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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Interview with Kara Dansky and Charlie Kirk

139 replies

Appalonia · 14/09/2025 00:44

There's been a lot of pp saying how hateful he was, especially as regards to women, but I think it's useful to know that he was willing to platform someone like Kara Dansky, a self professed left wing feminist, and to know that he actually listened to what she had to say. I hate how polarised politics has become, and I think what we need right now more than ever is to actually listen to pp that we disagree with.

Kara is at just the same risk of being murdered for her views as Charlie was, and he definitely didnt deserve to die for them.

https://open.substack.com/pub/karadansky/p/my-2022-interview-with-charlie-kirk?utmcampaign=post&utmmedium=web

My 2022 interview with Charlie Kirk

September 13, 2025

https://karadansky.substack.com/p/my-2022-interview-with-charlie-kirk?triedRedirect=true

OP posts:
Howseitgoin · 16/09/2025 02:58

eatfigs · 16/09/2025 02:43

She expressed a left-wing radical feminist perspective that most of Kirk's audience won't even have known existed, and explains why they'd be unaware:

"Radical feminism is all about protecting the rights, privacy, and safety of women and girls. And we cannot do that as a movement if we cannot define the category of women and girls to exclude males."

"Most mainstream media outlets will not talk about us. The New York Times will not talk about us. The Washington Post, NBC, ABC, CBS, MSNBC. None of them will platform leftist, feminist, gay rights, critiques of 'gender identity'."

"And I also just want to say, because your listeners have no reason to know this, opposition to 'gender identity' in the UK is mainly coming from rank-and-file members of the Labour Party. And their media will talk about it."

"There are rank-and-file Democrats all over the country who are so fired up and angry about this, but they don't get a voice because the media will not cover our angle."

Um, look, I don't know how to break this to you, but the far right believe the actual "rights of women" are the problem. IE they don't believe in equality. As far as privacy & safety go that's not news to anyone including them. In fact they happily exploit that angle to remove the rights of women. IE it's a defense why women are safer…at home……

eatfigs · 16/09/2025 02:43

Howseitgoin · 16/09/2025 02:06

Please do enlighten us all as to what exactly Dansky gained for her cause by preaching to Kirk's already converted choir? The answer is nothing. By virtue of being part of Kirk's audience membership means they don't need any 'persuading'/'awareness'. On the other hand, Kirk needs to persuade the centre/centre left that he's a reasonable guy with reasonable views. He wants to further legitimise his far right nationalist misogynistic cause to a wider audience. 'See, we are on the same page, let me tell you more….'

She expressed a left-wing radical feminist perspective that most of Kirk's audience won't even have known existed, and explains why they'd be unaware:

"Radical feminism is all about protecting the rights, privacy, and safety of women and girls. And we cannot do that as a movement if we cannot define the category of women and girls to exclude males."

"Most mainstream media outlets will not talk about us. The New York Times will not talk about us. The Washington Post, NBC, ABC, CBS, MSNBC. None of them will platform leftist, feminist, gay rights, critiques of 'gender identity'."

"And I also just want to say, because your listeners have no reason to know this, opposition to 'gender identity' in the UK is mainly coming from rank-and-file members of the Labour Party. And their media will talk about it."

"There are rank-and-file Democrats all over the country who are so fired up and angry about this, but they don't get a voice because the media will not cover our angle."

Howseitgoin · 16/09/2025 02:12

TempestTost · 16/09/2025 00:54

I'll just add - this is also one of the major criticisms black conservatives make about the Democrats. They think they are racists who treat black Americans as idiots who can be bribed with shiny things for votes, and then when don't vote the way they are told, those same Democrats call them racists and Uncle Toms.

Kirk wasn't saying anything that hasn't been heard from prominent black conservatives in the US. Or even in the UK.

Yes, conservatives love practicing their own version of diversity hire. Their 'favourite' economist Thomas Sowell is often trotted out not so much because he's more qualified than others but because his 'lift yourself up by your bootstraps' mentality is exploited to evade social responsibility.

GailBlancheViola · 16/09/2025 02:09

healthyteeth · 15/09/2025 23:43

This is an excellent post and sums it up well.

The problem is people are frighteningly easily manipulated and distracted.

One of the reasons he went to universities was to manipulate young people ripe for influencing.

Exactly the tactics proponents of Gender Ideology and various other political ideologies use - manipulate and influence the young in schools, universities and on various platforms on social media, I guess that is okay by you though because you agree with them.

