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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Guardian: weaponised emotional blackmail from 14yo 'trans' athlete

589 replies

teawamutu · 17/06/2026 17:40

The Guardian's rearguard action on reality continues. Apparently the problem is not the parents and authorities who conspired to lie to this boy, coddle his delusions, disadvantage all girls around him in the service of his own wishful thinking etc etc etc: it's definitely the people who pointed it out:
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2026/jun/17/trans-athlete-no-one-should-face-vicious-attacks

I am prepared to feel a little sorry for the kid, who couldn't have been exposed like this if the useful idiots around him had done their fucking jobs. But the Grauniad can fuck off with the tired 'beee kiiiind' shit as a solution. Been there, binned the t-shirt. We want our shit back.

I’m a 14-year-old trans athlete. No one should face the vicious attacks I have faced | Lina Haaga

People understand gender differently, and I was taught to respect all ideas. But the vitriol I recently experienced was not a healthy debate

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2026/jun/17/trans-athlete-no-one-should-face-vicious-attacks

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spannasaurus · 18/06/2026 20:28

I read a post on x recently where someone was pointing out that the coaches and trainers of boys competing in girls sports benefit from the situation. They can put their successes in training these "winners" and "record breakers" on their CVs to make them look more impressive and get more prestigious jobs

Seethlaw · 18/06/2026 20:24

EvieBB · 18/06/2026 20:12

But the Catholic Church would say otherwise....that it's not real and that you are simply choosing to be gay. Which of course is ridiculous...
The point I'm trying to make is that one could argue that you guys saying that being trans isn't real is similar to the Catholic Church saying that being gay is a choice.

Okay. And? Two things being similar doesn't mean they are actually the same. For starters, the Catholic Church and GC women have very different aims: one has historically fought to oppress women while the others want to liberate them. This fundamental difference necessarily impacts their respective relationship to gay and trans people.

FlirtsWithRhinos · 18/06/2026 20:21

EvieBB · 18/06/2026 20:16

Yes of course I know this :)

So why the shock at the idea that immersing yourself in a particular ideological framework would change how your mind works?

FlirtsWithRhinos · 18/06/2026 20:19

EvieBB · 18/06/2026 20:12

But the Catholic Church would say otherwise....that it's not real and that you are simply choosing to be gay. Which of course is ridiculous...
The point I'm trying to make is that one could argue that you guys saying that being trans isn't real is similar to the Catholic Church saying that being gay is a choice.

Or we could say that you saying of course trans identies are real is like the Catholic Church arguing that of course the wine really turns to blood even if to all intents and purposes it appears to still be just, well, wine.

The only reason you think transition is real and transubstantiation is not is because you've been immersed in the Genderists' ideological framework not the Catholics'.

EvieBB · 18/06/2026 20:16

FlirtsWithRhinos · 18/06/2026 20:14

You... you do know that learning does change your brain over time, right? That your thought patterns and the skills you use most often literally rewire your brain?

Yes of course I know this :)

FlirtsWithRhinos · 18/06/2026 20:14

EvieBB · 18/06/2026 19:55

I obviously misunderstood what he was trying to say......I thought that's what he was saying....that "if you immerse yourself in alternative ideas you can change your brain over time"

You... you do know that learning does change your brain over time, right? That your thought patterns and the skills you use most often literally rewire your brain?

EvieBB · 18/06/2026 20:12

Seethlaw · 18/06/2026 19:56

Unlike trans people, there have been gay people all over the world, throughout history, in every culture, even the most homophobic ones. So clearly, it's not a learned behaviour.

But the Catholic Church would say otherwise....that it's not real and that you are simply choosing to be gay. Which of course is ridiculous...
The point I'm trying to make is that one could argue that you guys saying that being trans isn't real is similar to the Catholic Church saying that being gay is a choice.

EvieBB · 18/06/2026 20:09

SDTGisAnEvilWolefGenius · 18/06/2026 19:35

Utter nonsense.

