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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

National Library of Scotland censors The Women Who Wouldn't Wheesht

705 replies

OhBuggerandArse · 12/08/2025 23:46

Took it out of their centenary exhibition because the staff LGBT+ network kicked up a fuss. Craven. This really needs massive public challenge and push back - if the National Library isn't able to fend off the censors we are utterly lost. https://x.com/EthelWrites/status/1955390550494023958

https://x.com/EthelWrites/status/1955390550494023958

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WarriorN · 16/08/2025 12:24

This reply has been deleted

Withdrawn at poster's request.

Thank you for trying - very brave of you in the current climate.

Glad Graham is demonstrating that stakeholders are not a monolith and understand the implications of bowing to a minority of activists who do not recognise the importance of that book for women’s rights.

Theswiveleyeballsinthesky · 16/08/2025 11:26

BunfightBetty · 16/08/2025 11:16

This is baffling. Threatening your own employer with taking confidential information and/or complaints to your own funders is such a clear act of gross misconduct that I cannot fathom just how weak an organisation’s management has to be to tolerate it, and not have the offender on a disciplinary at the very least.

Exactly!!!! I cannot fathom how this level of gross misconduct is tolerated by ppl who are supposedly professional managers & leaders

its absolutely baffling that they allow themselves to be bullied like this

Helleofabore · 16/08/2025 11:20

Arabella, I think that many people will have been convinced by the groups who have been publicly declared to be the victims needing infantilising to protect them.

It has been remarkable to see how this has been so successful. Sadly, it will backfire. And it will take a long time to rebuild trust.

BunfightBetty · 16/08/2025 11:16

Theswiveleyeballsinthesky · 16/08/2025 09:31

Yes but so will their bosses and at a more senior level. Generally contacts with stakeholders mirrors the hierarchy of an organisation so the Board members will know each other, the CEOs will know each other, senior managers will know each other. 20 something activist staff will generally be in contact with their equivalents elsewhere so why don't their actual bosses tell them to get back in their box?

remember when hatchette young activist staff kicked off about JKR? They were told they couldn't refuse to work on her books and if they didn't like it other jobs are available

why do these tough senior ppl crumple so easily

This is baffling. Threatening your own employer with taking confidential information and/or complaints to your own funders is such a clear act of gross misconduct that I cannot fathom just how weak an organisation’s management has to be to tolerate it, and not have the offender on a disciplinary at the very least.

ArabellaScott · 16/08/2025 11:05

Amina Shah seems a thoughtful and eminently well qualified Librarian. Which makes her decision to exclude this book all the more baffling and upsetting.

A long and very interesting interview from last year:

https://www.euppublishing.com/doi/10.3366/irss.2024.0026

'One of the things I think is most dangerous for libraries is when one generation doesn’t value what another generation has collected. I can see that with lots of cultural institutions. Andrew Pettegree, from St. Andrews, has written a book called The Library: A Fragile History, where he examines this subject.5 We feel very strongly that, in order to show how we’re useful to Scottish society, we don’t only need to focus on the future; we also need to talk about why we’re useful to people today. To be able to understand that, we have to know who we’re not reaching'
...
'We need to do some targeted outreach work to make sure that we’re connecting with young people, with people who might not have thought about us before, with older people, with people from communities who might not see themselves as reflected within our collections. We have to take steps to do that, to demonstrate that they are welcome here.'
...
'You might say, well, where are the silences in a collection that has everything? '
...
'Over the years, we’ve made decisions that are exclusionary. We’re making decisions about what’s important and what’s not important. '
...
'Some of the silences are around our interpretation of things. In 2021, we had a fantastic exhibition called Petticoats and Pinnacles about woman climbers in Scotland.11 We had diaries, letters, and journals of many women explorers, dressed in petticoats and high heels and all sorts of inappropriate clothing. They were out there doing these things. But, over the years, nobody thought that their accounts were worth publishing. Their stories weren’t brought together in any format, so their voices were, in a sense, silenced. That’s true of many women’s accounts, or accounts from women.'
...
'. So, some of the silences are around our own curation and our own research, and some of them are around the actual collections themselves. I don’t want to give you the impression that we’re not aware of our own arrogance here because every generation thinks they have an answer to solve the questions of the generation before, and I have no doubt that we’ll be making mistakes now as well.'
...
'Kate Ashley—I’m thinking of Scotland today. Fifty or 100 years from now, historians are going to want to know, for instance, what all the gender identity debate was in Scotland, and so much of that is taking place on Twitter, on Facebook, in these formats where someone can’t just go deliver the document to the library and have it preserved there. That’s a really interesting point that I’d never thought about before. It’s such a very important resource for historians and for cultural understanding as well.'

