Trans books banned in children's library sections

And rightly so. Children do not need to read books about adults bedroom preferences. They deserve a childhood where they can discover and grow at an age appropriate rate. They need facts and stories. Its is why there are parental controls on internet access - to ensure child appropriate access.

Shame to have started an existing thread when there already was one, which cant have been hard to miss.

So as usual discusion is now split.

Its really easy to get the list of threads to display as most recently added.

So you can then see only half an hour ago someone has added a thread.

https://www.spiked-online.com/2021/07/13/the-rainbow-dildo-butt-monkey-is-no-laughing-matter/

This is what has been happening in children's libraries, a complete failure of safeguarding. It's about time someone took an interest in what children are being exposed to, and agree with pp, the WRN Dorset library report should be required reading for all those involved in buying books for children, whether for libraries or at home.

Missed the irony I think!

I'm confused TeenToTwenties - did you entirely miss the obvious irony in my post about Farenheit 451 being about 'Shelfmen' reshelving books in libraries, or am I missing the obvious irony in yours?

Well - this is happening in a limited and reasoned way. Because this is about curating a children’s library appropriately, not banning books. A kids section not stocking Stephen King isn’t banning Stephen King, is it?

What of course should be happening and hopefully will is that many of these books won’t be published at all. How some got over the line I can’t think.

Parents should be as aware of what their children are reading as they should be about what they are accessing on line. If they aren't that is down to them. But I think that banning anything needs to be something approached in a very limited and reasoned way, because once you establish that what we don't like should be banned, it ends up with an awful lot of stuff being banned - sometimes including us!

So you disagree with parental controls or age limits on the internet? and it just be up to parents?

Well, I agree with The 🐝

Ridiculous to ban / put these books out of reach to children. In fact, I think libraries should get appropriate practioners to read them out loud, so that slow readers can keep up

I agree with this. Parents should be as aware of what their children are reading as they should be about what they are accessing on line. If they aren't that is down to them. But I think that banning anything needs to be something approached in a very limited and reasoned way, because once you establish that what we don't like should be banned, it ends up with an awful lot of stuff being banned - sometimes including us!

I also (and I never thought I'd hear myself say this) agree with the Leader of the Lib Dems - are we now a country like the US where policy is announced on social media instead of being properly discussed in the democratic chambers appointed for that purpose? It may have come to the same end, and you may or may not agree with that outcome, but we are supposed to have a democracy.

Apparently it is not true. BBC need to fact check better before lifting things from Reform

Going back to the OP, I think the BBC removed ‘I am Leo’ from their CBBC streaming content, presumably because it contained misinformation?

Ahhh - so you admit that they are not banned…
Just from the children’s section

which effectively means that they are not banned - most libraries will allow books from anywhere on a child’s ticket - I was reading dickens / Tolkien / Wodehouse / Sayers / etc. before I was 10 - no issue borrowing books from the adult section…

but it does mean that they are not presented as child suitable - clearly books like dickens and Wodehouse are in the adult section because they are not ‘child suitable’ based on vocabulary - these are not child suitable based on content / material

we should be asking as a society why anyone considers it acceptable to present such material aimed clearly at children - in much the same way that there are many sexual descriptive books / films / games / etc out there which are labelled as not suitable for children with age ratings etc so we should challenge why these books were even allowed in the first place

In 2019, i complained to my local library about ‘Beyond Magenta - Transgender Teens Speak Out’, because it was in the Trans Teen section.

The manager and i had a respectful discussion, and she agreed with me that it was probably in the wrong location.

So, it was moved to the Adult Non Fiction section, so it wouldn’t be possible for ‘young people to borrow this title on their own tickets’.

Completely.

When activists can separate indoctrination and overwhelming bias, and intentional open agendas about influencing and recruiting children to their political benefit, and are able to cope with ideas such as 'women have rights too', and 'biological sex is not hate', and 'it's ok to be homosexual', and 'screaming and threatening to kill people isn't appropriate', and cope with the idea that there are a LOT of things to talk about regarding medicating and surgically interfering with healthy children, and heavily weighting sexist ideas as being the only right way - and that anyone who disagrees is hateful bigot scum - then they can come back and talk about putting children's books in the children's section of the library.