Your opinion

FlirtsWithRhinos · 18/06/2026 20:08

EvieBB · 18/06/2026 19:38

Catholic ideology says that being gay is not real - it is learned behaviour....just like you're saying with regards to being trans.

Sigh.

Some behaviours are learned.

Some are not.

Being gay is innate.
Being a Catholic is learned behaviour.

Nevertheless, people have been imprisoned and even killed for being Catholic as well as being gay.

So there is no reason to assume that just because being gay is innate, being trans is also innate. It might be more like being Catholic.

And since you brought it up...

The reality of being gay just means fancying the same sex. There's no gap between feeling the thing and being the thing.

For "trans" to be a real thing not just a feeling, it doesn't just mean the trans person feels what they feel, it means that the sex of every single human also has to be redefined as a state of mind rather tha body. Which is clearly not reasonable and doesn't accurately describe reality, for the very simple and obvious reason that we do actually have physical sexes, including the trans person. So whatever they think they are feeling, they are not in fact being the opposite sex.

Seethlaw · 18/06/2026 20:02

EvieBB · 18/06/2026 19:35

No idea. Perhaps an embryonic development glitch in development in womb? Brain flooded with the "wrong" hormone causing a mind - body disconnect. Just a theory of course.

Let's say you're right. Let's say transidentity has a biological origin of some kind.

Now what?

What would it change, in your eyes?

LeungLover · 18/06/2026 19:59

EvieBB · 18/06/2026 19:35

No idea. Perhaps an embryonic development glitch in development in womb? Brain flooded with the "wrong" hormone causing a mind - body disconnect. Just a theory of course.

But how do any of those things lead to someone “being born in the wrong body”? You can’t be born in the wrong body because your body is the only one you were ever goi f to have.

Anyway, since there’s absolutely no evidence of any of that happening, it’s pointless speculating and we can’t make any decisions based on maybes.

GriseldaandMike · 18/06/2026 19:57

EvieBB · 18/06/2026 19:38

Catholic ideology says that being gay is not real - it is learned behaviour....just like you're saying with regards to being trans.

We can observe 'gayness' it can be seen in the brain, in eye dilation and other aaah hem signs of arousal there is nothing that allows us to observe 'transness' despite the claims of lady brain or other sex hormonal spikes in utero nothing recordable has been found. Probably because the factors driving teenage girls are very different to those motivating middle aged men.

Seethlaw · 18/06/2026 19:56

EvieBB · 18/06/2026 19:38

Catholic ideology says that being gay is not real - it is learned behaviour....just like you're saying with regards to being trans.

Unlike trans people, there have been gay people all over the world, throughout history, in every culture, even the most homophobic ones. So clearly, it's not a learned behaviour.

EvieBB · 18/06/2026 19:55

spannasaurus · 18/06/2026 18:43

What part of that post suggests that Red thinks that you can change a person's sexual orientation ?

I obviously misunderstood what he was trying to say......I thought that's what he was saying....that "if you immerse yourself in alternative ideas you can change your brain over time"

EvieBB · 18/06/2026 19:38

FlirtsWithRhinos · 18/06/2026 18:44

Why the fuck would you think that?

She's talking about ideological radicalisation, not sexuality!

You do know human brains can learn new things, right?

What you said is like being told someone can be taught to draw or be good at maths and replying "on that principle I presume you believe you can turn a straight person gay, or vice versa?" 😂😂😂

Catholic ideology says that being gay is not real - it is learned behaviour....just like you're saying with regards to being trans.

EvieBB · 18/06/2026 19:35

FlirtsWithRhinos · 18/06/2026 18:44

Why the fuck would you think that?

She's talking about ideological radicalisation, not sexuality!

You do know human brains can learn new things, right?

What you said is like being told someone can be taught to draw or be good at maths and replying "on that principle I presume you believe you can turn a straight person gay, or vice versa?" 😂😂😂

I thought that's what you were saying!! 😂

SDTGisAnEvilWolefGenius · 18/06/2026 19:35

Utter nonsense.

EvieBB · 18/06/2026 19:35

LeungLover · 18/06/2026 14:49

Explain to us how anyone can be born trans then. How does that work?

