Why are so many GC women pro-Israel?

I've read that Hitler fed a lot of Nazi propaganda to the Arabs which the leaders have kept up with to this day. Obvs I'm sure ultrafundamentalist sects like the Wahabbi were promoting it before...

This page is v intresting & extremely scary on the 19th century rise of Arab anti semitism. I know it's Wiki, but the citations seem respectable.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/AntisemitismintheArabworld

How to fix this..? As you say, some will be born, and the deaths in Gaza will be used to radicalise the next generation.

If Hamas' allies withdrew suppprt would it be able to keep going? I don't suppose they will though, certainly not right now...

It's anyone who thinks that way. Surely all of Hamas, but anyone else, not all are in Palestine. Some are yet to be born.

Others will always get caught up, that's the nature of violence.

Many Arabs were horrible to the ME Jews before Israel existed. Many ME Jews, once they had a Jewish nation, say returning that hatred as reasonable. Not surprisingly, that's human nature.

The idea that the way to solve problems like that is a state with an ethno-religious identity seems quite naive to me, I don't see how that could ever work, quite the opposite.

You mean Israeli Civilians? Palestinians too? I can imagine losses for both will be horrific.

And how will they ensure Hamas doesn't re-form?

That's horrific about the woman being abused. I don't suppose you can remember when this video was shown on BBC roughly?

Maybe. But I wouldn't be quick to dismiss what that will cost them from a human POV.

I've read your posts before on this...and sadly I agree. I just think Israel was fundamentally unstable from the foundation. I know a lot of Jewish people say they feel safer there than in Europe or the US but I just don't see how this can be true, however people feel psychologically. I also can't understand why the government is encouraging Jews to move there- it is clearly less safe than Europe, US etc, how can they in good conscience encourage more settlers?

Sometimes I think the idea of an Israel in South America would have worked much better, but obvs that destroys the idea of the Holy Land

Perhaps not, but there are still bloodthirsty idiots and (imo) ar@&holes on both sides. What about this guy for instance? https://www.theguardian.com/world/2025/aug/17/israeli-general-aharon-haliva-palestinians-7-october-gaza

Those people- is this Hamas or Palestinians as a whole?

Exactly. I still think that food aid must be allowed in, but I know very well that the problems are all due to Hamas, and the decisions being taken must be agonising..as many seem to ignore.

Honestly, I wish we could forcibly airlift the Gazans to a remote island where they could be deradicalised. Obvs impossible, but what I mean is that I can't see how we can safely save people...it's horrible, maybe there is a way but everyone seems stumped unless they're ignoring the complexities...

"If the Arabs lay down their weapons, there will be no war. If Israel lays down its weapons, there'll be no Israel."

I wonder if people are finally starting to understand that Hamas absolutely loves dead Gazans almost as much as it loves dead Jews. I thought October 7 would hammer home what indescribably evil death cultists they were for anyone who somehow still hadn't worked it out, but apparently it took a bit more than that. And now people are still wondering how anyone who supports women's single sex spaces for changing rooms, rape centres and sports could also be supportive of the opponents of that racist, misogynistic, homophobic, coffin-parading, hostage-taking, murderous death cult. What a mystery.

Golda Meir“ Only when Palestinians love their children more than they hate us,will there be peace.”

As long as Israel exists, it's won.

What several nations want isn't really relevant, it's the ones who won't let it go that matter.

I don't see any reason to think those people will ever go away. It's part of their core ideology.

They will continue to push and there is only one ultimate outcome. They will cease to exist or they will be successful.

It's nothing to do with what Israel should or should not do or anyone expects.

I wouldn't say a miracle can't happen I suppose, that would be faithless, but empirically there seems to be zero evidence that there is a political path out of it.

If Hamas cared about its own people then it would not embed itself amongst civilians; in hospitals, in camps, in schools...in the way that it does. Why do none of the pro - Palestine lot ever talk about Hamas tactics; about the way that Hamas executes its own people; steals food from the aid trucks; acts like a mafia. About the way that Hamas deploys booby traps all over the place, and on a daily baisis continues to fire missiles into Israel?

I sometimes think it would be good if laws around war were covered in classes around politics in school, or pehaps taught as part of history, whatever.

I am not sure of people realise that things like embedding spys or soldiers in Red Cross relief, or intelligence interrogators pretending to be padres, or storing weapons in hospitals, are all illegal under these laws, and for very good reason.

