"A woman who is trans"

How can you think you’re doing the right thing when you’re breaking the law?

when you’re disregarding women’s consent?

how. Seriously how?

That makes sense to me. It felt good to admit to the doubts I have about my position. I don’t know if I’m doing the right thing and I honestly can’t disagree with the core GC position that you can’t change biological sex. But if I doubt my position, where does that leave me?

Whether or not they must or can … do you think they should?

Interesting 1984

Cognitive dissonance is both a drug and a drag.
Maybe I shouldn't admit it here, but a few years ago I thought I'd relent to the trans narrative, why shouldn't I JustBeKind.
For 5 minutes I felt virtuous and selfless.
Maybe I'd have posted on here had I been a member.
Soon after that, the cognitive dissonance started, the mental stress of leaving a square peg jammed in a round hole.
Followed by a very strong endorphin reaction.
And back to "normal service resumed", chiding myself for letting myself down for ditching critical thinking skills for simple feel good intentions.
I realized then and there, I'd never again take the path of least resistance.
Maybe this individual is similarly distracted?

@ThatOpalTurtle, perhaps you could read the following, about the problem with the idea of “men who pass as women” using women’s spaces:

Think about that for a moment, this idea of a man who is “visually and for all practical purposes indistinguishable” from a woman. Lots of women have suffered male violence, and some of those are permanently traumatised to the point that if they are surprised by a man in a supposedly female-only space, they will be retraumatised. These women may need domestic violence shelters and rape crisis services at certain times, but they don’t engage with the world solely as rape or domestic violence survivors. They have ordinary lives, too. They use public toilets, hospitals, gyms; they visit pubs, galleries, cafés, museums, theatres. They don’t wear a special badge or uniform so that we can identify them and make sure we cater for their needs. We don’t know who they are.

Obviously it’s not acceptable to say to such women “You can’t have any single-sex spaces”. But is it better to say “You can have single-sex spaces, mostly. Don’t worry: we’ll only let men use them if they look so much like women that you won’t be able to tell that they’re men.”

Think about that. Think about its power to undermine the certainty of an already traumatised woman that the woman she is dealing with at any given moment is truly a woman. If you’re not shocked by the sadistic, gas-lighting cruelty of that, you’re not doing the thinking bit right. Think harder. Think about it until you are shocked.

From here:

https://www.legalfeminist.org.uk/2024/11/06/sex-peanuts-and-statutory-interpretation/

Passing isn't a yes/no done deal. Just as individuals are better or worse at facial recognition, they are better or worse at recognising sex. You can pass with one and not with another.
It's not even a done deal when it comes to the same individual's perceptions. I can testify to that. Successive brief encounters with a local transwoman started with not noticing, then it was "I wonder", then "yes, definitely". My assessment was confirmed (without my asking) by somebody who knew them. I have no idea whether they know that I know; I have never said anything to them about it one way or the other.

It's a very good point that men calling themselves women often point to times women have been mistakenly considered male and suggest this means that men pretending to be women often pass.

It is vanishingly rare for men to be mistaken for women.

I hadn't noticed that switcheroo before.

@ThatOpalTurtle I dont understand why you have become all argumentative again.

yesterday you Conceded pretty much everything.

Why do you think your internal feelings trump my sex-based rights?

My goalposts haven’t moved once.

I’ve asked the same questions multiple times.

you haven’t answered.

your sympathy for what I disclosed was massive as well so thanks for that.

No. You are now being dishonest.

Some people might be able to always recognise a male person in real life. You are trying to claim that someone has said they can always tell who is a male person in photographs which may or may not be clear and of an entire body.

The goalposts are not 'always moving'. You are now using cognitive distortions such as misrepresenting people's arguments now though.

No. I'm asking you to evidence your claim.

I'm also asking you to give us an example of a passing transwoman in the public eye, which should be a piece of cake after everything you've said.

But ... crickets from you on that one

And let's not forget that male social conditioning that comes through in every post.

A bright beacon.

The goalposts are always moving. First it’s we can always tell, and then when you get it wrong you pivot to the in person talking point.

No male person is able to copy a female gait. No male person is able to disguise all their male body cues.

There will be some female people in the world that can tell very reliably with interaction, that someone is a male person. Male body cues are rarely fully disguised, even with the best facial surgery to be paid for.

Plus, as male people age any surgery or hormone treatment will not be able to continue to disguise those male body cues. Of course, some male people will attempt to have more surgery, but again, there are skeletal cues that cannot be changed or disguised 100%.

We've had men come on here before and assert that nobody knows they are men and everyone believes they are women, and then when we've seen the photos its been very, very obvious that said men were either heavily deluded or deliberately trolling.

What? So based on a photo?

No. All through the answers to your posts people have stated that meeting someone in real life is very different to seeing a photo and judging. Yes, many times people can tell just from a photo, however, there is a much higher success rate if people are interacting with that person.

I really think you need to stop believing misinformation.

And the fact that none of the famous transwomen pass despite some being actual models whose image depends on their supposed womanliness and who have access to far more resources that the average trans in the street.

It would appear that all these passing transwomen go to another school and we don't know them.

Ahh... no.

If you present yourself to someone serving you in a store or bar, particularly if you wear either fake breasts or have taken oestrogen to develop male breast tissue (and yes, male breasts are different to female breasts). They are quite likely to recognise that you are presenting as a 'female' and risk a negative reaction if they gett it wrong.

We have all been through the training, or didn't you think about that? Yes, it is hard. But if your job fucking depends on you making sure you don't get a person upset, then you do it.

Have you also thought that maybe you also fail to read body language well.

Sorry, do you honestly not see the situation that a group of aggressive activists in 'consulting positions' have created over the past 10 years?

In education, in retail, in service industries? Not only that, most parents with children that are young adults down will have started to come across these situations and be on high alert. Perhaps you live in an area that has lots of this training happening.

I think you actually come across as desperately wanting what you believe to be true to be true.

That's not the same as thinking someone is not trans when they are though, is it?

There's an episode of Number 9 where the plot twist hinges on the "woman" being male. I had no idea until the big reveal, but then it was really obvious.

So obvious that I checked the actor.

Turns out there were two. An actual women played the part up until the reveal, then a transwoman actor after.

Seems odd, don't you think, not to cast a passing transwomen to play both parts? I mean, surely if there are so many TW who pass so well, and an actor to boot, someone whose literal job is to make you believe, through speech and posture and movement, in their character, and with all the advantages of TV lighting and staging, it would have been possible to find a transwoman capable of passing as a woman convincingly enough to carry the plot? I wonder why they didn't.

You’re wrong.

and even if I am.

you don’t have the right to enter women’s single sex spaces.

you clearly don’t care about the law.

you have zero empathy.

you will stealth. Which is illegal in other areas of law.

and you clearly don’t care about consent violations.

all of the above makes you problematic. Can’t you see that?