A fissure between men and women is reshaping British politics

They don't hate them so much, as really don't care.

I can't say I've spoken to a lot of men young and old but the ones I have spoken too are feeling very left out and victimised.

The trend that they're picking up on (rightly or wrongly, who knows!) is that DEI includes everyone but them. They see others getting preferential treatment just because they're not white, they feel like they're being blamed for every trouble in the world because they're male.

Despite the prevailing ideology, most youngsters still want what they always wanted, a job, a wife/partner, children, a house, a future and right now a lot of them are feeling like that's not going to be possible and they don't have a Plan B.

Yes, I think this is maybe under-recognised. It's much more comfortable to think women are just too kind for their own good.

But there is a certain number who retain the middle school desire for social dominance and seem to really enjoy power over others. And all the better if they can do it while feeling self-righteous about it.

People like that won't open their eyes when they see what GI really is, because for them it is a vehicle to assert power.

That's a definite possibility, women and girls do seem to be more easily conned than the male of the species. We all have our blind spots, both men and women fall for rubbish, if the claims about Tate's influence on young men are to be believed, we got trouble on both sides. The influence the post-modernists have over women is more dangerous and corrosive, than individuals like Tate exert, even with SM.

I do get the line from very influential/counter culture tripping into guru/worldwide fame and visibility into prissy thin skinned and maybe even hypocritical.
I mean, who is getting it right?
I'd say JKR is unusual in being a public figure who's forthright and fearless, but hasn't descended into parody or self aggrandizing disappointment.
Looks like Mark Carney is being built into some sort of liberal third way warrior/maybe even role model for men based on one speech that's tacitly anti Trump, and generally anti populist.
Good luck with his ethos becoming the voice of reason for men, he being one of the most prominent gate keepers for the system that's led us to this sorry state precludes him being an honest broker for men going forwards in the 21st century.
Nope, the male role models may genuinely have to be...everyday men themselves. Because there are no prominent visible men right now seemingly saying very much that's relevant.
Women? Plenty, starting with JKR.

I never understood the virulent reaction to Peterson, to the left he's almost as much a devil as Thatcher Trump Musk Vance Farage Tate.
What? For telling young men to find focus, motivation, self respect and respect for others, including women. To put aside selfishness for being good partners and fathers.
Sure, he can be pompous and verbose and prissy...but a hate figure?

To keep it very short, I believe we address young men negatively or neutrally. It s either Adolescence dumped on them, or “let’s stop VAWG” like we don’t know where it’s coming from.

Where do we see “a real man doesn’t
etc.” or positive male models? I think it would work better.

Not just because of BeKind, I´m afraid, also because it allows them to absolutely destroy women who are against it. Never underestimate that. It allows handmaidens to kill the competition, who they (at least deep down) know is smarter.

I'm a Right voter, and even I can see the cover being given to what's been deemed the Woke Right..everything is the fault of migrants, rising hostility to Jews, zero sum on ethno-nationalism. They're carrying on from a decade of cultural dominance and crush from the left, starting with the Great Awokening, anti-Trumpism, lockdowns/Floyd/BLM/cancel culture re trans politics.
Right now, young men are very strongly lining up behind Farage (and Trump), young women are feeling triggered enough to go Team Polanski.
Despite our Zack being TWAW and the Boob Whisperer Supreme, a decade of the Great Awokening has radicalised them left taking BeKind and DontJudge to while new levels of putting themselves last, because this has been their only programming since high school, and they see Farage Jenrick Trump Vance Musk Milei Fuentes Rogan etc as literally the Devil.
What this is doing to the relations between young men and women, I hate to think

Of course women skew to the left generally, because we know how much we have to lose. I'm 'only' 48 but my mum would not have been allowed to take out a mortgage in her own name at the age I did (23), so it's really not that far behind us. Unfortunately women are not equal - our rights are not inalienable, as the ripping down on Roe vs Wade in the US has shown. We could still have our bodily autonomy removed, still be prevented from accessing finance, still have our rights to contest unfair treatment removed if the people in power feel like it.

Men are continually told how much they have 'lost' and this is blamed on women and feminism rather than capitalism, which we have all lost out to. So no, men are not always 'the breadwinner' anymore because most couples have to work to keep a roof over their heads, but capitalism does not seem to offer men any other familial role. The only 'rights' men have lost is to abuse or rape their wives, which was never a valid one in the first place... although again, that could come back if enough people voted for it.

Not just because of BeKind, I´m afraid, also because it allows them to absolutely destroy women who are against it. Never underestimate that. It allows handmaidens to kill the competition, who they (at least deep down) know is smarter.

