Truly single-sex bra fittings for DD13

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/3744943-make-fetishists-reviewing-m-s-knickers-hits-the-sun

Fair point! Although do those reviews actually exist? If they do, are they actually genuine?it sounds more like a malicious joke.

Stop being so genderist! You know youre supposed to say “lady dick” - you transphobe!

It wasn’t me who raised sexual assault as being a potential problem.

As for the dignity and privacy etc - a locked cubicle with your mum around is pretty good in that regard. A small independent shop would be even better but the OP is worried about the expense.

When they’re talking about wanking into the knickers or whether there’s sufficient room for their cocks it rather gives the game away.

im glad your daughters are having a better experience than you or i. Unfortunately where we live my daughter isnt having a great time and there are a lot of creeps still around on the school commute. Given your history and knowing what it’s like then maybe cut the OP some slack?

But you can’t tell whether an online reviewer is male or female.

I helped DD with this last year - not long after I had peaked and the news articles about TW bra fitters. So we decided simply to go to M&S shortly after opening on a Saturday morning and to pick up all/any bras she liked the look of in the small sizes - she did measure her chest with a tape at home so only had the cup size to check.

She tried on loads and found 1 in store that she liked & fitted. I told her the advice on fitting which I got from Bravissimo and R&P years ago and she was able to do it herself with me nearby/in cubicle looking the other way!

The biggest problem was actually that the in-store stock levels are dreadful. We ended up having to order online - this was a big London store with a huge lingerie section where you’d expect a good choice… so maybe don’t bother travelling a long way as you might be disappointed

Advice I was told and passed on:

1. measure fit the chest band on the end clasp so that as it loosens with age/washing you can move up a notch and keep it tight. Should be firm but no big bulges or gaps/slippage if you have the right size
2. adjust shoulder straps firm but not too tight
3. once on, put your hands in the cups and pull your boobs up and into the centre while slightly leaning forward - will show if you need full or half cup depending on how much top boob (or not) you have
4. the cup size changes with chest band so a 34D is a 32E - which you need to know if you’re near the cusp or vary between brands

ETA there were a few men on the sofa by the changing room but none in the CRs as far as we could tell. The cubicles have solid doors rather than curtains so it was fine - other shops in the same centre weren’t good - curtains and unisex changing with loads of blokes in/around the area. It was ok but I don’t like it after 2 men were arrested near us for filming in the CRs at the leisure centre and selling films of teen girls online… 🤮

Precisely! I’ve been making exactly the same point and been ridiculed and had sarcastic comments about hopefully I don’t have a daughter - I have daughters and they are older than the OP’s daughter and wear bras.

I have talked to them about sexual assault and harassment. They have not really experienced any (bar an occasional borderline comment). On the other hand, I had men exposing themselves to me on the way home from primary school and men in
cars stopping to make lewd suggestions while walking home from secondary school and while at university, I didn’t get any supervision on my final year project because my supervisor was a pervert so I didn’t want to be alone in a room with him. If my and my daughters anecdotal experiences are anything to go by (which obviously tbey may well not be) then things have improved for girls and young women.

Shaming you for trying to protect your daughter is tactic, OP.

The number reasons to keep men in your changing room is getting rather long!

I just want to reiterate that if you allow men in women's changing rooms, specifically underwear, who the hell do you think is going to take advantage of that??

A couple of years ago there was a long thread on here full of reviews from John Lewis and Marks & Spencer's.

An extraordinary number of them from men who try on women's clothes. And a horribly significant number from men who spunk up on them and then put them back on the rail.

Seriously? You think because it's never happened to you it's not an issue?

good Lord

They don't have to, they can if they want to. In any event I've never seen a man in the lingerie changing rooms.

It’s rare and obviously despicable.

In practice, reputable retailers like M&S and JL do a good job of keeping bra changing areas mainly male-free and safe. I would assume that their staff know about secret filming and make checks. We can all ask for 100% guarantees of no men but that would come at an extra cost (more staff). The OP has already said she doesn’t want to go to an independent retailer because she is worried it will be too expensive. I really do think that M&S and JL do a good job of keeping everything safe and worry free. There are seldom 100% guarantees against risks in life.

Why should women have to exit a space and come back later, which they might not have time for because there is a man in a woman's space.

I agree and, I'd have no hesitation in using the shop but the op does.

I'm 65. I have bought bras from, and tried them on or been fitted in M&S, John Lewis, various other department stores. JL has curtains/M&S doors. I also have a dd, now aged nearly 28 who has also bought bras.

I have never, in more than 45 years of bra buying encountered a man inside the lingerie changing rooms. I'm not sure how much it.would bother me if I did and if it did, I'd go for coffee and come back later.

Presumably @Secretsquirrelshh you have never sunbathed topless. To be fair I wouldn't on a public beach nowadays but that's on me.

DD has asked for a bra fitting (I asked her if she'd like to and she said yes, over the summer holidays)

That is a leading question - it did not even arise for my DDs and all their friends. It is like saying "Would you like to go and show your developing breasts to a stranger?" - and at such a sensitive stage in her life. She is being led by you.

Go and get her some bras and do this in a gentle way. You clearly feel you have a point to make to her about overcoming embarrassment but you should find some other way of doing this. THis is not the issue to use. It is simply too sensitive.

And your worry about having a trans male doing the fitting isd frankly OTT.

And for others too lazy or dim to understand the earlier posts ..... this shows very much your forceful nature and the inability to listen to other views and hold a debate. Maybe your DD has other views too that need to be listened to?

We know that @Secretsquirrelshh

I am sorry that people are deliberately misunderstanding you, and attacking you.

They cannot - more likely, will not - understand or accept the damage done to women and girls by men. It seems to be an argument that unless your daughter is actually physically/sexually assaulted then it doesn't matter. There is no clearer proof that they have no idea what it is like to be female. And if some of the people posting this argument are female, I have to ask why they are centring men here. Perhaps they could make the effort to try to understand how other women and girls might think and feel, acknowledge that they can't give permission on behalf of others, and accept that it is valid for women and girls to need and want single-sex spaces for whatever reasons.

Yes . Isn't there some statitistic that something like 90% are wearing the wrong size?

You exploited that woman's horrific rape to make a point about transwomen. Because it was "round the corner" from your M&S.

I'm shocked that you thought that was an acceptable thing to do.

What if she wants to do it in the comfort and privacy of the shop. Why can't she?

why does she have to traipse back backwards and forwards to the shop returning, replacing, returning, trying on.

That's what the bloody shop is for