Transgender women to be banned from all female Olympic events

I absolutely agree with you. The point I was trying to make, which obviously I failed miserably, was in part at least, that the scientific evidence was already there and the IOC didn't really need to do anything more than make their ruling. My experience in this goes back some years now and yes, the language has changed. You're right, sex change surgery is what was commonly known as " gender reassignment" which, in some ways, could be argued as more accurate than " sex change" as we know, one's sex can not be changed. The clear evidence, albeit dated now, was that even after "sex change surgery and hormone replacement", if done so post puberty, the subject kept all the strengths and weaknesses they had before surgery. Of course, by and large, that's when such surgery is done in most countries. In some places though, surgery and hormone treatment is done before puberty and the outcomes are slightly different in terms of strength etc. Even so, the broad point remains that one is still the same sex as born, whether or not one has had surgery and hormone treatment.

I'm absolutely a strong supporter of the proposition to ban transgender individuals from competing in single-sex events and the sooner the IOC makes it's policy statement the better. Having been involved (and still am) in elite level sport I know just how important it is.
We're on the same side on this point.

She is no longer permitted to practise medicine as her entry has been removed from the medical register because she refused to engage with the requirements for appraisal & revalidation.

For many, if not most, Dr is a courtesy title and they have MBs not MDs. Since she refused to revalidate, should she even be calling herself a Dr?

Don't feed it...

I’d say you’d be rather suprised at my education.

You are experiencing a short term delusion in the grand scheme of history. No one can change their sex and while some barbaric surgery has been done upon people suffering from gender dysphoria - we will look back on this time frame in horror.

Please dress as you like but sex is immutable and respect sex based rights.

That you missed the opportunity to educate yourself.

Flaying of penises or your education?

In an ideal world that would happen but I'd bet my house on it not happening. It's been proven that East German women had wide spread cheating in the past. There was an enquiry and lots have admitted to it. Yet the medals have not been revoked and given to the women who deserved them. In this case the men weren't technically cheating as the rules at the time permitted them to enter.

How on earth can she possibly be considered fit to practice medicine?

She is no longer permitted to practise medicine as her entry has been removed from the medical register because she refused to engage with the requirements for appraisal & revalidation.

Very late to the thread.
In an attempt to not miss out on some reasoning or point you've made, what do you mean by gender reassignment surgery is sex change surgery?
If someone wants to change their appearance through surgery to resemble the other gender I'm fine with that as long as I don't have to pay for it. But humans can't change sex.
There's a painting by the artist Rene Magritte called the treachery of images. The painting is of a smoker's pipe. Underneath the pipe are the words "this is not a pipe" ( in French ). The painting is clearly of a pipe. Magritte is making the point that it's a painting of a pipe not a real pipe.
Some trans talking points remind me of this painting. You can make a thing look like a different thing, but it is not, at it's essence the thing it pretends to be. It is different.
You can make a painting of a pipe, but you cannot use the painting to smoke tobacco like a pipe.
Males can undergo surgery to make their features look more like females, but they remain male. There is no procedure of any kind that allows humans to change sex.

Yes, 'Sex Change' was the most common euphemism of the day, when it was really just a few hundred men who wanted to be women. Before 'Gender Identity Theory' was born. Most of these were 'Flying to Malaga' as they say, as is also the case now,

It's a shame you missed it

its wonderful that you get the opportunity to educate yourself.

If I get a male horse & flay it’s penis and stitch it back and trim its hooves, put some bows in it’s hair I don’t have a female horse, I have a male horse disfigured by surgery. If a vet did this it would be seen as animal abuse.

Shaving your Adams apple means you still have one. You’re a man disfigured by non essential surgery.

X provides some helpful context 😂

They had ‘lady dicks’ because their XY chromosomes identified as female?

As a male, I agree.

I just read this absolute gem on r/news:

"It's wild how much people cannot get over grade school human anatomy. They learn that men are stronger than woman and nothing ever changes that reality. Modern scientific data disputes Ms. Goodman's science class? Nonsense!"

I expect there will be quite a bit of ‘we have always been at war with Eastasia’ rewriting of history from some quarters.

I watched the Press Preview on Sky News tonight, with Kevin Maguire and Sarah Vine.
It was preceded by the sports reporter putting Donald Trump into his very first sentence - he claimed it was Trump's threat to deny a visa to trans athletes at the LA Olympics that caused the change of heart in the IOC. The rest of his piece was pretty fair about male post-puberty advantage, etc etc.

I expected Sarah Vine to welcome the banning of trans identifying male athletes in women's competitions, which she did with gusto and some good points.

I think Kevin Maguire is with the Mirror? From previous Press Preview appearances, I expected him to be quite 'poor oppressed minorities' about it, but in fact he was full-on Terf! The presence of transwomen was always wrong and threatened the very existence of women's sports. Not only should transwomen be banned from women's sports, but women's spaces 'like changing rooms', refuges, prisons etc. etc.

But when he said he always thought it was wrong, I wondered was that always the line he took in the Mirror? did he always stand up for women's spaces, for the Darlington Nurses, against the sexist Trade Unions etc? I may do some digging about his past take on the trans issue...

The only downside was both Vine and Maguire got the Khelif thing wrong - Vine said he was trans, Maguire corrected her and said 'she' was born a woman and there had been some horrible discriminatory things said about her, and there is a range of physiques in women blah blah.

But it certainly was a refreshing change from the TWAW/marginalised/only want to live life in peace line we've been used to.

The supertanker is turning...

Thank god the madness seems to be subsiding.

Over on reddit, they're melting down. "Trans people are going to kill themselves because of this... TERFS are pure evil... all sport is inherently unfair... there are hardly any trans athletes, this is a distraction from the real issues... it's all designed to whip up hate against trans people..."

But what's becoming obvious is that eventually, online spaces such as reddit will be the only place left where TRAs have any kind of power. I'm not saying that day will come soon, but we're heading in that direction. Look how different the situation is now from, say, 2019 - or even 2022, for that matter. And in the end, a chokehold on Internet forums doesn't convert to any real power. The trans powermods can delete as many posts as they like; what difference does it make when organisations such as the IOC and the Supreme Court are no longer playing along?

Surely Webberley is just taking the piss by using a picture of Hubbard....

'Gender reassignment' involves surgery in only a minority of cases. And when it does it's pick and mix, not a comprehensive all-or-nothing package.

Exactly! Doh

Look, I'm on your side here and the sooner the IOC comes out with their ruling the better. But this is not "trans propaganda". I have been heavily involved with this subject and not only did I have a male to female trans person working for me in a Government organisation but I had to research the issue with regard to sport. So I'm not going to argue with you. I'm just telling you the facts and put simply, it's what I said before which is what you've quoted. Male-female after puberty, even with full surgery, they continue to have the strength of male, irrespective of hormone treatment etc.