The reason is that for humanitarian reasons nations agree to allow certain kinds of things to happen even in war. Distribution of aid to civilians. Medical care. POWs to talk to spiritual advisers. And so on. We see these are very important things and we believe, for example, that civilians should be safe while in hospital.

But as soon as people start to break these rules, that whole system of protections and humanitarian concerns breaks down very quickly. What do people think happens when it turns out a Red Cross truck is carrying ammunition, or the MSF doctor is actually a spy, or the rockets being sent into the town are coming from a hospital?

What happens is those become legitimate military targets, there is no other possible outcome, that has to be the response in a war, you can't just let those things happen because if a conflict is that serious, it is serious enough that losing is not an option.

And the people at fault for those humanitarian spaces and missions becoming military targets are the fuckers breaking the rules which are very clearly laid out to prevent that.

I am very sorry for the people, especially the children who are totally innocent. But the war criminals here are Hamas and those who fund them to do these things. The stupid westerners who seem to want to enable these war crimes against their own people pass deserve a lot of fault too.

Either the Palestinians and other Arabs who don't want them there will prevail and destroy Israel, or Israel will prevail and destroy those people.

The Arab nations haven't managed it and several have made peace and no longer wish to, and Israel has never tried.

I am not saying everything Israel does is beyond reproach, but it is the only country in the world expected to endure these sorts of attacks forever and do absolutely nothing about it. For a long time I wondered why this is, but I am starting to conclude that the simplest and most obvious answer really is the correct one.

Hmm, I don't think any of those have moved on from omnipotence. I'm sure actually that they haven't.

But they certainly don't think God is male, that would require having a body.

I always think that if we try to imagine using the same solution as what was done with the creation of Israel for another minority group, all of the potential problems loom very large.

Which they did before WWII. There were those who wanted to create a Jewish state in the ME, some a modern secular state to be a homeland to Jews being persecuted worldwide, including in the ME itself. But also religious Zionists who say it as a religious imperative. But most people involved in such things thought it wasn't ultimately a politically viable solution.

WWII made people feel it had to be done, had to be made to work. I suspect however that the fact is that it was never a viable political project and never will be. Either the Palestinians and other Arabs who don't want them there will prevail and destroy Israel, or Israel will prevail and destroy those people. And either way the ones left standing will be permanently marked and changed by the results of those acts against others.

I've never seen a group of Jews or Israel supporters openly celebrating the deaths of Gazans, or a group of gender critical women calling to stab, shoot, hang and set alight trans people who disagree with them.

Well i am "left" and i care a great deal about Palestinian AND Israeli women and children. Hamas in government would be absolutely terrible for the Palestinian people, just as this shit show of an Israeli government is doing fuck all to get the remaining hostages home. I'm not on anyone's side in this disgusting war. As usual, the only people really suffering are women and children, on both sides.

No I don't. Not one that both sides are happy with. Palestine doesn't want peace. Theyre not going to stop and Israel are never allowed to win even though they could, they dont want to
So it's stalemate.

I would be really interested to know if anyone on this thread thinks that there is a workable solution out there somewhere and can explain what form it might take.

There are some A*%#holes on both sides, in neither case does this justify the slaughter of innocent civilians, whether Israelis or Gazans.

I am GC, a feminist and very anti religious too.

My first thoughts are though, people have the right to religion and express religious freedoms. That is not something shared by extremist ideologists though, especially when it comes to terrorist groups like Hamas. That’s the cross over you are seeing.

I have absolutely no skin in the game on the current war between Isreal and Gaza, it has zero impact on my life whatsoever. However I would be more sympathetic to a society who respects women and treats them equally, than one that promotes women as property and restricts their movement and what they wear.

True feminists centre women first, as an oppressed class of male violence and oppression

because all of the religions I know of are based around the belief in an omnipotent male creator

Erm no they don't...mainstream Abrahamic ones do not.

I.e. Catholic Catechism "is neither man nor woman: He is God".

I think you are confusing male pronouns with belief in a male creator.

Funnily enough I’ve noticed this, but from the other side - a lot of TRAs are anti- Israel. Which makes sense to me because it’s about parroting sound bites without questioning their factual accuracy (“genocide”), disregarding facts (October 7th, Hamas blocking food to Gazan citizens) and “being in the right side of history”.