No idea. Perhaps an embryonic development glitch in development in womb? Brain flooded with the "wrong" hormone causing a mind - body disconnect. Just a theory of course.

Ereshkigalangcleg · 18/06/2026 18:56

RapidOnsetGenderCritic · 18/06/2026 17:29

What if they haven't been convicted? Given the very low conviction rates, there must be a lot of rapists who haven't been convicted. Is it fine for them to be given free access to women's spaces? We don't know who they are, so we can't keep just them out. Better to keep all men out and be sure.

And after release, given that many rapists are free after a few years. Are they allowed to use the ladies then? Don’t see any problem there at all! /s

FlirtsWithRhinos · 18/06/2026 18:44

EvieBB · 18/06/2026 18:40

So, on that principle I presume you believe you can turn a straight person gay, or vice versa?

Why the fuck would you think that?

She's talking about ideological radicalisation, not sexuality!

You do know human brains can learn new things, right?

What you said is like being told someone can be taught to draw or be good at maths and replying "on that principle I presume you believe you can turn a straight person gay, or vice versa?" 😂😂😂

spannasaurus · 18/06/2026 18:43

EvieBB · 18/06/2026 18:40

So, on that principle I presume you believe you can turn a straight person gay, or vice versa?

What part of that post suggests that Red thinks that you can change a person's sexual orientation ?

EvieBB · 18/06/2026 18:40

RedToothBrush · 18/06/2026 13:43

Re female brains.

No there's nothing that has actually shown the female brain in research.

What they have found is the 'extremist brain' and how deradicalisation can change this. So if you are immersed in an ideology it affects your cognitive abilities and it stops you from thinking. You don't question. When exposed to alternative ideas this changes the brain over time and you can retrain it to look like a 'normal' brain.

This is utterly fascinating in the context of affirmation only approaches, deliberately attempts to have no debate and trans echo chambers online.

I've posted about this at length on MN before so a quick search will bring up this research if you are genuinely interested in the concept of brains.

So, on that principle I presume you believe you can turn a straight person gay, or vice versa?

IrnBruAndDietCoke · 18/06/2026 18:04

RedToothBrush · 18/06/2026 17:10

Conspiracy theory isn't real life.

Indeed.

But think about this too.

When my brother came out as trans, he quoted that trans people accounted for 1 in 10000. So by this, I probably should never meet another trans person.

And yet. One of my friends whose brother was in the same class as him at school had also come out as trans and they knew another kid in the year below who also had come out as trans.

This made no sense. If it was like being gay, then it would be spontaneous throughout the population and wouldnt be in the same social circles.

And even if this was an issue with acceptance being possible in our social circle but not others, there were anomalies with this as a theory.

First it's the uniform politics. For something that's theoretically just a blip in nature what we see is a particular political clustering that's not natural.

And then we have uniform hobbies and interests with an exceptional high level of people who are trans having an anime or gaming hobby. This is unrepresentative of the population as a whole.

Then you have various issues like in girls the disappearing anorexic - there has been a decline in anorexia presentation just as presentation in being trans has taken off. Anorexia isn't purely an eating disorder - it's a type of dsyphoria and is associated with issues over control. The cohort is remarkably similar in social backgrounds too. Again this doesn't suggest this is a spontaneous fault with the body and brain not being aligned.

It looks like a response to social triggers and to social movements in multiple ways.

From doing family history it's become apparent to me that cousins often move in similar social circles even if they don't have overlap of those circles because their parents are of a certain background. So actually a cousin being trans isn't that odd IF it's driven by social influence or a genetic anomaly. But then that anomaly would ultimately be identifiable in time. But having a cousin being trans is odd IF it's a phenomena driven by spontaneous presentation.

With this in mind we have to start to ask questions about it. This isn't a conspiracy. This is natural curiosity about understanding what it is to be trans and perhaps why A is trans but B - Z are not trans.

