Demonstration against Let Women Speak Oxford

Who argues there is a binary opposition between gender and sex, though? I don’t understand what you mean or what the argument would be. A binary opposite is related concepts that are opposite in meaning - on-off; light-dark and so on. So we talk about the opposite sex to mean the sex different from ourselves.
Gender and sex are different categories. Female (sex, biological) is not the same as feminine (gender, socially constructed) and male (sex, biological) is not the same as masculine (gender, socially constructed). But I have never heard anyone argue that sex and gender are binary opposites, just that one is biological and the other is socially constructed, in fact, I would probably say that socially constructed gender stereotypes have their roots in historical understandings of being female or male so they are relational (whether you agree with them or not) rather than opposites.

Of course there are religions that are also ethnicities, and UK law recognises that. Sikhism is one. Judaism is another.

(I think the same thing might apply to other ethnically based and highly endogamous religious communities like Nestorians, Zoroastrians and Armenian Apostolic Christians, but that's a guess based on case law around Sikh and Jewish cases.)

That doesn't apply to explicitly universalist religions like Islam or Catholicism or Anglicanism.

But it's quite funny to be having that conversation in a week when Birmingham has decided that Jews can't watch football there, and this is very largely down to the emergence of Muslim sectarian politics as a powerful factor in Birmingham.

@Howseitgoin I'm struggling to get my head around the idea that Indonesian muslims share any ethnic characteristics with Nigerian Muslims.

Quite henestly I don't know why he was there. Presumably he turns up at any demo to give out Korans and literature.
Can't see why KJK needs to humour him.

No

Ohhhhh, facts hurt your fee feez?

No

"Racism is the belief that groups of humans possess different behavioral traits corresponding to inherited attributes and can be divided based on the superiority of one race or ethnicity over another.[1][2][3] It may also mean prejudice, discrimination, or antagonism directed against other people because they are of a different ethnic background.[2]"

We get complexity doesn't come natural to GC's so here, go & learn something:

https://www.newarab.com/opinion/ethnicity-vs-religion-what-does-being-muslim-mean

I would imagine that in different circumstances, Kellie Jay and Ramzy might have had a calmer conversation. The fact that he decided to joined a raging mob of men trying to shut down her event and similar mobs have literally come very close to killing her as well as constantly threatening her life and family members, we can see why it might not have been the most measured and productive conversation.

The people on this thread constantly lying and smearing her are as bad as the mob of men trying to intimidate and silence ordinary women telling their stories. Their selective inhumanity is mind boggling.

The one who summarily sacked his (free) advisor on violence against women because she stands up for women.

Nice chap. 🙄

Good spot - you're quite right, Hitler was indeed a committed vegetarian.

Perhaps you should reconsider your position if it means that you have to voice support a mob of 100 people, mostly men, repeatedly shouting down lone women trying to express their opinions?

Maybe grown-up protesters could have only shouted down KJK and respectfully listened to the other women? I guess that option evaded them in their frenzy of self-righteousness

It's fucking exhausting

You misrepresented the only ‘evidence’ you have produced so far so I’m going to take your ‘justification’ with a pinch of salt.

It wouldn’t be us you need to convince that you are not committing libel, it would be the lawyers. You seem to have a habit of misrepresenting many things so I wouldn’t be too sure.

I'm sure I bore people by mentioning the SWP, but they're heavily embedded in these activist circles, and people who turn up to scold us about being "adjacent" to bad people always go very quiet when they're mentioned. It's as if there's a tacit agreement not to hold that rape stuff against them.

And what came out in the Martin Smith scandal was only the tip of the iceberg.

I'll allow that a random person who sees a "rally against Tommy Robinson" poster might not know who they are, but the union officials who fund their campaigns do, and so do the Labour MPs who speak on their platforms, and so do the dimwit celebrities who sign their open letters.

Awww bless him. I’m sure he’s trying his best.

Well according to Howse, it's an ethnicity. Yep, 2 billion people, one quarter of the world's population is one single ethnic group 🙄

So I assume he’s very vocal in his condemnation of Iran, Iraq, Palestine and Saudi Arabia? I mean, if he supports gay rights, he’ll be speaking out very clearly against those countries I presume?

She still hasn’tt answered my questions about what Sheikh Ramzy is doing to help combat the Pakistani Muslim grooming gangs in Oxford.

Just keeps repeating the same false accusations and smears. I guess that’s all that’s left.

As someone who is also cool and multicultural enough to have ‘chatted to Dr Ramzy outside Tesco on Cowley Road’ and was once part of the same activist circles as @cowleycyclist clearly is, I actually think it says a lot about the environment around gender debates that KJK and Dr Ramzy did have such an antagonistic interaction as both of them make a huge point of their I-talk-to-anyone stance. He’s no fundamentalist and is mostly a very active and committed force for good, though has said some things I doubt the gender ideologues would be happy with (here’s one online example - gayness not a ‘great sin’ but gay marriage a step too far - https://www.oxfordmail.co.uk/news/opinion/columns/10517473.faithfully-gay-not-sin-eyes-islam/). He shows up to every protest so I doubt he’s particularly informed about this particular topic tbh. As has been pointed out the counter protestors don’t seem to mind being heavily SWP rape-apologist branded so maybe they do tolerate more diversity of thought than it sometimes appears. As long as it’s men.

I wouldn’t go to a LWS rally these days, the organisers have become far too entrenched in far right circles and discussions, sadly. Doesn’t make the ‘counter protestors‘ look any better, or absolve the privileged navel gazing Green party ‘non binary’ councillors and their supporters of passing motions that attempt to remove single sex spaces and services in Oxford (like homeless shelters, rape support, etc). ETAH as they say on reddit.

How is it racism? Islam isn’t a Race. It’s a religion.

Any chance of you answering my questions about the counter-protest being organised by rape defenders?

Or should we agree to turn a blind eye because, hey, at least they're left wing rape defenders?

I only ask because guilt by association only seems to go one way.

Do you mean the mayor of London who believes women don’t deserve rights? That mayor?

Omg she is even a fan of Trump. The mind boggles.

I guess I shouldn’t be surprised, it meshes nicely with all her other views.

https://x.com/ThePosieParker/status/1975812947822989477

I looked at the footage, there was an older lady with a flag.

Are you now smearing every man at an LWS as a ‘flag shagger’

I’ll ask my question again as you haven’t answered it

Have you got any evidence for this sweeping generalisation about a group of men you don’t know? Or are you just trying to smear KJK and women’s rights supporters?

Death threats and a forced public apology with police involvement for a boy present when a Koran was slightly damaged. He didn’t do any damage, he was just there. Not very proportionate eh?

A teacher in Batley forced to go into hiding (and still is afaik) for showing a caricature of Mohammed.

If these things didn’t happen we couldn’t criticise them.

https://www.newstatesman.com/the-weekend-report/2023/03/inside-wakefield-koran-incident

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-leeds-68659435?app-referrer=deep-link