NHS staff to be banned from wearing political symbols

oops rant mind forgot to check so:

The idea that somehow gender critical politics is being to take hold in the UK, particularly the establishment is I am sorry to say just not true.

should be:

The idea that somehow gender critical politics is no longer taking hold in the UK, particularly the establishment, is I am sorry to say just not true.

I was going to start a rant thread about this.

I was only half listening when the new policy was being outlined on Radio 4 1pm news.

Then they interviewed an (ex) NHS Chief who said he thought this was right, particularly in relation to recent increase in anti semitism.

That a work place was about work and not a place to make political statements (I am paraphrasing).

Then (surprisingly the presenter - not sure who) asked so what about Rainbow symbols. And he said they were fine. They indicated that member of a group that is discriminated against is welcome and should feel safe. Just as a Black Lives matter badge would.

And, my rant, is not so much the policy, which may be clarified later, but this man - part of the NHS - so glibly saying wearing a rainbow was welcoming. The NHS that has made women employed by the NHS a living nightmare because the rainbow is in fact a symbol of male political oppression of women and their sex based rights.

WTF?!

The idea that somehow gender critical politics is being to take hold in the UK, particularly the establishment is I am sorry to say just not true.

They are so locked into the male dominated view of the world that everybody else should be listened to and accommodated - accept women.

Needless to say the BBC presenter didn't pick him up on this.

But the absolute conviction that his view of the value of the rainbow in the NHS, with everything that has been in the news, the court cases, etc., etc., and it is clear not one part of this had impinged on his complacent male superior brain view of the world.

Totally, utterly depressing.

I agree - I have no problem with a pure rainbow, whatever its purpose - it is the “progress” pride one that makes me nervous.

Somebody on another thread pointed out that the rainbow was worn by /represented healthcare workers during Covid, and at the time had no political significance, just the original biblical one of hope in the midst of crisis.

The poster said that it was still worn by some healthcare workers in remembrance of that, not as a LGBTQ+++++++++ symbol.

It's hard to know, isn't it? But at least when I see a healthcare worker wearing a rainbow lanyard, I can think that it might be a reminder of their dedication and courage during a global crisis.

The so-called 'Progress Flag', the one with all the extra bits in the hoist, on the other hand, is unequivocal.

Everyone I have heard asked the question today has said they don’t think Pride badges etc are political, so I don’t hold out much hope.

True, Red but it was an argument put forward by someone (I might not have been paying attention to who) in a radio interview this morning. He was more or less suggesting that the alphabet people are scared to access healthcare unless staff have a nice welcoming rainbow lanyard. As you can imagine, the host didn’t bother to suggest that the rainbows might make others feel unwelcome or unsafe.

If I dare make a prediction though, some corporate minded CEOs may try to bring in NHS or trust branded lanyards. At which point, I’m sure the unions will remember that lanyards are not good for infection control and suggest banning them completely.

We could all start saying "I feel very unsafe as a gay person around your rainbow lanyard, would you please not wear it around me?" and see how well that goes down. If trans-identified people are allowed to feel unsafe, then so should everyone else. Sexual orientation is a protected characteristic and so is my belief that I feel unsafe.

Good luck saying rainbows aren't political they are welcoming when you even have gay and lesbian people now saying they feel intimidated by it because it's become a political branded ideology rather than something welcoming.

I’m a cynical oldie, so I’m just hoping that
a) there isn’t a rainbows aren’t political they are welcoming campaign incoming.
b) we don’t have to wait a year for 95 pages of guidance.

That said, I will miss the quiet satisfaction of subverting the rainbow lanyard in my own way.

Asda is always the great reminder of why you still need due diligence when outsourcing.

That example is the one that really rams home the problem in a way that's tangable and makes people think wtf.

Does this mean fire engines can go back to being red and not rainbow coloured?!

Discussion on Radio 4 this lunchtime, and there seems to be a blind spot in terms of recognising that the Pride / Progress flag absolutely IS a political symbol. The lack of awareness is shocking. Unless it's a deliberate ploy, of course.

Trouble with removing the rainbow lanyard would be that the armed forces have one too. I am not sure how you would argue one is okay and the other isn't. My anti-fascist badge is staying put until I am told to remove it though.

