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Girlguiding - WIN!

129 replies

Elevenseconds · 02/12/2025 14:06

Just received this fabulous message from Girlguiding - hurrah! The tone is peevish, but the result is what matters.

Slight pity that DD is leaving Brownies later this week - and I didn't encourage her to step up for Guides, partly because of their policies worrying me as she got older.

This is a really significant moment.

As the parent of a young member in Girlguiding, following April’s Supreme Court decision relating to sex and gender, we wanted to give you an update. Many organisations across the country have been facing complex decisions about what it means for girls and women and for the wider communities affected, including us.

Girlguiding’s governing charity documents set out that the membership and people who benefit from our organisation are girls and women. In April, the Supreme Court ruled that girls and women are defined in the Equality Act 2010 by their biological sex at birth.
Following detailed considerations, expert legal advice and input from senior members, young members and our Council, Girlguiding’s Board of Trustees has made the difficult decision that Girlguiding must change Girlguiding must change, following the Supreme Court’s ruling.

From today, 2 December, it is with a heavy heart that we are announcing trans girls and young women will no longer be able to join Girlguiding. This is a decision we would have preferred not to make, and we know that this may be upsetting for members of our community.

There will be no immediate changes for current young members but more information will be shared next week.

Most adult roles, including unit helpers, district helpers and administrative support, are already open to all, so we are confident that no volunteers will have to leave the organisation.

Girlguiding believes strongly in our value of inclusion, and we will continue to support young people and adults in marginalised groups. Over the next few months, we'll explore opportunities to champion this value and actively support young people who need us.

You can find our full statement and updated policy on our website.

We are proud to be the UK’s largest youth organisation dedicated to girls and is focused on creating an equal world for girls and young women. For over 100 years, we have been a welcoming space for all girls to have new experiences, support their communities, build friendships and grow their confidence.

While Girlguiding may feel a little different going forward, these core aims and principles will always be the same. We remain committed to treating everyone with dignity and respect, particularly those from marginalised groups that have felt the biggest impact of this decision.

If you have any immediate questions, we have our special support team in place, to give volunteers, parents and carers the best support we can. We are asking Girlguiding HQ, trading and country/region staff to refer any volunteer or parent who has questions about this announcement. Details below.

OP posts:
Waitwhat23 · 02/12/2025 18:35

On the other hand, I suspect many of us who are former Guiders will be submitting volunteer enquiries in the next few days.

Dullday · 02/12/2025 18:31

I think Guiding will come adrift over this, I've been surprised at the horror expressed by many leaders over this decision. I'm a leader who was never happy allowing biological boys and I was quite sure many in the organisation agreed with me, but it appears not looking at the uproar on SM. All our young and student leaders are saying they will quit. Quite a few local units are run entirely by students.

medievalpenny · 02/12/2025 18:30

Beamur · 02/12/2025 16:38

I think it's a painful process for GG to address this.
It seems like Inclusion Advisors in County roles were not aware this announcement was being made.

If they had been given advance notice, the news would 100% have been leaked.

SternJoyousBeev2 · 02/12/2025 18:27

MistyGreenAndBlue · 02/12/2025 16:12

This! Sorry I can't call this a win. Fetishistic men will be allowed to continue as guide leaders and it is not made at all clear if they will continue to treat these men as if they are women or not.
Boys who are already girl guides will be allowed to continue to be for the time being at least.
And not least, the attitude towards all this in the letter is so offensive and off-putting. Heavy hearts, we're so SO sorry... get fucked. No child of mine would be joining such an organisation. It's absolutely clear they still centre men and boys and women and girls are second class citizens. They are "following the law" only as far as they want to and that with very bad grace.

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I expect if trans identifying males continue to be allowed to volunteer they will be held to the same safeguarding standards as other men who help out. GG senior leadership would be beyond stupid not to treat Transwomen as males and I’m sure the legal advice they have received will have made this clear. They are no doubt busily working out how to communicate this information to the poor men folk.

