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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Consultation on future access to the Hampstead Heath Bathing Ponds - Closes 25 November 2025

139 replies

IwantToRetire · 30/09/2025 18:57

The City of London Corporation has launched a public consultation to help inform future access arrangements at Hampstead Heath’s Bathing Ponds.

The consultation invites feedback from pond users, the local community, and stakeholders on how the Kenwood Ladies’, and Highgate Men’s ponds should operate in the future.

The consultation is open until 12:00 on Tuesday 25 November 2025.

https://hampstead-heath-bathing-ponds.commonplace.is/

Opened today and I found out via an Irish newspaper!

I know there is an existing thread about legal challenge but thought it good to have the news of the consultation being open as a thread title.

Future access to the Hampstead Heath Bathing Ponds

Inviting feedback from pond users, the local community, and stakeholders on how the Kenwood Ladies’, and Highgate Men’s ponds should operate in the future.

https://hampstead-heath-bathing-ponds.commonplace.is

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StopRainingNow · 04/10/2025 15:55

Interestingly. I just replied for my partner and myself and the options were different for wcag of us!!

MissScarletInTheBallroom · 04/10/2025 15:50

Curlewcurfew · 04/10/2025 15:48

That would be devastating. It's better to have an occasional, well-meaning trans person than open mixed sex, because the entire point of the Ladies' and Men's ponds is the single sex space. It's not about swimming as a sport or leisure activity (anyone can go to swimming pools for that) or for the outdoor experience (we have the mixed ponds for that), but for the unique, special community where we can feel safe and free.

Edited

What, this is why we can't have nice things? Because if trans identifying men can't swim in a space free from (other men), neither can women?

Curlewcurfew · 04/10/2025 15:48

HPFA · 04/10/2025 15:25

I think the consultation is about whether to continue having single sex spaces at all?

That would be devastating. It's better to have an occasional, well-meaning trans person than open mixed sex, because the entire point of the Ladies' and Men's ponds is the single sex space. It's not about swimming as a sport or leisure activity (anyone can go to swimming pools for that) or for the outdoor experience (we have the mixed ponds for that), but for the unique, special community where we can feel safe and free.

HPFA · 04/10/2025 15:25

MissScarletInTheBallroom · 30/09/2025 19:10

Why do they think they need to have a consultation about whether to obey the law or not?

I think the consultation is about whether to continue having single sex spaces at all?

oldclock · 04/10/2025 15:18

MissScarletInTheBallroom · 30/09/2025 19:10

Why do they think they need to have a consultation about whether to obey the law or not?

I have included in my response several comments about what a waste of money the consultation is as only one option is legal.......

Longtimelurkerfinallyposts · 04/10/2025 15:12

I said I disagreed less (than 'strongly') with the idea of having specific trans-inclusive times than with their other 'options' - because at least anyone who wanted a genuinely single-sex space could choose to avoid the pond during those times - but with the proviso that these advertised times would only take place occasionally (eg for a few hours once a month) and not become the default/ majority of the time. Weekly would be too often in my view!

The Guardian ran the story today: https://www.theguardian.com/society/2025/oct/04/hampstead-heath-swimming-ponds-considering-limiting-transgender-users-access

Hampstead Heath swimming ponds considering limiting transgender users’ access

Trans swimmers currently able to use a mixed pond or either of the segregated ponds for the gender they identify as

https://www.theguardian.com/society/2025/oct/04/hampstead-heath-swimming-ponds-considering-limiting-transgender-users-access

ChazsBrilliantAttitude · 04/10/2025 12:33

Curlewcurfew · 04/10/2025 12:28

I filled it in and now I'm worried because it implies it's public. Will my email address be visible? I might lose my job if it's seen.

Edited

It’s public only in as much as they are asking the public.The results will be aggregated and summarised.

Consultation on future access to the Hampstead Heath Bathing Ponds - Closes 25 November 2025
Curlewcurfew · 04/10/2025 12:28

I filled it in and now I'm worried because it implies it's public. Will my email address be visible? I might lose my job if it's seen.

ChazsBrilliantAttitude · 04/10/2025 12:28

Also done. I asked about whether they had done an Equality Impact Assessment on the impact of the PC of race and religion as well as sex. I also pointed out that the consultation was not a good use of taxpayers money when you can’t use a consultation to avoid legal obligations. I also emphasised that there was adequate provision for trans through the mixed sex pond.

Not sure if it will make any difference but at least they can’t pretend nobody objected.

71Alex · 04/10/2025 10:04

I filled it out briefly, saying that their ‘trans-inclusive’ options were discriminatory and referred them to the Supreme Court judgement and the Sex Matters judicial review.

Agree with pp that they are consulting on whether or not to comply with the law.

SqueakyDinosaur · 04/10/2025 09:30

I went heavy on religiously observant Jewish and Muslim women currently having nowhere to swim, and how that's a breach of the EA2010.

puffyisgood · 04/10/2025 08:34

A reasonable compromise might be to make them strictly single sex but then have a regular thing like a 'trans Tuesday' or whatever whereby bathers can identify into whichever pond they like.