Universities especially should be where all sides of various political, religious and social ideologies are heard, evaluated, discussed, debated, agreed with or disagreed with.

Howseitgoin · 16/09/2025 02:06

eatfigs · 16/09/2025 01:16

Interesting to observe how commonly the specific phrase "cozying up to" gets used in an attempt to shame women for speaking up.

It's a useful indicator of dishonest rhetoric.

Please do enlighten us all as to what exactly Dansky gained for her cause by preaching to Kirk's already converted choir? The answer is nothing. By virtue of being part of Kirk's audience membership means they don't need any 'persuading'/'awareness'. On the other hand, Kirk needs to persuade the centre/centre left that he's a reasonable guy with reasonable views. He wants to further legitimise his far right nationalist misogynistic cause to a wider audience. 'See, we are on the same page, let me tell you more….'

Pallisers · 16/09/2025 02:03

I suspect it wasn't really relevant to his point though. Someone can be totally qualified, even the best qualified, but if they were picked for diversity reasons, they are a diversity hire. That's one of the arguments against it, it follows people whether they are qualified or not, and casts doubts on their competence even when those doubts aren't deserved.

And yet no one seems to worry about white men being picked. Given what I know about legacy admissions and the networks in the US (I live in the US and my children all went to private prep schools that fed places like harvard) the average white graduate in Harvard is as likely to be a legacy or network hire as a black candidate is to be a DEI hire.

But no one worries about that. Wonder why?

Howseitgoin · 16/09/2025 01:58

TempestTost · 16/09/2025 00:47

More qualified? I think that's rather debatable.

I suspect it wasn't really relevant to his point though. Someone can be totally qualified, even the best qualified, but if they were picked for diversity reasons, they are a diversity hire. That's one of the arguments against it, it follows people whether they are qualified or not, and casts doubts on their competence even when those doubts aren't deserved.

And the Democrats make those kinds of decisions a lot. And it's suspect to people because if they were really the best qualified, why make a diversity decision? If they weren't, then the criticism has teeth. A lot of American conservatives see this as a statement that Democrats don't think black Americans can achieve at the same level as white Americans.

Facts aren't "debatable".

Apart from the fact that KJB graduated magna cum laude from Harvard University, then attended Harvard Law School, where she graduated cum laude and was an editor of the Harvard Law Review she is also:

"the most experienced trial court judge to join the Supreme Court in almost a century.

Jackson served on the United States District Court for the District of Columbia for nearly 8 years, giving her more trial court experience than any sitting Supreme Court justice and more than any justice since Edward Sanford, who was nominated to the Supreme Court in 1923.
Jackson would be only the second sitting justice to serve at all three levels of the federal judiciary.
Only Justice Sonia Sotomayor has also served as a District judge, Circuit judge and Supreme Court justice.
Jackson would bring more years of experience as a judge than four of the sitting justices combined.
Jackson has more than eight years of experience as a judge; that’s more than Justices Thomas, Roberts, Kagan, and Barrett had combined when they were confirmed.
Jackson would be the first public defender to become a Supreme Court justice in the history of the Court.
She would be the first justice with substantial criminal defense experience since Thurgood Marshall retired in 1991."

https://demandjustice.org/judge-ketanji-brown-jackson-is-one-of-the-most-qualified-nominees-for-the-supreme-court-ever/

https://bidenwhitehouse.archives.gov/kbj/

"I suspect it wasn't really relevant to his point though. Someone can be totally qualified, even the best qualified, but if they were picked for diversity reasons, they are a diversity hire. That's one of the arguments against it, it follows people whether they are qualified or not, and casts doubts on their competence even when those doubts aren't deserved.

And the Democrats make those kinds of decisions a lot. And it's suspect to people because if they were really the best qualified, why make a diversity decision? If they weren't, then the criticism has teeth. A lot of American conservatives see this as a statement that Democrats don't think black Americans can achieve at the same level as white Americans."

It only casts doubt because of far right indoctrination of what diversity inclusion means…. a lot like what Kirk is doing here by pretending these women were not qualified. Diversity inclusion has never suggested merit isn't necessary rather that diversity is beneficial to organisations & as such should be considered for inclusion.

Cultural diversity by virtue of sex, ethnicity, class, geography etc brings different approaches & skills to the work place of which provide higher service/profit delivery. Now that's not to assume just because an individual has a different life experience they mustn't think the same as others but that often it does which is a qualification in its self.