(Some of us have been busy archiving and have stashes of material on this very debate that may, one day, end up in the NLS. First of all, theough, they might want to spend £20 on a copy of the Women who Wouldn't Wheesht.)

BundleBoogie · 16/08/2025 10:37

Conxis · 16/08/2025 10:30

There are many reasons to be embarrassed (as well as hugely proud and grateful) to be Scottish at the moment. I thought I’d become used to our peculiar Scottish brand of batshittery but I have to say this one left me feeling like I needed a duvet day!

They never fail to excel themselves 🤣

At least you can enjoy your duvet day safe in the knowledge you will never wake up and realise that you’ve been such a grade A numpty - in public!

ArabellaScott · 16/08/2025 10:35

INeedAPensieve · 16/08/2025 10:20

That story last week made me laugh so much at the utter hyperbole and ridiculousness. Honestly they are like tantrum toddlers.

Good luck @VoleForceOne for next week at work, my work, also public sector in Scotland, is also completely mad on this but I'm starting to get braver in pushing back. The EDI team, the LGBT network and their "allies" have been bullying people for too long now.

I think if one is able to stand up then now is a good time to do so.

If we don't then we can continue to expect this nonsense going forward.

The more of us who are able to take a stand the better. Doesn't need to be much. A single line email can help give an indication to the NLS that they are failing to represent the views of readers and the Scottish public.

And tbh, one doesn't even need to agree with 'gender critical' views to see the issues here.

Primarily this is a freedom of speech & belief issue - whether partisan political views should be suppressed and/or promoted by non-departmental government bodies.

Conxis · 16/08/2025 10:30

BundleBoogie · 16/08/2025 10:08

Exactly. About as mad as staff setting up a ‘safe room’ to protect themselves from Deputy FM Kate Forbes.

I'm trying to picture it - did they lock themselves in? Did they fill it with beanbags, comforting trans flags and earplugs do they could risk hearing her voice as she passed in the corridor?

What would have happened if she’d KNOCKED ON THE DOOR…

Will they grow up one day and be mightily embarrassed at how carried away they got?

There are many reasons to be embarrassed (as well as hugely proud and grateful) to be Scottish at the moment. I thought I’d become used to our peculiar Scottish brand of batshittery but I have to say this one left me feeling like I needed a duvet day!

VoleForceOne · 16/08/2025 10:27

This reply has been withdrawn

Withdrawn at poster's request.

Waitwhat23 · 16/08/2025 10:26

ArabellaScott · 16/08/2025 10:12

https://thecritic.co.uk/the-national-library-of-scotland-is-a-national-embarrassment/

Excellent article here.

'As a rule though, the establishment — especially governments — exists to be criticised, lampooned or, at the very least, scrutinised. In Scotland though, not only do our cultural tastemakers avoid offending the SNP establishment, they tend to act as its promotional mouthpiecee. This is not just sinister, it’s embarrassing. Frankly, if you are someone who loves provocative, truth-hungry art, and cares fiercely about freedom of expression and genuine diversity, Scotland feels a mortifying place to live at the moment.'
...
'this book has pulled the mask off the face of the establishment — not just Sturgeon, but the once-proud cultural institutions of Scotland that have sold their souls and, consequently, become national disgraces.'