The Tavistock identified MASSIVE over representation of autistic, gay kids, sexually abused kids and kids who have a family breakdown and parents who were pushing this on to their kids for their own beliefs and reasons. These kids across the board had complex home lives and various issues. These observations most definitely do matter and most definitely merit questions. A couple of these are particularly concerning observations.

These are not conspiracy questions. These are questions we would ask with another other number of difficulties at school age and the reason we ask these questions isn't to harm kids - it's precisely to do the opposite.

The fact you aren't remotely curious and seek to actively shut down these legitimate questions is the concerning part ESPECIALLY since you have a child who identifies as trans.

This isn't about 'fixing' a child.

This lack of curiosity and the desire to silence in the context of the Tavistock whistleblowing is alarming. What if a set of cousins identifying as trans have a common family member who has behaved inappropriately with them? We know family members cover up and hide for other family members. We know they go into denial. I not saying this is the case for your family, but your lack of curiosity and desire to silence the conversation, in this context does raise eyebrows. There are certainly families this dynamic may well be highly relevant to.

However you cut it, given the prevalence of trans people in the population as a whole a couple of cousins coming out at a similar time but without contact isn't necessarily the 'oh well it's not a social contagion' claim you think.

The cousins WERE exposed to the social media trends of the time either directly or indirectly. They WERE exposed to similar messaging within schools thanks to stonewall. Even if they weren't talking to each other.

Being trans is a product of its time and wouldn't have been possible in the past because the conditions were not right - again not spontaneous. And this is also why we have desperate attempts to claim historical figures as trans - because this isn't about the past it's about legitimising the present. Again another sign of a political and ideological movement driven by propaganda rather than a spontaneous phenomena.

And again this lack of curiosity would be something that is considered a threat if this were the reality.

I don't claim to have answers but the authoritarian nature of the debate on this subject and the need to shut down discussion isn't indicative of a naturally occurring phenomena. This is the action of a group who are behaving in a way that raises questions and is extremely hostile to those questions. A that's the red flag.

We should identify and examine all red flags even if these red flags turn out to be unfounded. A lack of curiosity around red flags, is a red flag in itself. And there are no exceptions to this.

I’ve been bobbing around FWR for several years (my current username arose from a conversation in the Sandie Peggie threads) and this is post just sums it up perfectly. I currently teach abroad in a country where SM, YouTube etc are banned and there are precisely zero trans children. Funny, that. If it was so innate and ‘ladybrain’ was a thing it would be bursting out of every country at equal rates regardless of how oppressed people were. Just like homosexuality bursts out even where it is banned.

loislovesstewie · 18/06/2026 17:41

SDTGisAnEvilWolefGenius · 18/06/2026 17:22

One of the things that annoys me about trans rights ideology, is its heavy reliance on deeply regressive stereotypes of masculinity and femininity.

I honestly thought we had finally achieved a society where girls could wear trousers, have short hair, love STEM subjects, ‘rough’ sports, and eschew pink, frills and make up, without anyone batting an eyelid. Now, that girl will be told she is clearly a boy in the wrong body, and, if unlucky, may be put onto a path of surgical mutilation, medical reliance and life long side effects and ill health. Her ability to enjoy sex will be taken from her, as will any chance of having children, if she wants to later on.

And the boy who likes dolls, make up, skirts, long hair and hates football and rolling round in the mud - he must be a girl in a boy’s body - give him puberty blockers that stop his development so that, even if he desists in the future, he will have a tiny, non functioning penis and no sexual feelings.

I saw a post - possibly on here or on FB - that said “A woman is someone with female biology and any character, not someone with any biology and a feminine character.”

Absolutely right. They seem to want to regress to a time where women wore pink etc. And I'm sick and tired of the Guardian which constantly wants to push the same old agenda.

RapidOnsetGenderCritic · 18/06/2026 17:29

DumpyVictoria · 17/06/2026 21:29

To be clear: Convicted rapists should not be locked up with female prisoners, in my view.

What if they haven't been convicted? Given the very low conviction rates, there must be a lot of rapists who haven't been convicted. Is it fine for them to be given free access to women's spaces? We don't know who they are, so we can't keep just them out. Better to keep all men out and be sure.

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