Trans man Freddy McConnell's challenge to be named as father on birth certificate deemed inadmissible by the ECHR

Dear Freddy’s child. Thank you to you and your advocate who confirmed women who give birth are and only ever can be mothers.

A mother is a powerful thing and I’m glad you have one (even if her wishes don’t always align with yours).

Erasure of mothers from the lexicon esp in maternity services serves to degrade women further. Thank you for holding that line.

Yes, I’m a bit puzzled by this birth certificate thing, especially in days of increased terrorism and the need to trace offenders across countries, sometimes.

Birth certificates seem to be regarded as some sort of award or subjective accolade. They’re a necessity, surely , for keeping track of citizenship, benefit entitlements, authentication of who someone is in respective their own marriages and that are their children, verification for airline travel and so on. I’d be interested to know what genealogists think of all this.

I noticed that someone on the Reddit link that was provided said that they were adopted and couldn’t get their original birth certificate, which is simply not true.

Like many of the wins it takes a while to settle in. 😊

I am curious to see how this will all play out in countries in the EU.

Hats off to Freddy then. 🥳😂

We should have a TERF Island Ally award to give her. 🏆

Yes this is a HUGE win for our side. Not appreciated enough so far.

Birth certs should clearly record bio parents (when known) and have capacity for others taking on official parental roles too. But nobody should be recorded as bio parent if they aren't.

Once again this is being presented as an entirely emotively based process - while disregarding the very practical issues birth certs and records need to address.

Society cannot be run according to feelings and vibes alone.

Exactly. Thanks are due to Freddy for effectively putting the theory that the ECHR would have anything to say about the SC judgment and UK law on the matters to bed.

Thanks for the link, it sounds like the ECHR has decided it's up to the UK to decide on these things, and the ECHR doesn't have the power to instruct them otherwise. Which means anyone else who's trying to circumvent the legal rulings of the UK isn't going to have any luck with the ECHR. Good 😁

I can't believe that. McConnell had to come off testosterone whilst trying to get pregnant and then whilst being pregnant the first time. And also becoming pregnant in the first instance was not that easy or without much effort, as far as I can recall.

It always reminds me of the Duchess of Plaza Toro's song in The Gondoliers.

'Progenitor' is an absolutely awful term.

A mother has automatic parental responsibility for her child.

Without this, there would be no one with PR for the child until a birth certificate is issued.

In Scotland, the certificate says "mother", and "father or parent" (well it does now) which I think is a better way to allow for lesbian couples to register the birth together.
editing to add it's a different process for male same sex couples

Linking to a Spanish document isn't vastly helpful to me!
The certificate might be labelled progenitor A and B, but what are the guidelines for whose names can go on the birth certificate - are they saying it doesn't have to be the actual birth parents of the baby?
You've suggested not, by saying it helps same sex parents

And is Progenitor A always the small-gamete person, and Progenitor B always the large-gamete person?

Because if a. that's correct, then it's always going to be possible to identify the trans parent(s), and b. if it's not, then that's going to make genealogical research a whole lot more difficult.

You may not have noticed, but I assure you, people do give a toss. They find it insulting and have complained to the Civil Registry.

https://www.boe.es/buscar/doc.php?id=BOE-A-2006-3764

There's the official communication from the BOE. See Article 4.

I'm just saying that we don't write gender based titles for the parents on birth certificates anymore. It changed years ago.

Used to say Padre - John, Madre - Lucy now says Progenitor A - John Progenitor B - Lucy.

Problem solved. Haven't noticed anyone giving a toss either.

Agreed.

Excellent news all round.

As if we needed further proof, but here’s yet more in support of this weird men’s rights movement

This is the margin of appreciation. It’s narrow or wide depending on the impact on others human rights.

Recent case law says margin of appreciation is narrow where the state makes ‘transition’ dependent on surgical castration or sterilization. I agree with that.

But you can’t force states to allow trans people to do whatever they want because they want to. Wide margin of appreciation in many instances.

I have no doubt Freddy was similarly gaslighted and encouraged to entertain a delusion, and that being reminded of the biological truth must hurt.

I think it’s more likely Freddy was the one doing the gaslighting.

Although she doesn’t seem very bright. She had a mastectomy at 27 then claimed she had no idea that meant she wouldn’t be able to breastfeed after she gave birth.

Hilarious line ‘the woman stored frozen sperm’ ….. 🤣 worlds gone mad! Does even say trans woman which would be the correct sentence instead of biological male which is also correct.

How does that help? It's not accurate to put both members of a same sex marriage down as the two progenitors. They can't be.

Can you expand on this?

You have misunderstood.

The parents' dates and places of birth and nationalities and grandparents' names are on the birth certificate, obviously.

But instead of saying Father - John, Mother - Lucy they say Progenitor A - John, Progenitor B - Lucy. Or Progenitor A -John Progenitor B - Diego or Progenitor A - Maria Progenitor B - Lucy. So there is no issue for trans people or same sex partners.

Also Spanish kids have both parents' surnames, always.