Poor white boys have poor educational outcomes for many reasons. Dating back to post WW2 at least girls have had better eg 11+ results. Many girls who had higher scores than boys ended up in Secondary Mods ( leaving at age 15 before exams because there were roughly the same number of places for both sexes in single sex Grammar Schools.)

Somehow we have got to the situation where in working class areas especially, there is football for boys but little else. ( Maybe some rugby.) Few boys do art, acting, music etc. Even gymnastics - (none in my granddaughter's class), horse riding no boys, dancing none. Why? Spanish boys ride horses, the Russians dance etc.

I think it starts early. I remember only one father coming to parents' evening in my inner city school. However I do remember groups of boys ( under 11) roaming the streets after 10pm. The parents would not allow their daughters to do the same but often the reaction of boys being noisy was 'get out!' so boys would get much less conversation / interaction with parents ( ie mothers and grandmothers) than their sisters. Fathers were often absent.

We need to reinstate support for parents of pre schoolers, free youth clubs, free sports centres, extend library opening times so children can visit at weekends and evenings to do homework etc., better pay, higher minimum wage, shorter hours etc.

Parents in poorer areas often work very long hours in poorly paid jobs or on night shifts or irregular hours so contact with children is sporadic. When research was done into what led to higher academic success the main correlation was whether the children ate with their parents. Cultures which enable this (Jewish? Chinese,? mothers and daughters? ) have better success academically.

Tangential, but a friend and I were discussing Adolescence and his view was that the protagonist was a manipulative monster who would always have turned out bad. Not sure about that interpretation myself but maybe the programme isn't just a modern-day fable about the dangers of incel culture.

Gender is just apart of it, the young women are buying into it because it's #BeKind, the boys are not buying into it it because it's demonising them, toxic masculinity, potential rapist, white, pale and stale. Genderwang covers the whole of the post-modern claptrap, QT, CRT and GI, they are all heads of the same Hydra.

Sure, working class/poor boys born in Britain to British parents.
It isn't Nigerian or Indian boys, is it?
Adolescence? Sure, I can just about accept the premise of the show, but when the solution is to strip the show across schools while having no answer why Rudabukana was caught with a knife ten times in public and no action taken against him or his parents, and in addition to Adolescence all Starmer can witter on about is a ban on pointy knives, I'm speechless.
Btw, how does Adolescence go down in Brighton schools where we've traditionally taught boys and men not to invade women's spaces, yet in these schools the girls can't nt escape the gaze of boys?
How does this mesh with Adolescence? How are you boys meant to filter out the film telling them to respect girls with the school managing disrespect from unavoidable gazes?

I think you are right, there needs to be a positive ideal. One that appeals to young men.

The rather wet version of manliness some women seem to want to encourage does not seem to particularly appeal to many young men.

I think that the reality is that the most important thing is real examples in boys lives, but many boys don't have male figures in their lives, or not particularly positive ones. My dp grew up in a family that was massively matriarchal, which was pretty common in that country, at least among wc people. The women ran the family, and the hierarchy of importance in his life was mother-sister-aunt-brother. Father wasn't even on the list - generally they were friends of your mum.

I don't think it's that bad in the UK, however, there are communities that are like that and it's much more common than it used to be for kids to have no father figure.

But even aside from that, culturally, we seem to really shy away from heroic examples of honourable masculinity, almost as if it's embarrassing. A lot of heroes are more like antiheroes, or sometimes cynical, or even actual criminal types in some subcultures.

To keep it very short, I believe we address young men negatively or neutrally. It s either Adolescence dumped on them, or “let’s stop VAWG” like we don’t know where it’s coming from.

Where do we see “a real man doesn’t
etc.” or positive male models? I think it would work better.

I do get the line from very influential/counter culture tripping into guru/worldwide fame and visibility into prissy thin skinned and maybe even hypocritical.
I mean, who is getting it right?
I'd say JKR is unusual in being a public figure who's forthright and fearless, but hasn't descended into parody or self aggrandizing disappointment.
Looks like Mark Carney is being built into some sort of liberal third way warrior/maybe even role model for men based on one speech that's tacitly anti Trump, and generally anti populist.
Good luck with his ethos becoming the voice of reason for men, he being one of the most prominent gate keepers for the system that's led us to this sorry state precludes him being an honest broker for men going forwards in the 21st century.
Nope, the male role models may genuinely have to be...everyday men themselves. Because there are no prominent visible men right now seemingly saying very much that's relevant.
Women? Plenty, starting with JKR.