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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

If someone tells you who they are...

58 replies

IfSomeoneTellsYouWhoTheyAre · 07/09/2025 19:39

You have to believe them, right? That's what the TRAs always seem to claim anyway. So when a man tells us he's actually a woman we have to tell "her" how stunning and brave she is, and how "she" is a much better woman than we will ever be. OK, a little bit of hyperbole there, but you get my drift. So why is it, that when we tell a TRA that we don't have a gender identity, and aren't CIS, do they tell us that we are wrong about ourselves. Why don't they believe that we know who we are just as much as their TW friends do?

I've just come back from what was meant to be a lovely, long overdue, few days away with my oldest friends. We've all known each other for 20-30+ years but haven't managed to all be together due to families, work etc for more than the odd meal.

Somehow the subject came onto trans-rights and so on. Turns out, I'm the only one who doesn't believe that TWAW, or that sex matters in some circumstances. I've been told that I am CIS, even when I tried to explain that I don't have a gender. Apparently the fact that I describe myself as a woman means I'm assigning a gender to myself. I was also told that sex is more complicated than we learn at school, and told that I am "technically intersex" because I have PCOS. According to the person who told me that intersex means I'm not actually male or female. How can I be cis then? (I'm aware that intersex is an outdated term, and that everyone IS male or female. There is no inbetween)

One friend, who is educated to a very high level, insists there is a lot of evidence out there that proves this, and also proves that trans kids commit suicide if not affirmed. When I asked for some links, I was told to google it. Oh, but if I found so called evidence that proved the opposite it was fake.

Also the Cass review was poorly done and transphobic. The ban on puberty blockers is transphobic. And one woman has allowed her 4 year old to socially transition. FFS.

I don't know what the point of this post is. I'm just sad.

PS have name changed as potentially outing, but have been around since the mouldies days.

TL:DR I've just lost my oldest and closest friends because I refuse to accept that I am a cis-intersex-person, or that humans can change sex.

OP posts:
LadyBracknellsHandbagg · 07/09/2025 20:16

IfSomeoneTellsYouWhoTheyAre · 07/09/2025 20:01

I don't know if they'll come round at some point. But tbh I'm not sure I can forgive them. @Queen0fTheNorth is right. Being told I'm intersex (but also a cis-woman) is so fucking offensive. I've given birth ffs. They were the friends that were there for me when I had a miscarriage. How did that happen if I'm not female? So offensive.
I think I'm going to have a hot bath and cry myself to sleep. Then get up and get on with life tomorrow. Let's face it, it's women don't have time to sit around and wallow!

I’m so sorry, that’s bloody awful of them, how hideously insensitive and cruel. You have support here, I know it’s not the same, but I do find it helps that there are legions of us that understand the material reality of biological sex. Sending you a hug 🤗

Toomuchofacoward · 07/09/2025 20:11

I know it's not really the point, but the quotation is actually "When someone shows you who they are, believe them the first time. People know themselves much better than you do. That's why it's important to stop expecting them to be something other than who they are" - Maya Angelou

People call tell you what they like, it doesn't mean it's true, but these people with their actions and words have shown you that they are ignorant, lack critical thinking and are captured by a misogynistic ideology that actually has no internal logic and requires, coercian and contortion to justifiy itself.

They were also horribly rude and insensitive (they are also not even accurate and are very ill informed and offensive to almost everyone in terms of PCOS and "intersex" or DSD as it is better termed).

Protect yourself, mourn the friendship if you need to. I am so so sorry.

Edited to give proper credit

Lolamorte · 07/09/2025 20:07

You sound perfectly reasonable to me, and I’m sorry that you experienced this. I had this quite a few years ago, after a genial discussion ‘entre amies’ turned one friend into a robot that could only grate out ‘trans women are women’ . Weird. I thought I’d been dropped after that non-discussion but have been invited to several parties, and met her new polycule so hey, I guess we’re still mates after all.

IfSomeoneTellsYouWhoTheyAre · 07/09/2025 20:01

I don't know if they'll come round at some point. But tbh I'm not sure I can forgive them. @Queen0fTheNorth is right. Being told I'm intersex (but also a cis-woman) is so fucking offensive. I've given birth ffs. They were the friends that were there for me when I had a miscarriage. How did that happen if I'm not female? So offensive.
I think I'm going to have a hot bath and cry myself to sleep. Then get up and get on with life tomorrow. Let's face it, it's women don't have time to sit around and wallow!

OP posts:
Queen0fTheNorth · 07/09/2025 19:53

I was also told that sex is more complicated than we learn at school, and told that I am "technically intersex" because I have PCOS.

How offensive is that!? It'd be the end of the friendship for me.

Theswiveleyeballsinthesky · 07/09/2025 19:49

Im sorry OP 💐 I have lost a group of friends recently over this so I know how it feels xx it's why I never raise the topic

as someone on here wisely said "you can't reason someone out of a position they didn't reason themselves into"

NettleandBramble · 07/09/2025 19:46

Hopefully they will slowly slowly catch up. At least the 4 year old has a lot of time between now and the spectre of cross sex hormones.

Can you/your friends agree to disagree on this for now?

AMansAManForAllThat · 07/09/2025 19:42

It’s sad. It is. Can you hang in there and wait for them to wake up? It won’t be too much longer..l and when it happens they’ll swear they knew all along.

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