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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

They scraped Mumsnet again.

314 replies

ArabellaSaurus · 08/11/2025 17:26

archive.ph/e0u3Z

https://bulletin.appliedtransstudies.org/article/4/1-3/7/

Another data scrape. I'd say it's also defamatory against Mumsnet.

I've archived.

Article is a load of tedious wank, as you'd expect.

'In this study, however, we excavate what it means to write like a GC by analyzing how GC forum users rely on reactionary language and deploy storytelling practices in ways that calcify their anti-trans ideologies as personal and natural while rendering transgender people as anti-feminist, dangerous, and monstrous. To identify how GC groups perform political mythmaking and construct extremist identities, we undertook a computationally assisted discursive analysis of two popular GC forums: Ovarit and Mumsnet’s “Feminism: Sex & Gender” board (abbreviated to “FSG”). Through comparative platform discourse analysis, we analyzed over 80k posts and comments scraped from Ovarit and over 60k posts and comments scraped from Mumsnet (Burgess and Matamoros-Fernández 2016; Lewis and Marwick 2017)'

The only mildly amusing thing about it is the name of the Journal.

BATS.

“I Took a Deep Breath and Came Out as GC”: Gender Critical Storytelling, Radicalization, and Discursive Practice on Ovarit and Mumsnet

Following the closure of the anti-trans subreddit r/GenderCritical, gender critical (GC) internet users have migrated to more obscure, invite-only spaces. A side-effect of this GC dispersal is that activity in online anti-trans spaces has become increa...

https://bulletin.appliedtransstudies.org/article/4/1-3/7/

OP posts:
Thread gallery
11
IwantToRetire · 08/11/2025 19:28

Sorry no time to read thread in full but will come back as important.

And yes please, do highlight on site stuff.

But as a first impression it looks like they just set out to "affirm" their believes.

ie challenging the notion of work, that to question trans ideology is right wing, all the usual - and hate to say it so american virtually useless in terms of FWR (why FSG?) as they clear dont understand the use of english in the UK.

KittyWilkinson · 08/11/2025 19:27

They are like moths to our eternal flame.

It never ends well for the moths.

Boiledbeetle · 08/11/2025 19:20

ArabellaSaurus · 08/11/2025 19:07

It's ChatGPT!

I'm shocked! Shocked I tell you!

You'd never catch me using AI!!

<Keeps fingers behind back tightly crossed>

Shortshriftandlethal · 08/11/2025 19:10

ArabellaSaurus · 08/11/2025 17:33

A typical nerdy male profile and catalogue of interests.

ArabellaSaurus · 08/11/2025 19:07

It's ChatGPT!

OP posts:
spannasaurus · 08/11/2025 19:06

@ArabellaSaurus That's brilliant 👏

ArabellaSaurus · 08/11/2025 19:04

Institutional Herpetology: A Preliminary Study
Abstract:
Recent surveys reveal an ecological imbalance within academic environments, where Pythons (verbose, self-referential males in theoretical plumage) increasingly displace Vipers (experienced females exhibiting concise intellectual strike capacity).
Findings:
Pythons dominate via constrictive discourse — endless loops of citation that immobilise meaning. Vipers rely on venom: brevity, evidence, and memory. Administrative climates now cultivate the Python temperament, rewarding performance over precision.
Conclusion:
While Pythons generate impressive coils of language, they seldom produce movement. Vipers, though endangered, remain the only species capable of puncturing the fabric of institutional fog.

(see also: Departmental Minutes, passim)

OP posts:
ArabellaSaurus · 08/11/2025 19:01

GummyBearette · 08/11/2025 18:46

Using their little pythons again.

Pythons V Vipers LETS GO

OP posts:
SnoopyPajamas · 08/11/2025 18:53

If we've been "calcified", I can only assume the author of the study is suffering the reverse: osteoporosis of thought. His insufficiently hardened thinking has resulted in a localised porosity of the skull.

Fascinating stuff. Just fascinating.

theilltemperedmaggotintheheartofthelaw · 08/11/2025 18:52

GC posters create and share narratives of their own radicalization (or “peaking”) to sanitize their extremism as personal and epistemic. GC posters demonstrated savvy, well-refined storytelling practices that framed their radicalization as affective and individual, further ensconcing their political identity through stories of self-enlightenment.

(Preens.)

Cart before horse, isn't it?

plantcomplex · 08/11/2025 18:48

It's just abusive men abusing women again. Same old.

CraftandGlamour · 08/11/2025 18:48

If it sounds BATS and acts BATS it's completely BATS.

Sadly, I think these young men really need to go outside, touch grass, breathe fresh air and, crucially, get off the computers and phones that are curdling their brains and destroying any hope of having a life well lived. It's all rather tragic.

GummyBearette · 08/11/2025 18:46

ArabellaSaurus · 08/11/2025 17:38

'Data Collection

This study relied on a computationally-assisted discourse analysis of data collected from FSG and Ovarit using Python notebooks developed by one of the authors. Data from each platform was collected and analyzed separately, using the means below.
...
Mumsnet

Mumsnet posts within the FSG board are organized in a single feed. While Ovarit has forum subcategories (circles), FSG is a subforum itself, and does not have subcategories. Given that the discussion on FSG regularly involves trans- and gender-related subjects, it was likewise important to grab a wide sample. We scraped the most recent 3,767 threads and an accompanying 57,791 comments.5 In each case, the text, username, datetime, post type, and thread URL were collected. Data was collected in April of 2024.'