I’m very pleased to hear this

Note that Northumbria police were told that pride flags etc were political symbols and banned from displaying them…

I'm not sure a lanyard contravenes these requirements. If it does, then the display of all religious iconography will also eventually be banished.

The ham sandwich example was absolutely ridiculous. There are plenty of other patients who would not want a ham sandwich either e.g. Muslims & vegetarians. Which is why patients don't just have ham sandwiches forced on them. Patients are offered a choice but refusing a ham sandwich doesn't immediately out you as Jewish (or Muslim or vegetarian).

Rather off-topic, I noticed when I dropped DD off at uni a few years ago that the students there to help and direct the newbies had all been given the pronouns talk. All these lovely young women were rushing about full of happiness and goodwill, and about half of them had badges with 'NAME she/her', as if I couldn't tell by bloody looking.

Not a single one of the lads (that I spotted, anyway) had bought into the bullshit.

The sooner this is crap is pulled from all our institutions, the better.

Why are you so surprised that a discussion about antisemitism is mostly about antisemitism? Isn't that just logical?
And don't you think that women experience antisemitism as well as men?

What is wrong with having a focus on a specific area - there's a lot of talk about failings in maternity services at the moment, but I haven't heard anybody complaing 'Yes but what about the rest of the NHS'?
Well, not yet anyway, but I'm sure somebody will🙄

Re The BBC Radio 4 interview this morning, of the male Peer who investigated antisemitism in NHS, by male interviewer. They were both oblivious of the possibility women exist.
Nothing happens unless it happens to real humans, i.e. men.

The interviewer did venture to ask about "Pride"
(N.B. Implicitly dismissing the existence of women, in the assumption, eagerly shared by the fellow man, that Pride and the rest of the alphabet must be some harmless club of fellow men, with a range of different bedroom choices)

The author of the report stated he was a member of the Labour party, but did not think wearing political badges was appropriate in a work setting. The words "badge" and "political" and "antisemitic" were a fixation.

No other discrimination could happen to him, therefore no other discrimination mattered, or even existed.

He concluded that because Jewish (male) patients might hesitate to disclose they are Jewish, there was a possibility one of them might be offered a ham sandwich.

Therefore EDI must specifically train staff not to be antisemitic, in case Jews (translation Jewish men) were reluctant to seek NHS treatment, in fear of ham sandwiches, or in case Jewish staff (translation male ) were 'uncomfortable' with staff conversations.

At this point in the interview, a third voice (male, of course) was introduced, saying he as a member of staff had been 'uncomfortable' with colleagues' remarks, though when it was brought to attention of seniors, he was at once taken seriously. (N,B. Contrast that with the five nurses, and Peggy)

All the men could not imagine anything worse, for staff, than 'being uncomfortable' for as many days as it takes to tell senior management, who will at once intervene.

All the men could not imagine any worse horror, for patients, than being offered unwanted ham sandwiches.

The prospect of being ra p ed is not something which males need to keep in mind, for survival.

Serious fear of being in a ward or changing room with a man, or dread of having a strange man see them naked, is entirely absent from males' brain- capacity .

Thank you for highlighting the Nolan Principles. They do actually cover quite a range of issues I think.

Hospital, school and charity trustees will have pledged to uphold them, and people often don’t realise that they are endangering this. For example, by outsourcing ‘training’, CPD sessions or HR away days to special interest groups.

Yes this ‘bring your whole self to work’ bollocks should be debunked. Bring your work self to work and be professional ffs.

Long overdue. Time the Nolan Principles of Public were adhered to - sadly lacking in so many of our politicians and institutions Link below.

"Integrity
Holders of public office must avoid placing themselves under any obligation to people or organisations that might try inappropriately to influence them in their work.
Objectivity
Holders of public office must act and take decisions impartially, fairly and on merit, using the best evidence and without discrimination or bias"

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/the-7-principles-of-public-life/the-7-principles-of-public-life--2

There's supposed to be a consultation, isn't there? We should watch out for it and make sure they're left in no doubt about the effect the Progress Pride lanyards etc have.

Yes, they’re a useful red flag.

I’d also like to see the end of pronouns in work emails. On the upside they do allow you to see very clearly which colleagues are total fuckwits.