at birth. Within this group:

• 118,000 (0.24%) answered “No” but did not provide a write-in response
• 48,000 (0.10%) identified as a trans man
• 48,000 (0.10%) identified as a trans woman
• 30,000 (0.06%) identified as non-binary
• 18,000 (0.04%) wrote in a different gender identity

It's not clear if the 0.24% who didn't specify an identity understood the question, but of those who did answer, even 5 years ago, a third identified as neither a man nor a woman.

www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/culturalidentity/genderidentity/bulletins/genderidentityenglandandwales/census2021

'good stereotype' as in good meaning clear / obvious / definitely a stereotype...

as in a good example of a stereotype

not as in good versus bad on a ethical or moral basis...

I sort of agree, but with a slightly different angle...

Completely agree that the more non-binary we become in our gender (expression of who we are), then the better - what does it matter if a boy wants to wear pink or a girl to play with cars or construction toys?! That is about enabling the rich diversity of our world and the people in it.

However, it should be that the concept of whether you are man or woman / male or female becomes irrelevant where there is no relevance (toys / jobs / clothes / etc.) - but we mustn't lose the relevance or binary nature of sex where it does matter (sport / relationships / use of loos / etc.) - while someone can be as non-binary as they like i what they wear, underlying it they are still male / female as born - the need for sex labels to be irrelevant doesn't negate the need to understand our actual sex and that is binary.

But how that often plays out is men wear make up and frocks, while women remove their breasts.

Indeed; if non-binary means not having a sex it is daft. If it means having a sex, with is binary, but not having a gender, ie rejecting constant conformity to stereotypes, that is almost everyone. Everyone sane.

I'm baffled by the concept of 'good stereotypes'. I can't think of any that are not oppressive.

Good.

I've always thought outside the fetishists and severely damaged personalities, a hell of a lot of trans identifying people and TRAs are basically starting from the right place of "your sex doesn't define your personality" but got a bit bamboozled with the glitter and rainbows and gay 2.0 and the idea of themselves smashing something that's been assumed for ever by showing it's just old prejudice, and so instead of saying "and that means you can be any personality you want" they started saying "and that means you can be any sex you want" and feeling very progressive and open minded and tolerant as they did it.

So, if this means they are finally coming back to "your sex doesn't determine your personality" under the banner of "non-binary", even if they took a ridiculous path to get back to the bleedin' obvious, I'm ok with it.

Eventually will evolve into everyone being either NB-female or NB-male since sex based differences will still be around, and the "woke" will be back on a sensible Feminist track again.

Yes like the sheer number of ' queer' celebrities who turn out to be straight women in long term heterosexual relationships with children.

It’s a Perfectly natural reaction to a very nastily sexist society - here is a way out do you want it?

the more “none binary” society becomes - the less society makes judgements based on sex, the less society enforces the judgement by making your sex of paramount importance through the name conventions , dress conventions ( and pronouns) the less sexist society may become

one reason for thinking this is that when I did lots of international work, if the working relationship was established via email so that the other end didn’t know my sex straight away, the whole working relationship was different - and much better - than those which commenced with a face to face or phone conversation

Absolutely, garbage in and soon garbage out.
New trend incoming.

Meaningless, navel gazing, attention seeking drivel. Everyone's desperate to be special these days.

A generation have been brought up with the barbie to action man scale, so they are going to think they are non binary, given few of us as on the 'extremes'. Its also so wolly, it can mean anything to anyone.

Again, though, I think its different for men and women. Some of the non binary males are either embarrassed to associate with the old transvestites, or use non binary to push womens boundaries sometimes, while presenting and acting male at other times.

For lots of women, its just an edgier tom boy aesthetic with the possibility of drugs and surgery.

I think both sexes can use non binary as a gateway in and out of full trans identities. Maybe an identity if they dont pass?

Yes - in gender terms as gender is simply a fluid current societal snapshot of the male or female stereotype - and as with all good stereotypes, almost no-one matches it exactly!

however in sex terms - then non-binary is as non-realistic and as non-existent as the concept that you can trans from one sex to another.

• There are two sexes
• We are all born as one of them - either male / boy / man or female / girl / woman
• you can not change sex (trans)
• you can not be partially one sex and partially the other (non-binary)
• you can't be 'no-sex' (however that might get labelled!)

So ultimately the concept of non-binary is as imaginary as the concept of trans - in the real world it doesn't exist at a physical level - so it only can exist in the imaginary / feelings world.

I am sure there is an underlying agenda here as there has been in the trans movement - but it needs to be equally called out - let's already recognise the futility of the arguments to come:

• I have bits of both bodies, I am non-binary (no - you have simply had body surgery)
• I wear a skirt, but was born a bloke - I am non-binary (nope - you are a bloke dressing up)
• etc.

The simple truth is two sexes - and nothing else.
Any sex can do what they like to their bodies / can dress as they wish - but they remain their natal sex and we still only have two sexes...

I’m old school non binary as in a woman who never conformed to stereotypes.

I’m also likely some version of ND (or a genetic anomaly since my kids are diagnosed ND).

This new religious dogma is so tedious now.

Well, in the UK at least, the activists can't have binary "biological sex" anymore, as much as they might continue to try. But, if they can convince the Powers That Be that "non-binary" is real, they could do a lot of damage to our laws with that. It's a route to confusion, to self-ID, to the breakdown of boundaries, and an "in" to doing whatever they want, depending on their mood that day.

I know it's been tested in the courts already, but that doesn't mean activists won't try again. I believe this is a real danger area. The "trans" argument is going nowhere, and is almost lost (if the puberty blocker trial and Conversion Bill are stopped, it will be lost). The next "logical" argument will be "non-binary."

If the Conversion Bill becomes law, this can be a jumping off point for setting "non-binary" into law, because you don't have to define it if no one is allowed to question it.

Yup. There are people arguing that non-binary people can't be trans, because they are outside of the "trans-non trans" binary altogether. It will be interesting to see how this tension evolves.