The great con the far right pull off here is the 'suspicion' angle. 'You are only raising suspicion' which in the context of who actually substantially gets the free ride in the college system is white people via legacy, donor & 'country club' sporting admissions. That Affirmative Action admissions are a minuscule fraction of this is conveniently ignored. Of course white people must never be 'sus'….they have always 'earned' their place…..

Ketanji Brown Jackson to serve on the U.S. Supreme Court | The White House

On April 7, 2022, a bipartisan group of Senators confirmed Judge Jackson's nomination to become the 116th Associate Justice of the United States Supreme Court.

https://bidenwhitehouse.archives.gov/kbj/

eatfigs · 16/09/2025 01:16

Howseitgoin · 15/09/2025 13:02

The OP requested comment on Dansky being interviewed by a far right figure head. My point as with many others on this thread is Kirk is anti women rights as well as anti human rights in general so 'cozying' up to him signals legitimacy & support for his views.

The far right , like GC's are biological essentialists but not for the same reason. GC's see biology as essential to protecting women's rights, the far right have & want to continue to use biology to take away women's rights. Far rightists believe feminism to be the down fall of society IE the root causes of societies problems were caused by feminism. They believe the purpose of women only as breeders & carers that's why being defined by their biology matters. Biology is destiny to them.

As they are primarily white nationalists, they believe immigration is an existential threat to the white race (see The Great Replacement Theory) & blame declining white birth rates on feminism where choice & birth control necessitated immigration. So they are not only anti abortion but anti birth control, anti women working & anti mixed marriages. Kirk has made numerous statements to this effect & some are here.

www.theguardian.com/us-news/2025/sep/11/charlie-kirk-quotes-beliefs

Interesting to observe how commonly the specific phrase "cozying up to" gets used in an attempt to shame women for speaking up.

It's a useful indicator of dishonest rhetoric.

TempestTost · 16/09/2025 00:54

I'll just add - this is also one of the major criticisms black conservatives make about the Democrats. They think they are racists who treat black Americans as idiots who can be bribed with shiny things for votes, and then when don't vote the way they are told, those same Democrats call them racists and Uncle Toms.

Kirk wasn't saying anything that hasn't been heard from prominent black conservatives in the US. Or even in the UK.

TempestTost · 16/09/2025 00:47

More qualified? I think that's rather debatable.

I suspect it wasn't really relevant to his point though. Someone can be totally qualified, even the best qualified, but if they were picked for diversity reasons, they are a diversity hire. That's one of the arguments against it, it follows people whether they are qualified or not, and casts doubts on their competence even when those doubts aren't deserved.

And the Democrats make those kinds of decisions a lot. And it's suspect to people because if they were really the best qualified, why make a diversity decision? If they weren't, then the criticism has teeth. A lot of American conservatives see this as a statement that Democrats don't think black Americans can achieve at the same level as white Americans.

healthyteeth · 15/09/2025 23:43

Blistory · 15/09/2025 16:26

Charlie Kirk did well at one thing - persuading people that he was interested in a meaningful, honest and respectful debate. That was an incredible achievement given that his aim was simply to indoctrinate young voters into believing his opinions.

He used debating tricks to get Tik Tok suitable clips - short, snappy clips that appear to show his debating opponent as deluded, extremist or ignorant. He framed the questions, moderated most of these and encouraged the crowd to cheer and jeer. He. more often that not, picked who he debated. He had prepared statements full of "facts" but basically it's the same technique that Trumps uses - say that it's true often enough and throw some statistics in. When you're failing, reference God/Jesus/Familty/God Bless America and suddenly you're winning the debate again.

He's not respectful to trans people - he mocks them and sets them up for ridicule but frames it with concern for them and their wellbeing.
He's not respectful to women - he gaslights nearly every woman he has debated and saves his genuine belief that woman are second in God's plan and subordinent to men for his podcasts and tweets.

Once Charlie Kirk and his like have manipulated young voters, they drill down with the more extreme views and leave these young people with a sense that it would be disloyal to go against any of the views proffered up. It's not politics, it's a cult.

Charlie Kirk was not a great orator, or debator but he was a great manipulator and it's okay to call that out. We're so used to framing the bad guys as the ones that use horrible language, make shocking statements, as being shouty, obnoxious and loud that we're in danger of losing sight that calm and respectful can be the mark of a perfect manipulator.