Until then, yes, its probably going to end in a massed ban, because activists are making it black or white as usual - you're wholly and unconditionally enabling or you're the enemy. And the only way to deal with that is just to take all that material away from that area until some sanity and sense of responsibility returns.

As usual, 'you don't want us to exist' is being used to flounce away from and detract from 'this behaviour has been wholly inappropriate and unacceptable' and rationally, there are consequences.

Though they may be more forgiven for not having the budget to fix pot holes if they haven’t also given a big grant to the local pride.

Yes, of course they shouldn't be in the children's section; they should be in the mental health section instead.

I agree. Kids dont need to know. And then they will be brainwashed into thinking boys can be girls and girls can be boys. They can't.

TBH I'm not surprised because at the moment there seems to be a trend of rival political parties or campaigners going to the BBC to moan about Reform councillors doing stuff such as removing Pride flags or not spending money on Pride events.

What the media and campaigners don't understand is that these events are not vote losing things. Trump's ban on males in female sport was popular, which is what the left just couldn't understand.

Reform will be judged on whether potholes are fixed, not whether a Pride flag flies from a council building.

And whilst Reform are naturally divisive, their policies around Pride are generally supported.

I would agree with this.

Young kids don't need to know about this.

Banning books is very different from not putting books in the children’s section of a public library. There are loads of books that have no place in the children’s section of a public library - not because they are aimed at adults but because they are texts aimed at indoctrinating children into specific ideologies. The Nazis produced a whole range of literature for children, should those be translated and stocked by the local library too? What about extreme religious books telling children non-Muslims are worthless, or from Jehovah Witnesses telling them blood transfusions will stop you going to heaven? Or books that say women and girls do not have the same worth as boys? I have already mentioned porn.

I do not think we should place any books in the public library that in anyway suggests children have something wrong with them if they don’t prefer clothes/colours/activities that regressive stereotypes suggest are appropriate for their sex. If you want to buy your daughter a book that say preferring blue, not wearing dresses, liking your hair short, playing football, and wanting to be a leader makes you a boy and you should choose a boys name and everyone will have a party to celebrate, then that is up to the parents. But such books should be nowhere near public libraries or schools.

To repeat what others have said they are NOT banned, merely quite properly removed from Childrens section.
Children need to work out about straight sex before being led along the trans route.

That's interesting.

No. It is where books are totally banned and firemen exist to burn books not put out fires in houses (which are fireproof).

I don't believe in banning books generally.

However, libraries should have a responsibility not to be biased in pushing one particular belief, especially where that is contentious.

I'd rather have legislation that required books that could be used to persuade children to adopt such a belief, to have a front page that gives some facts and signposts to appropriate other texts to read too.

Eg "This is a book of fiction and the characters aren't real, but some of the people you meet in the real world will also have some of the same ideas. Some people believe it is possible for girls to become boys and boys to become girls, but scientifically this isn't possible. No one should be bullied for their beliefs, and it is ok that we don't all believe the same things. After you have read this book, maybe you will also enjoy (insert names of a few similar-reading-age titles where children are allowed to enjoy the activities associated with the opposite sex without having to believe in the magic of genderswapping)"

Children are going to grow up in a world where they encounter people who believe in genderfeels. I would rather they encountered the concept while they are young enough to be reassured that it's just one of those slightly bonkers things that some people believe in if their grip on reality is tenuous, like horoscopes. If they are shielded from it while they are young, they may encounter an evangelistic true believer at that vulnerable age when teens start thinking their parents are generally stupid and ignorant, and then it's much more difficult to protect them.

With legislation requiring that a suitable age-appropriate statement like the above must be attached to any ideologically-biased book in libraries and schools, it's not a ban but the the onus is on the adults to be aware of their responsibilities, and the difficulty of composing something age-appropriate for a very young child will ensure that those in charge of choosing which books to stock will swerve away from books with any ideological bias.