Though I doubt the TIM's would go for that, real women would avoid the Tuesdays, leaving it initially a pure sausage feast and very quickly attended by no-one, once the fun of being around women had been taken away from the TIM's.

Springflowersyay · 03/10/2025 04:35

I’ve filled it in. Yes, it’s the same question asked in various guises……….

SpidersAreShitheads · 03/10/2025 04:26

I’m glad to see so many people have responded. Even if you think it’s a fool’s exercise, I think it’s important we register our voices.

They can try to discredit opinions they don’t like as much as they want but they can’t avoid their legal obligations.

If they make all three ponds mixed sex the TRAs will be bloody furious. They don’t want to swim with women in mixed facilities, they want to be able to demand access to women’s single-sex spaces. We’ve seen this time and again.

I doubt they’ll discredit opinions again - especially in light of recent events. They could be asked to justify that in court and they know they’ll have no response.

As many women as possible need to fill it in - and you don’t need to live in London to do so. If you feel able to do so, then please do.

On a separate note, it’s hilarious that so many of us independent of each other told them to shove their stupid gender question up their arse (I’m paraphrasing somewhat) đŸ˜‚

Ereshkigalangcleg · 03/10/2025 00:33

moto748e · 03/10/2025 00:10

The transactivists just want to ruin the ponds for everyone.

Well yes they do, and that's the story so often, isn't it? If we can't have exactly what we want, we'll fuck it up for everyone. And too many foolish men, and their handmaidens, let them get away with it.

Yep.

moto748e · 03/10/2025 00:10

The transactivists just want to ruin the ponds for everyone.

Well yes they do, and that's the story so often, isn't it? If we can't have exactly what we want, we'll fuck it up for everyone. And too many foolish men, and their handmaidens, let them get away with it.

2Rebecca · 02/10/2025 23:54

I said single sex and the mixed sex pool as they used to be or make all 3 mixed if they won’t segregate by sex. This really is silly as they have a mixed sex pool which is the only one I’ve swum in as I was with my son. The transactivists just want to ruin the ponds for everyone.

2Rebecca · 02/10/2025 23:50

Done.

Itmakesme · 02/10/2025 19:06

hallouminatus · 01/10/2025 18:04

About 12 EDI questions. Every one of them has the option "prefer not to say" except, strangely, the question about sexual orientation. I wonder why you're not allowed to prefer not to declare your sexual orientation?
And although you can "prefer not to say" your gender, "none" is not an option.

I pointed that out in my answer and also said I am not sure what some of what they refer to as genders are and can they provide clarity as there is no objective understanding of some of the choices.

I have no gender as it’s a construct. I pointed that out.

It’s skewed so badly and they haven’t been neutral in the way the data is requested.

I laughed at the worst outcome will be all the ponds are mixed…. They already are mate! You have what you say you don’t want. Illogical idiots.

maltravers · 02/10/2025 18:55

I’ve submitted mine.
The CoL corporation is also mad keen on replacing long banks of single sex loos with gender neutral ones, in their up and coming revamp at the Barbican Centre. Most attendees at the Hall seem to be in their sixties and up, this is not going to go down well with their customers, but who cares about them! A bit like the lady swimmers. There was a questionnaire, you will not be surprised to hear that it did not ask whether people wanted single sex or gender neutral loos. I wonder if the court case on the ponds will focus a few minds at the CoL..?

WeMeetInFairIthilien · 02/10/2025 18:18

I've replied too.
I particularly enjoyed pointing out that making all 3 ponds mixed sex was rather cutting off their noses to spite their faces - if pesky women are making a fuss about having single sex spaces then fine, all the spaces can be mixed sex.
And then they would need to change the names of the ponds.

StellaAndCrow · 02/10/2025 14:36

secureyourbook · 02/10/2025 08:53

I filled it in, such a frustrating survey. Numerous questions asking basically the same thing and getting the same answer! They shouldn’t be bloody consulting on whether they follow the law anyway, as if it’s optional.

Yes, and amazing that they offer five different options for configuration of the ponds, and only one of these options would provide a single sex space.

LittleBitofBread · 02/10/2025 09:53

secureyourbook · 02/10/2025 08:53

I filled it in, such a frustrating survey. Numerous questions asking basically the same thing and getting the same answer! They shouldn’t be bloody consulting on whether they follow the law anyway, as if it’s optional.

Yes, I just basically gave the same answers over and over. (namely, the fact that anything called 'women's' or 'ladies' must by law be single-sex; the reasons why women need single-sex spaces; the fact that many women will be self-excluding for cultural/religious reasons and reasons of traumatic past experiences, not to mention just not wanting to swim or change with men); the logistical nightmare that would ensue if they implemented the suggestion of having single-sex changing rooms and toilets but mixed/'trans-inclusive' ponds; how the 'hybrid' approach of being for certain people at certain specified times would also be a logistical nightmare, plus exclude people for whom the times didn't work... and on and on.

We'll see what happens.

Harassedevictee · 02/10/2025 09:37

I have filled it in.

secureyourbook · 02/10/2025 08:53

I filled it in, such a frustrating survey. Numerous questions asking basically the same thing and getting the same answer! They shouldn’t be bloody consulting on whether they follow the law anyway, as if it’s optional.

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