Kirk dies and there are calls for lying in state, flags nationwide to be at half mast, memorial services in stadiums, Vice President escorts, Presidential Medals of Honour. That should all be a red flag - he did nothing for America as a whole to justify that.

This is an excellent post and sums it up well.

The problem is people are frighteningly easily manipulated and distracted.

One of the reasons he went to universities was to manipulate young people ripe for influencing.

Howseitgoin · 15/09/2025 23:34

BundleBoogie · 15/09/2025 23:15

I’m guessing you didn’t understand the substance of my post as you seem to have ignored it completely.

As you insist on plugging on with this, here are his actual words. While I dislike his tone, the reason why ‘affirmative action’ or ‘positive discrimination’ is controversial is because it implies a possible lack of merit on the part of the candidate as other criteria like colour of skin is deemed more important.

He doesn’t mention ALL black women or Jewish women. In that clip he was talking about a very specific list of names who have confirmed that they were ‘recipients of affirmative action’.

Do you have any more misrepresented ‘quotes’ lacking important context or background you’d like to share?

m.youtube.com/watch?v=uK2Lwr1pB04

What you don't seem to comprehend is the deliberate conflating of inclusion & merit. As the links show all those women were highly qualified.

And these bad faith actors on the far right will point to individuals & imply they are representatives of the entire project. Their MO is always the same 'look at his bad person here, see what's going on everywhere'….

Howseitgoin · 15/09/2025 23:29

BundleBoogie · 15/09/2025 23:20

If Joe Biden was determined to hire a woman of colour for the role, it leaves the door open to imply that colour of skin is a more important criteria than qualifications.

Otherwise she’d get it on merit alone.

You criticised CK for pointing out that Ketanji Jackson was a diversity hire. Biden said that colour of skin was a very important criteria in his hiring.

You now appear to be moving the goalposts.

No it doesn't leave the door open because KJB's qualifications speak for themselves which Kirk was fully aware of but chose to pretend didn't exist.

BundleBoogie · 15/09/2025 23:20

Howseitgoin · 15/09/2025 22:40

Um, that doesn't mean they wouldn't be qualified which KJB clearly is above the others.

Kirk & the far right attempt to muddy the waters by saying inclusion & merit are mutually exclusive when they clearly aren't.

If Joe Biden was determined to hire a woman of colour for the role, it leaves the door open to imply that colour of skin is a more important criteria than qualifications.

Otherwise she’d get it on merit alone.

You criticised CK for pointing out that Ketanji Jackson was a diversity hire. Biden said that colour of skin was a very important criteria in his hiring.

You now appear to be moving the goalposts.

BundleBoogie · 15/09/2025 23:15

Howseitgoin · 15/09/2025 22:30

The quote on not having ''processing power" not only erroneously names people who clearly do but suggests that black & jewish women in general are diversity hires.

“If we would have said that Joy Reid and Michelle Obama and Sheila Jackson Lee and Ketanji Brown Jackson were affirmative action picks, we would have been called racists. Now they’re coming out and they’re saying it for us … You do not have the brain processing power to otherwise be taken really seriously. You had to go steal a white person’s slot to go be taken somewhat seriously.”

https://www.ndsmcobserver.com/article/2025/09/what-charlie-kirk-got-wrong-about-black-women

There’s a saying in Germany:

"If there’s a Nazi at the table and ten other people sitting there talking to him, you got a table with eleven Nazis.”

Edited

I’m guessing you didn’t understand the substance of my post as you seem to have ignored it completely.

As you insist on plugging on with this, here are his actual words. While I dislike his tone, the reason why ‘affirmative action’ or ‘positive discrimination’ is controversial is because it implies a possible lack of merit on the part of the candidate as other criteria like colour of skin is deemed more important.

He doesn’t mention ALL black women or Jewish women. In that clip he was talking about a very specific list of names who have confirmed that they were ‘recipients of affirmative action’.

Do you have any more misrepresented ‘quotes’ lacking important context or background you’d like to share?

m.youtube.com/watch?v=uK2Lwr1pB04

Howseitgoin · 15/09/2025 22:40

BundleBoogie · 15/09/2025 22:36

Kirk is quoted saying Ketanji Jackson Brown SC was a diversity hire when she was more qualified than most of the others on the SC:

From the BBC:
Mr Biden first promised to nominate a black woman to the top court two years ago while campaigning for the Democratic presidential nomination.

