Swivel eyed transphobes

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They've pushed them so far under the bus that they seem to have disappeared.

Also, they're 25 years too late. Already thoroughly queered!

I really think it's an over generalisation to say it's always a sexual thing. It's sex as in people with dysphoria feeling like they should be the other sex, but not always sexual as in getting sexual gratification from it. Yes the AGP's do but they are a separate group. I appreciate a lot of people have fixed views that all trans people are the same.

I was referring to those who were gay before transition and are now with same sex partners, i.e trans man with female partner and vice versa. These are the people I know. I don't know how the figures and percentages pan out however. Happy to take your word the second group is larger unless you want to share any studies. I do agree there's a certain group that have taken over, the second group you mention I imagine and I really wish the other group who aren't being loud would now step forward and show some reason. I can't believe that all trans people go along with the TRA's.

That asshole being a universal vagina comment gets me each time. It's just so wrong.

My thoughts too.

Well some politicians are good at detecting where the Overton window is and clearly in the UK loads don’t. Tim Roca is a good example of not keeping up with the Overton Window and recognising that the TRAs have actually overshot public opinion.

Maybe we could have a referendum?

Has this been posted yet?

It's very telling that they are plotting in a private WhatsApp group, rather than openly calling for the law to be changed. They know the overton window has shifted and they have no chance of the changes they want standing public scrutiny. So instead they are going to do everything they can to manipulate things behind the scenes.

I think you're probably right. I can see gender non conformity like wearing a pretty dress and makeup as being arty self expression but actually calling yourself a woman, yes I think that does have inherently sexual undertones.

When you say many trans people are also gay, are you referring to those who are gay before transition or the men who think they're lesbians when they transition in middle age after years of being married to a woman and fathering children? Because the second group is much larger than the first.

Surely transsexualism is always a sexual thing, which is one reason I have such a strong objection to the idea that children can 'be trans'.

This this doesn't just apply to AGPs, it applies equally to gay men like Paris Lees and Juno Dawson, for whom being trans is all about having sex 'as a woman' (plenty of quotes online from both of them referring to this).

More sensible Labour MPs have now commented;

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5377303-labour-mps-state-sex-means-biological-sex-respecting-the-law-is-not-an-act-of-bigotry

@TrainedByCats I've had the same experience. I've only met one TIM in real life and he was/is a total creep. It's clearly a sexual thing for him and I want no part in it.

Anyway final thoughts is that this MP is part of the problem and not helping anything. Using such disgusting language just pushes people further away from trying to make anything better for anyone.

Many trans people are also gay though so they have that in common. It's not just the pervy men we're talking about. But yet they are the only ones that are discussed. Nobody acknowledges the considerable number of gay paedophiles. I'm glad we don't lump all gay people into that group anymore but we shouldn't do it with trans people either.

I can't speak for the psychology of what causes a man or woman to have dysphoria and want to dress and present as the opposite sex, therefore I can't say what their motive is other than to feel more comfortable with themselves. It's not just men but women too. I don't believe they should be able to take any serious steps towards this until they're 25 so that they've had a chance to work through and see if this is what they really want.

Not sure why, but the Times have just publised this as a new story https://www.thetimes.com/uk/scotland/article/gender-critical-activists-branded-swivel-eyed-by-labour-mp-jljhft707 and at https://archive.is/WCCxx

Your views don't offend me! Obviously people's views will be based on their own experience and you haven't had any positive experiences with trans people. I have had positive experiences so I just think it's important not to lump a whole group together and say they're all the same. But again it's just my view. I'm trying to be positive and hope that the recent reset will bring about change so everyone can live more comfortably with each other. That does have to start with the reasonable trans people though, no one else can do it for them.

glad someone else picked up the ablist comment about a vision condition/disability. And a pejorative about mental health conditions too. Same mentality as racists really. Which sadly is the only IST that seems to count.

On the politics side of things I think I did the numbers at the time. If you added together the Conservative and Reform votes, Tim would still have won, but by a very slim margin. Can’t remember exactly what the numbers were.

The demographic of the town is definitely changing. There’s definitely a younger, trendier crowd now (there’s a Gail’s and everything!). It’s changed a lot from a relatively small, working class mill town surrounded by farms.

All trans people, by definition, are pretending to be the opposite sex. So even if they are sane enough to know that they can't change sex, a man who calls himself a 'transwoman' is pretending to be some sort of woman, rather than a type of man.

If he just wanted to be a gender non-conforming man he could do that - it's the appropriation of womanhood by men which is the problem. It doesn't matter how nice he is as a person in other respects, if he's pretending to be a woman that's offensive to all women. 'Woman' is not a costume.

A man playing dress up as a woman is perpetuating stereotypes. He's reinforcing the idea that women should look or behave a certain way, that there are certain attributes (other than a female body) which makes someone a woman. If he likes wearing dresses, high heels and make up, fine (as long as he doesn't have fake breasts or wear an outfit so tight or skimpy that we can all see how much he enjoys wearing his costume). He doesn't have to pretend to be a woman to do this.

Well done, if people don't even try to speak out or hold their elected officials accountable for what they do and say, nothings going to change.
If he doesn't answer then that's on him and is just more proof of how useless he is a representative.
Registering a complaint with the Labour party about what he said seems fair, they are after all responsible for making sure the people who are their MP's act according to the rules.