SternJoyousBeev2 · 02/12/2025 18:22

Ames788 · 02/12/2025 17:57

It doesn't say anything remotely implying that members will be forced into ' pro trans activities'. Providing children support when a decision that massively effects them emotionally is the least they can do. People need to remember whether or not your GC there are children impacted by this. There seems little concern expresed here about the mental health impact this will have on trans children. On top on this you want to glote on a Facebook page , which may have parents of tran children or trans young people , for whom this decision is already very distressing. Maybe consider whether this aproach is teaching your children compassion and empathy

Quit the hyperbolic emotional blackmail bullshit.

GG is for girls and relies on legal sex discrimination to stop boys from joining. Adults should not be pretending that trans identifying young males are actually girls. Blame the adults that have sold this lie to children not the adults who are relieved that an organisation meant for girls will actually be for girls from now on.

Waitwhat23 · 02/12/2025 18:17

Ames788 · 02/12/2025 17:57

It doesn't say anything remotely implying that members will be forced into ' pro trans activities'. Providing children support when a decision that massively effects them emotionally is the least they can do. People need to remember whether or not your GC there are children impacted by this. There seems little concern expresed here about the mental health impact this will have on trans children. On top on this you want to glote on a Facebook page , which may have parents of tran children or trans young people , for whom this decision is already very distressing. Maybe consider whether this aproach is teaching your children compassion and empathy

Where was the empathy for girls who were told by Girl Guiding that it was 'girls only' when it was actually mixed sex?

Where was the empathy for Guiders who expressed concerns about mixed sex sleeping accommodation and were expelled from the organisation?

All those boys who invaded what was formerly a single sex organisation (and thankfully is again) can express their gender identity to their heart's content in the mixed sex Scouts and not use girls for validation.

SternJoyousBeev2 · 02/12/2025 18:16

TWETMIRF · 02/12/2025 15:34

I'm pleased that they are finally acknowledging they have to follow the law but still not sure if I want to stay as a leader. Can't leave right now though as they would count me in the stats of volunteers they lost because of this decision

You must of course do what’s best for you but I hope you are able to stay. GG needs volunteers that are willing to support the rights and interests of girls.

GrimDamnFanjo · 02/12/2025 18:03

Thank God. Sanity has prevailed at last.

whitehandledkitchenlang · 02/12/2025 18:02

usedtobeaylis · 02/12/2025 14:15

Who was it that fought the Guides on this years ago, Helen someone? One of the first women fighting back that I was aware of.

Helen Watts and Katie Alcock were the guide leaders who were kicked out of GG for challenging the change from single to mixed sex.

Ames788 · 02/12/2025 17:57

It doesn't say anything remotely implying that members will be forced into ' pro trans activities'. Providing children support when a decision that massively effects them emotionally is the least they can do. People need to remember whether or not your GC there are children impacted by this. There seems little concern expresed here about the mental health impact this will have on trans children. On top on this you want to glote on a Facebook page , which may have parents of tran children or trans young people , for whom this decision is already very distressing. Maybe consider whether this aproach is teaching your children compassion and empathy

Greyskybluesky · 02/12/2025 17:39

Bbc 6 Music news reporting this as "transgender girls will no longer be allowed to join girl guides"

No explanation or clarification that transgender girls are BOYS

FGS bbc. Still failing.

Catiette · 02/12/2025 16:40

I just read the posts on the current "Honour-based Abuse" thread. They were eye-opening.

It's left me so, so angry at the tone of GG's statement. They're disappointed at a policy change that could potentially open up a whole new world to the girls living in those environments.

In the light of experiences like that, the blindness and stupidity and utter, deep-seated misogyny of the statement is appalling.

Beamur · 02/12/2025 16:38

I think it's a painful process for GG to address this.
It seems like Inclusion Advisors in County roles were not aware this announcement was being made.

RedToothBrush · 02/12/2025 16:38

Oh I note, no comment about transboys (the female kind) aka tomboys when I was a kid.

Which is a little depressing in its own right tbh.

It's still all about the poor males.

SingleSexSpacesInSchools · 02/12/2025 16:28

I think most angry parents have not heard of the Supreme Court decision and it's all news to them. nobody is explaining that is a rights thing.