Um, that doesn't mean they wouldn't be qualified which KJB clearly is above the others.

Kirk & the far right attempt to muddy the waters by saying inclusion & merit are mutually exclusive when they clearly aren't.

BundleBoogie · 15/09/2025 22:36

Kirk is quoted saying Ketanji Jackson Brown SC was a diversity hire when she was more qualified than most of the others on the SC:

From the BBC:
Mr Biden first promised to nominate a black woman to the top court two years ago while campaigning for the Democratic presidential nomination.

Howseitgoin · 15/09/2025 22:30

BundleBoogie · 15/09/2025 17:06

'cozying' up to him signals legitimacy & support for his views.

’Cosying up’ (I’m in the UK) or ‘having a conversation like a normal, rational, mature human being’?

I’m not sure how many times we can say “WE DON’T AGREE WITH ALL OF HIS VIEWS” before you’ll listen. Or maybe you just can’t hear our lady voices?

The quote on not having ''processing power" not only erroneously names people who clearly do but suggests that black & jewish women in general are diversity hires.

“If we would have said that Joy Reid and Michelle Obama and Sheila Jackson Lee and Ketanji Brown Jackson were affirmative action picks, we would have been called racists. Now they’re coming out and they’re saying it for us … You do not have the brain processing power to otherwise be taken really seriously. You had to go steal a white person’s slot to go be taken somewhat seriously.”

https://www.ndsmcobserver.com/article/2025/09/what-charlie-kirk-got-wrong-about-black-women

There’s a saying in Germany:

"If there’s a Nazi at the table and ten other people sitting there talking to him, you got a table with eleven Nazis.”

Howseitgoin · 15/09/2025 22:16

TempestTost · 15/09/2025 16:11

Those quotes by the Guardian are for the most part massively taken out of context.

What does that say about The Guardian, do you think?

It's interesting, in Christian Evangelical circles this is something that happens in certain groups, where a pastor will cherry pick a few Bible quotes and use them to make whatever social or political point he wants. They are taken totally out of context in many cases.They call this "proof-texting".

Most Christian evangelicals recognise this as being an illegitimate and dodgy way to operate.

But it's precisely what the Guardian is doing here.

it's shocking what shit journalism they do now.

Kirk is quoted saying Ketanji Jackson Brown SC was a diversity hire when she was more qualified than most of the others on the SC:

https://atlantablackstar.com/2025/06/30/charlie-kirk-sparks-outrage-after-calling-justice-jackson-a-diversity-hire-amid-fallout-over-birthright-citizenship-ruling/?fbclid=IwY2xjawM1YGlleHRuA2FlbQIxMABicmlkETF3T0hGT1ZCQW04S2FDcEhlAR7716I3kZXrhwFUwqRoklNoUTDZqDud3pSojQ2t-3CZs1k6pKNJt6xE59Dgrwaem-JCaZMpXyK6m9rsN-F20AQ

GailBlancheViola · 15/09/2025 21:24

BundleBoogie · 15/09/2025 17:06

'cozying' up to him signals legitimacy & support for his views.

’Cosying up’ (I’m in the UK) or ‘having a conversation like a normal, rational, mature human being’?

I’m not sure how many times we can say “WE DON’T AGREE WITH ALL OF HIS VIEWS” before you’ll listen. Or maybe you just can’t hear our lady voices?

No, that poster is on broadcast not receive, you are wasting your breath. Although I would be very careful about throwing around 'cosying up' allegations if I were them the list of appalling people on the GI side is very long and very disturbing indeed.

I would advise that poster not to get into that game, they will lose terribly but I doubt they will hear that warning as per first line of this post.

TempestTost · 15/09/2025 20:33

How are people supposed to get their ideas out to groups of people from differernt political backgrounds if they don't go on the shows and podcasts those people listen to?

It is that we aren't supposed to want to do that?

That seems kind of pointless.

BundleBoogie · 15/09/2025 17:06

Howseitgoin · 15/09/2025 13:02

The OP requested comment on Dansky being interviewed by a far right figure head. My point as with many others on this thread is Kirk is anti women rights as well as anti human rights in general so 'cozying' up to him signals legitimacy & support for his views.

The far right , like GC's are biological essentialists but not for the same reason. GC's see biology as essential to protecting women's rights, the far right have & want to continue to use biology to take away women's rights. Far rightists believe feminism to be the down fall of society IE the root causes of societies problems were caused by feminism. They believe the purpose of women only as breeders & carers that's why being defined by their biology matters. Biology is destiny to them.