Using their little pythons again.

OneCraftyMentor · 08/11/2025 18:45

I would have thought that it counts as slander.

The usual "gender critical" (which I didn't see described anywhere) being equated with "anti-trans".

Claims that terms that mumsnet users use like trans identified male are inherently anti trans.

SnoopyPajamas · 08/11/2025 18:45

Oh, I've definitely been calcified. Nothing strengthens the bones like coming out as a TERF! I've got a spine like steel like now.

MrsOvertonsWindow · 08/11/2025 18:42

QueenProtea · 08/11/2025 18:16

Yet more tedious incel wankers who cannot stand the fact that women are standing up and fighting back against their misogyny!

"incel wankers"
Now there's an accurate phrase that doesn't get used enough in society 😁

Magpiecomplex · 08/11/2025 18:41

I note there's a spelling mistake in the abstract.

That's academic 101 - make sure your abstract uses correct SPAG. Red pen, lads, see me.

MassiveWordSalad · 08/11/2025 18:38

I love you @Boiledbeetle

Not in a creepy way, I promise 😁

MassiveWordSalad · 08/11/2025 18:37

I wonder how well this article will be received by academia. Will it be a BATS hit?

I’ll get me coat

Boiledbeetle · 08/11/2025 18:34

Igneococcus · 08/11/2025 18:03

I know it wasn't in the Bluestocking but it was Boiled so it kind of counts, my favourite ever MN moment in nearly 20 years of MNetting was her first interpretive dance routing. You could, even online, tell how utter baffled the person who dominated that thread was by it all.

Just for you...

“The Chrysalis of Identity” — A Beetle’s Interpretative Dance

Scene:

A softly lit forest clearing at dusk. Fireflies pulse like stage lights. A single beetle, clad in shimmering iridescent wing-capes and delicate antennae extensions, steps onto a mossy platform. The audience: a circle of attentive woodland creatures, seated on toadstools and curled-up leaves.

Act I: Biological Blueprint
🎵 Music: Rhythmic, pulsing drumbeats echoing heartbeat-like patterns.

The beetle begins with rigid, mechanical movements—sharp pivots, symmetrical leg extensions, and synchronized wing flutters.
Each motion mimics chromosomes locking into place, the choreography spelling out “XX” and “XY” with antennae gestures.
A brief duet with a second beetle illustrates reproductive anatomy—mirrored movements, then divergence.
🗣️ Narration (in pheromone bursts):

“Sex is the blueprint—assigned at birth, rooted in biology.”

Act II: The Fluid Flourish
🎵 Music: Ethereal strings and ambient tones, like wind through reeds.

The beetle sheds its rigid form, unfurling wing-capes dyed in shifting hues—blue, pink, gold, and green.
Movements become flowing, expressive: spirals, twirls, and pauses that linger like questions.
It mimics the act of choosing garments, names, pronouns—each gesture a declaration of self.
The beetle dances with a mirrored version of itself, now adorned differently, showing that identity can evolve.
🗣️ Narration (in scent trails):

“Gender is the dance—performed, felt, expressed. Not fixed, but fluid.”

Act III: Harmony and Dissonance
🎵 Music: A blend of the previous themes—biological beats and expressive melodies intertwine.

The beetle now moves between both styles, sometimes rigid, sometimes fluid.
It encounters other beetles—some who match its rhythm, others who challenge it.
Together, they form a kaleidoscope of movement, each honoring their own truth.
🗣️ Final message (etched in dew on a leaf):

“Understanding blooms when we let the dance unfold.”

They scraped Mumsnet again.
They scraped Mumsnet again.
They scraped Mumsnet again.
They scraped Mumsnet again.
They scraped Mumsnet again.
Domesticatednottamed · 08/11/2025 18:34

DuesToTheDirt · 08/11/2025 18:16

Is this supposed to be a serious academic paper? Because that intro reads like something from Reddit.

"deploying far-right language and rhetoric"
"further entrenching them in organized transphobia"

It's not about you potatoes!

Well quite, some people might think a music degree frivolous and goddess knows DH and I can bang on defining terms and sounding perhaps a tad niche, but this wanky bollocks is right off the scale.
I wonder if non-hierarchical uni-intervallic pandiatonicism will get the turgid gerbils holistically potatoed?

AstonUniversityDataScrapingDepartment · 08/11/2025 18:33

I have read it. I would be interested to see the peer reviews. (In my discipline these are also published.)

I would also be interested to see evidence of the editorial decision making process, not least evidence (or not) of due diligence wrt data use. It wouldn't take anyone long to see that (1) this kind of scraping is against T&Cs and (2) that MN is prepared to take legal action.

Finally, I hope MN looks at the "data availability statement" in which the authors of this article offer to give their scraped data to others.

FrippEnos · 08/11/2025 18:32

For an academic paper it fails on bias.

I would also guess that they haven't spoken to anyone that is on MN or Overit, or anyone that plays D&D.

Shedmistress · 08/11/2025 18:30

Never calling it FSG that's for damn sure.

EdithStourton · 08/11/2025 18:27

Whoever developed 'BATS' should really have thought much harder about the name...
Bulletin of Applied Transgender Studies (Holistic, Integrated, Turgid), perhaps?

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