100%

It's absolutely embarrassing.

We used to be known (as a nation) as take no shit, acerbic straight talkers.

Now we've got greeting faced weans, clutching their blankies in a safe room, too scared at the mere sight of a woman with a different view.

lcakethereforeIam · 16/08/2025 10:20

StellaAndCrow · 16/08/2025 09:21

Yes, and intrigued as to which books he thinks are 'among the worst ever written' :)

“On the opening night of the exhibition, I thought it was fantastic, because I found at least two books in there that I consider to be among the worst ever written,” Graham said.
“I said to Amina I thought that was great, because the whole point was that while some people are inspired by a book, others will hate it. That’s the joy of the society we live in and the freedom that we have."

I'm thinking two copies of 'Frankly' 😁

INeedAPensieve · 16/08/2025 10:20

BundleBoogie · 16/08/2025 10:08

Exactly. About as mad as staff setting up a ‘safe room’ to protect themselves from Deputy FM Kate Forbes.

I'm trying to picture it - did they lock themselves in? Did they fill it with beanbags, comforting trans flags and earplugs do they could risk hearing her voice as she passed in the corridor?

What would have happened if she’d KNOCKED ON THE DOOR…

Will they grow up one day and be mightily embarrassed at how carried away they got?

That story last week made me laugh so much at the utter hyperbole and ridiculousness. Honestly they are like tantrum toddlers.

Good luck @VoleForceOne for next week at work, my work, also public sector in Scotland, is also completely mad on this but I'm starting to get braver in pushing back. The EDI team, the LGBT network and their "allies" have been bullying people for too long now.

BundleBoogie · 16/08/2025 10:19

ArabellaScott · 16/08/2025 10:15

https://archive.ph/OM0MV

'Back to Scotland’s self-identifying ‘newspaper’, which has planted itself at the centre of a row over the delisting of a gender critical book from a national library exhibition. ... The Times ran the initial story, titled ‘censorship row as library bans gender-critical book’. The National then took it upon themselves to claim this wasn’t true – insisting the National Library had ‘debunked’ accusations of censorship. But Scotland’s only pro-independence newspaper doesn’t appear to have examined the facts all that thoroughly – and has even been accused of defamation over its piece.'

Steerpike in the Spec.

Even more people lining up to beclown themselves.
Why are they all so hellbent on destroying their credibility and reputations? It’s like a lemming mind virus at this point.

ArabellaScott · 16/08/2025 10:15

https://archive.ph/OM0MV

'Back to Scotland’s self-identifying ‘newspaper’, which has planted itself at the centre of a row over the delisting of a gender critical book from a national library exhibition. ... The Times ran the initial story, titled ‘censorship row as library bans gender-critical book’. The National then took it upon themselves to claim this wasn’t true – insisting the National Library had ‘debunked’ accusations of censorship. But Scotland’s only pro-independence newspaper doesn’t appear to have examined the facts all that thoroughly – and has even been accused of defamation over its piece.'

Steerpike in the Spec.

ArabellaScott · 16/08/2025 10:12

https://thecritic.co.uk/the-national-library-of-scotland-is-a-national-embarrassment/

Excellent article here.

'As a rule though, the establishment — especially governments — exists to be criticised, lampooned or, at the very least, scrutinised. In Scotland though, not only do our cultural tastemakers avoid offending the SNP establishment, they tend to act as its promotional mouthpiecee. This is not just sinister, it’s embarrassing. Frankly, if you are someone who loves provocative, truth-hungry art, and cares fiercely about freedom of expression and genuine diversity, Scotland feels a mortifying place to live at the moment.'
...
'this book has pulled the mask off the face of the establishment — not just Sturgeon, but the once-proud cultural institutions of Scotland that have sold their souls and, consequently, become national disgraces.'

100%

Waitwhat23 · 16/08/2025 10:12

BundleBoogie · 16/08/2025 10:08

Exactly. About as mad as staff setting up a ‘safe room’ to protect themselves from Deputy FM Kate Forbes.