As they are primarily white nationalists, they believe immigration is an existential threat to the white race (see The Great Replacement Theory) & blame declining white birth rates on feminism where choice & birth control necessitated immigration. So they are not only anti abortion but anti birth control, anti women working & anti mixed marriages. Kirk has made numerous statements to this effect & some are here.

www.theguardian.com/us-news/2025/sep/11/charlie-kirk-quotes-beliefs

'cozying' up to him signals legitimacy & support for his views.

’Cosying up’ (I’m in the UK) or ‘having a conversation like a normal, rational, mature human being’?

I’m not sure how many times we can say “WE DON’T AGREE WITH ALL OF HIS VIEWS” before you’ll listen. Or maybe you just can’t hear our lady voices?

BundleBoogie · 15/09/2025 16:54

Renamed · 15/09/2025 10:58

Kirk was not decent, or tolerant, or a supporter of women’s rights. Alliances with people with his views can only be in the interests of a minority of women, not all women. That’s not feminist

Thanks for telling us how to feminist properly. 🙄

I think you’ll find that the push to redefine the word woman and in so doing remove all means of differentiating ourselves from men for many practical purposes is the thing that negatively affects ALL women whether they value or realise what they are losing or not.

It sounded very much like American women were between a rock and a hard place. Stop blaming them for making a choice.

Ereshkigalangcleg · 15/09/2025 16:34

SionnachRuadh · 15/09/2025 15:59

I think anybody would think twice about who they were associating with

Let me explain how guilt by association works. Last Saturday there was a big march in London led by Tommy Robinson. For the avoidance of ambiguity, I don't like Tommy Robinson. I would guess you don't either. Lots of people will therefore have automatically sympathised with the smallish counter-demo by something calling itself "Stand Up To Racism".

Unfortunately, SUTR is a wholly owned subsidiary of the rapey as fuck Socialist Workers Party. You might not know that, but Diane Abbott and Zarah Sultana, who spoke at the event, certainly know who they are. SWP head honcho, rape apologist Lewis Nielsen, was on the platform beside them.

Have you denounced Diane and Zarah for not thinking twice about who they were associating with? If not, why not? Or do you think it's worth holding your nose to get a message out? Eh? Eh?

See how easy this is?

Well said.

Merrymouse · 15/09/2025 16:31

Blistory · 15/09/2025 16:26

Charlie Kirk did well at one thing - persuading people that he was interested in a meaningful, honest and respectful debate. That was an incredible achievement given that his aim was simply to indoctrinate young voters into believing his opinions.

He used debating tricks to get Tik Tok suitable clips - short, snappy clips that appear to show his debating opponent as deluded, extremist or ignorant. He framed the questions, moderated most of these and encouraged the crowd to cheer and jeer. He. more often that not, picked who he debated. He had prepared statements full of "facts" but basically it's the same technique that Trumps uses - say that it's true often enough and throw some statistics in. When you're failing, reference God/Jesus/Familty/God Bless America and suddenly you're winning the debate again.

He's not respectful to trans people - he mocks them and sets them up for ridicule but frames it with concern for them and their wellbeing.
He's not respectful to women - he gaslights nearly every woman he has debated and saves his genuine belief that woman are second in God's plan and subordinent to men for his podcasts and tweets.

Once Charlie Kirk and his like have manipulated young voters, they drill down with the more extreme views and leave these young people with a sense that it would be disloyal to go against any of the views proffered up. It's not politics, it's a cult.

Charlie Kirk was not a great orator, or debator but he was a great manipulator and it's okay to call that out. We're so used to framing the bad guys as the ones that use horrible language, make shocking statements, as being shouty, obnoxious and loud that we're in danger of losing sight that calm and respectful can be the mark of a perfect manipulator.

Kirk dies and there are calls for lying in state, flags nationwide to be at half mast, memorial services in stadiums, Vice President escorts, Presidential Medals of Honour. That should all be a red flag - he did nothing for America as a whole to justify that.

Kirk dies and there are calls for lying in state, flags nationwide to be at half mast, memorial services in stadiums, Vice President escorts, Presidential Medals of Honour.

Are there?

I had thought that the imposition of American political rhetoric onto the UK was one of the worst things about social media, but I'm quite heartened to know that so few of us were aware of his existence, despite his huge influence on the US.