GLP are suing Virgin Active

It is not even "transphobia" it is a repackaging homophobia.
any male dressed as a woman is also sexually attracted to men and that these males will make sexual advances and be attacked or that a men is sexually attracted so realised he was gay and attacks.

Otherwise the risk involved ( if the attack is random or because the victim is "Odd" as such highlights male violence etc) is transferred to the womans space with the subgroup of men.

That had never occurred to me, somehow.

I had always understood the main risk-based claim to be that TW risk assault in the men’s toilets because of transphobia. I think that a fair, if overblown, concern.

Not that TW risk assault becuase they are confused for women. That’s highly unlikely.

It makes the validation thing even more tawdry. The risk of rape as an desirable affirmation.

I completely agree and will never understand this argument.

Someone is so worried about being attacked by men for simply dressing like a woman, yet can’t seem to grasp the need for single sex spaces.

If you’re concerned about being attacked whilst being dressed as a woman, imagine being an actual woman.

They are choosing to dress as a woman, they are choosing to go into a men only space - whilst we are not choosing to have men come into our space, it is being forced upon us with no regard to our safety.

If men’s spaces are so dangerous then that supports our argument that we do not want men in our female only spaces.

If you make exceptions for any men its no longer single sex but mixed sex and all men must be allowed in, as such not only is there no requirement to make exceptions but they are specifically barred from doing so

It falls in line with the fantasy that they ‘pass’ and are so irresistible to heterosexual men they will be attacked.
Where the reality will be someone might laugh.

Agree.

Surely a non binary trans masc would have had issues well before Virgin Active changed to single sex. Even if they had some weird policy on gender the CR’s were labelled men and women so nothing specific for the they/thems.

As long as organisations continued to be sued despite following the law their motivations for following the law are somewhat lessened. What I suspect are really needed right now are equally vociferous GC lawyers suing companies that still choose to ignore the law. The Equality Act is only effective if people are willing to use for breaches, and currently because people aren't doing that when trans people are treated as the opposite sex, there's little motivation for anyone to actually follow it.

Did the objecting user fail to miss that the individuals who actually need the extra provision also needs to join the end of the que which is made longer if the objecting user can "lower" her/his expected standards to use the provided space?

If I was VA I would have had the dryer etc installed before the letter had been posted.

And looked at reconfigering the door openings to consolidate each accessable unit into the main changing rooms to remove the risk of tracking water into the main walkway.

They do have appropriate spaces. Those would be the spaces for their sex. If they’re not happy with the single sex changing rooms, then like anyone, it’s time to find a different gym. I don’t like “changing villages” and I wouldn’t attend a gym or pool which has them.

Agree. I think what they are actually afraid of is that men will laugh at them. Women won't laugh at them because a) we are socialised to be nice, and b)it would potentially be very dangerous for a woman to laugh at a man in a changing room type situation. But men might well not take their 'woman' identity very seriously.

That’s very telling!

The proportionate and legitimate test has already been fulfilled (or not) when you set up a single sex female space. There’s no requirement to make exceptions for particular men, is there.

I think it’s just an attempt to spread misinformation. It’s a large part of what the GLP does. And it works.

I think TW feeling unsafe/uncomfortable in the changing room of their sex is a strawman. They want to be in the female changing room for validation. There is no evidence that they are not safe in the men's.

But a transmasculine non-binary person may have to stand around in they/them's wet trunks!!!
Sad times

If the Generally Loses Project takes a case on then it's a good rule of thumb to say the opposite side is in the right both morally and legally.

This claim by the GLP seems a bit spurious.

Surely ensuring members use the changing rooms on the basis of their biological sex and not their gender ID is a proportionate means of a achieving a legitimate aim - unless you think that protecting the safety and dignity of people (women) in a state of undress is not a legitimate aim?

I’m sure. Gives them something to do with their lives I suppose.

They are of course not interested in solving the ‘problem’ (it’s not a problem) that has been raised. Such things are essential to their purpose.

They need to keep the gender woo wang alive. Keeps them in a job. Bit like (the awful newer version of) stonewall tried. And we see how that’s working out for them..

There are plenty of gyms that are mixed sex - they can go to them.

There are lots of places that aren’t wheelchair accessible, there are lots of places that aren’t autism, blind, dwarfism etc accessible - it would be great if every single place was fully inclusive but it’s simply not possible.

These people are biologically 1 sex.
They are choosing to portray another gender - fine, but with that comes issues such as this one.
You can’t have your cake and eat it too.

I wonder how many people would choose to portray another gender if it meant they also receive lower pay, fewer job opportunities, fewer leadership roles etc.

Imagine being disabled and going your entire life being restricted with things like the gym and then hearing a story like this.

I am not anti trans and anyone can identify with whatever gender they want to but you are and will always be the sex you were born.
That’s not offensive, that is just scientific facts.

GLP have about £4m in reserves to burn through in addition to the constant fundraising for writing (poorly drafted) letters. Even with their bloated payroll and profligate operating expenses that's still a few more years of JM trying to lawfare away his terrible parenting decisions.

You can’t acquire the sex you weren’t born with.
Women don’t want trans women in their changing rooms because they are men. You might believe that some inner feeling trumps facts, but it doesn’t.
If you allow trans women in then you would have to allow all men in as that is discrimination.

Are GLP doing this on a no win no fee basis? I doubt it…

‘Last summer Virgin Active banned trans people from bathrooms and changing rooms across the UK – so we’re taking them to court’ 😂🙈

Even with a most basic understanding we know that trans people aren’t banned. That’d be discriminatory.

Virgin are simply saying biological men use the men’s, biological women use the women’s. The GLP know that of course. Still if it makes them money.. £££££££

Exactly. And how does a man know he feels like a woman ? I am female and I feel like me I don’t think I I feel like a woman, I dint know what that means. Now I completely get that people may not feel like the version of femininity or masculinity that society reinforces fair enough but that doesn’t mean you need to change sex it means you don’t feel like you fit in with society’s idea of watt a woman or a man is.

and probably most important thoughts and feelings aren’t facts are they.

Not feeling comfortable isn't the problem. There are dignity and safety to be taken into consideration as well. And women have the right to be in a single-sex environment in certain situations. The law says this is legal in the UK. Reasonable accommodation can be made - but we are talking about less than 1% of the population and though I have come acrss more trans people lately they are not at all common. A gender neutral facility should be possible - though exit and entrance is likely still to be through a sexed space. Men should not be walking through spaces in which women and girls are partially or wholly undressed.