I'm trying to picture it - did they lock themselves in? Did they fill it with beanbags, comforting trans flags and earplugs do they could risk hearing her voice as she passed in the corridor?

What would have happened if she’d KNOCKED ON THE DOOR…

Will they grow up one day and be mightily embarrassed at how carried away they got?

I'm imagining Kate Forbes wandering around Summerhall like the penguin in the film Gregory's Girl for some reason 😆

borntobequiet · 16/08/2025 10:11

I can’t get over how all these people at the top of Scottish institutions can be so stupid and blinkered as to think everyone holds their idiotic beliefs. The Scottish people I know well (including relatives) are sensible people who have no time for this bullshit.

BundleBoogie · 16/08/2025 10:08

ArabellaScott · 16/08/2025 09:51

'The book now being treated as too high-risk for a National Library of Scotland exhibition is a best-seller from a major publisher, well-reviewed, contains current and former mainstream party elected politicians, among others...

Could we just stop and notice how mad this is?'

Lucy Hunter Blackburn

x.com/LucyHunterB/status/1956494112347111817

Exactly. About as mad as staff setting up a ‘safe room’ to protect themselves from Deputy FM Kate Forbes.

I'm trying to picture it - did they lock themselves in? Did they fill it with beanbags, comforting trans flags and earplugs do they could risk hearing her voice as she passed in the corridor?

What would have happened if she’d KNOCKED ON THE DOOR…

Will they grow up one day and be mightily embarrassed at how carried away they got?

Waitwhat23 · 16/08/2025 10:04

Think about it as well - this is a book about a fairly niche subject (Scottish public institutions and Government - even as a Scot, I can't imagine there are many triple best sellers on this subject!) which is now selling out mostly due to the footstamping of organisational activists and those on social media, including on here. It's brought enormous amounts of public attention.

'You raging, aye?' 😆

Justme56 · 16/08/2025 09:54

This reply has been deleted

Withdrawn at poster's request.

You would think after the NHS Fife ET, where line managers had to justify their previous actions not only to a judge, but to a very interested public, that people would be a bit more wary of what they say and do!

ArabellaScott · 16/08/2025 09:51

'The book now being treated as too high-risk for a National Library of Scotland exhibition is a best-seller from a major publisher, well-reviewed, contains current and former mainstream party elected politicians, among others...

Could we just stop and notice how mad this is?'

Lucy Hunter Blackburn

x.com/LucyHunterB/status/1956494112347111817

BundleBoogie · 16/08/2025 09:50

BeeSourianteAgain · 16/08/2025 06:30

It's kinda fun that the people who are obsessively trying to remove a marginalised demographic are complaining about being "censored" because people a dreadful gaslighting book that few care about is not being put in an exhibition.

'Gender critical' activists truly are some of the most embarrassingly over-privileged people

Oh dear, get out of bed the wrong side again Bee?

The Women Who Wouldn’t Wheesht was a Sunday Times Bestseller btw 👍 hug you keep telling yourself that.

BundleBoogie · 16/08/2025 09:47

This reply has been deleted

Withdrawn at poster's request.

Oh wow. I feel for you having to work in an environment that is so hostile to your views. I hope you are part of the underground network and have support that way. Maybe you could all organise an ‘uprising’ at some point?

ArabellaScott · 16/08/2025 09:44

The NLS is a non-departmental government body.

Income last year of over £22 million.

https://www.oscr.org.uk/about-charities/search-the-register/charity-details?number=SC011086

BundleBoogie · 16/08/2025 09:44

OhBuggerandArse · 15/08/2025 23:13

Oh, that is very good news.

Amina didn’t seem to think that library sponsors with views on biological sex /free speech existed and that their views are important too.

How bad does the NLS want to look in this? Are they going to put the demands of some tantrumming and highly prejudiced staff over a donor that funds apprenticeships among other things?

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