MistyGreenAndBlue · 02/12/2025 16:12

ScrollingLeaves · 02/12/2025 15:04

Most adult roles, including unit helpers, district helpers and administrative support, are already open to all, so we are confident that no volunteers will have to leave the organisation.

No good. How appalling. All girls should stay well away.

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This! Sorry I can't call this a win. Fetishistic men will be allowed to continue as guide leaders and it is not made at all clear if they will continue to treat these men as if they are women or not.
Boys who are already girl guides will be allowed to continue to be for the time being at least.
And not least, the attitude towards all this in the letter is so offensive and off-putting. Heavy hearts, we're so SO sorry... get fucked. No child of mine would be joining such an organisation. It's absolutely clear they still centre men and boys and women and girls are second class citizens. They are "following the law" only as far as they want to and that with very bad grace.

GoldenGate · 02/12/2025 16:03

Right decision but two questions immediately come to mind.
Why did it take this long? Now 7 months since the decision and,
How did it ever apply to children who can't get a GRC anyway, which was the central question of the ruling? Self declaration was knocked down in 2022.

whathaveiforgottentoday · 02/12/2025 16:02

WelshBookWitch · 02/12/2025 15:30

Im reading the Guide leaders closed Facebook group, there is a lot of wailing going on but a steady amount of leaders quietly saying they are pleased. They are being largely ignored which is an improvement on the threats to be reported to their commissioner we used to previously.
I feel 95% of leaders are just happy to be able to carry on and know they can now say no if a TIM wants to join. I know i am

Me too, very pleased with the result. Just been on Facebook on one of groups and much wailing going on, however the leaders I work with in real life will all be happy with this outcome. The tone of the email is awful though.
the Facebook is all about how ‘ trans’ are banned but transmen and those born female who identify as non - binary would still be welcome. They seem to skirt over that fact and focus on the transgirls being banned.

SingleSexSpacesInSchools · 02/12/2025 15:48

they turned comments off on their IG post so people have moved on to the next post down their feed...

Needingtoanewjob · 02/12/2025 15:41

SingleSexSpacesInSchools · 02/12/2025 14:26

I mean, give them more than 19 minutes to update the website maybe :)

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Their comms plan must have been thought out. It'd be interesting to see it.

I know a lot of websites are 'live when live' and there's very little changing live policy pages. but they should have timed a press release to sit on the site released when the email got sent and then policies changed then.

OpheliaWitchoftheWoods · 02/12/2025 15:34

This reply has been withdrawn

This has been withdrawn by MNHQ at the poster's request.

TWETMIRF · 02/12/2025 15:34

I'm pleased that they are finally acknowledging they have to follow the law but still not sure if I want to stay as a leader. Can't leave right now though as they would count me in the stats of volunteers they lost because of this decision

LeftieRightsHoarder · 02/12/2025 15:34

SingleSexSpacesInSchools · 02/12/2025 14:29

https://www.reddit.com/r/transgenderUK/comments/1pc8kzd/girlguiding_banning_trans_members/

"Absolutely shameful, but also, I don't see the need for Girlguides to exist as an organisation to begin with.
There's no such thing as 'Boy' Scouts in the UK, the Scout Association is fully gender inclusive and doesn't exclude girls, boys or otherwise. Everybody is welcome to learn, socialise and take part in all aspects.
Why is there a gatekept 'girl only' version in the first place? Even setting aside this ridiculous trans ruling, it's past time to either integrate it fully into the Scouts making it fully accessible, or kick the whole organisation to the curb."

Written by a dude I think..

I don't see the need for Girlguides to exist as an organisation to begin with. ... it's past time to either integrate it fully into the Scouts making it fully accessible, or kick the whole organisation to the curb.

Very helpful when they say the quiet bit out loud. Girls are routinely talked over, pushed aside and dominated by boys, but why should girls have anything of their own?

HermioneWeasley · 02/12/2025 15:33

The FB page has hundreds of posts expressing horror at this decision. Absolutely boggling how parents and leaders are wiling to sacrifice their daughters to showcase how incisive they are