Transgender campaigners call for European rights body to report on UK

The Equality and Human Rights Commission's guidance following the ruling has further marginalized transgender rights.

Transgender rights are the same as everybody else's....they just no longer have the right to believe that theirs trumps women's. A group of men have been told "no" and their fragile egos can't deal with it. If they had spent the last few years fighting for 3rd space toilet/changing facilities, setting up their own various sports teams/leagues etc, instead of demanding women give up theirs and holding banners calling for the death of those that disagree with them then all of this could have been avoided.
I have no issue whatsoever when it comes to transfolk but, as the saying goes, I'm not going to set myself on fire just to keep them warm.

Here is the letter the article refers to.

https://x.com/feministroar/status/1939272711546499146?s=46

To the Committee on Legal Affairs and Human Rights and the Sub-Committee on Human Rights,

The undersigned are organisations which advocate for the human rights of trans people in the United Kingdom. We are writing to express our grave concerns about the developing situation regarding trans people's human rights in this country and to ask the Committee to take action.

Following a decision of the UK Supreme Court in April, the Equality and Human Rights Commission - the UK's National Human Rights Institution - has issued an interim update which encourages and in some cases mandates the exclusion of trans people from single-sex spaces and services, in violation of their human rights.' This has been followed by draft guidance which seeks to make such an approach statutory? The EHRC has made clear that it is not seeking input on its legal approach, only on how this approach is best communicated.?

The draft guidance, if it were to become law, would impose an obligation on employers and service providers to implement a bathroom ban on trans people using toilet and changing facilities in line with their acquired sex, instead requiring in practice that they use only gender neutral facilities. Such gender neutral facilities are frequently unavailable, and mandating their usage may require trans people to out themselves. The guidance would also prohibit associations for women and lesbians operating on a basis which would allow trans women to participate, even if the association desires to do so. This would also be true for men's organisations wanting to include trans men.

This draft guidance is being consulted on in the wider context following For Women Scotland, in which government ministers and public bodies have made comments about trans people's rights. The UK Minister for Women and Equalities has stated that trans people are required to use the toilets associated with their sex as recorded at birth, even where their change in sex is recognised by a Gender Recognition Certificate.' The National Police Chiefs' Council have announced that
male officers should now conduct intimate searches of trans women.'

In Christine Goodwin v UK, the European Court of Human Rights held that refusing to legally recognise the lived sex of trans people - and placing them into an 'intermediate zone' where they are not quite one sex or the other - was a violation of their right to respect for private life under Article 8 of the Convention. This protection was reaffirmed by the Court in the very recent decision of T.H. It is a core principle of the Convention that rights must be practical and effective, not theoretical and illusory.

We believe that in the UK, trans people are being returned to this intermediate zone, placing the State - once again - in violation of its positive obligations under the Convention. The legal recognition afforded by Gender Recognition Certificates is now illusory, and inapplicable to practical lived realities of trans people in this
country.

We ask that the Council of Europe take immediate action to protect the human rights of trans people in the UK. We ask that you conduct a report into the state of trans human rights in the UK. We note that the situation is urgent and without intervention, it seems likely to further deteriorate.

Kind regards,

Trans+ Solidarity Alliance
TransActual
Equality Network and Scottish Trans
Trans Safety Network
Feminist Gender Equality Network

At this stage in the game, I really don't think Bee actually believes that gender identity is anything other than a load of old nonsense either.

“Transgender campaigners call for European rights body to report on UK”

Well they would, wouldn’t they? They’ve literally nobody else to appeal to in the UK and they know many of the big international bodies are well and truly captured.

Face it Bee, you’re going to have to buckle down and use the men’s where you belong, unless you want to go live somewhere other than the UK. Even there, they’ll catch up eventually because using the opposite sex’s spaces is not a human right, it’s an imposition.

https://archive.is/rrHG5

Here is the archive link by the way.

In any case, this quote from the article is rather farcical. From
Rebecca Don Kennedy, chief executive of Equality Network

“Trans people have a right to public life, and dignity in social interaction, they have a right to use the toilet safely, to leave their homes knowing that they can. They have a right to privacy, a right to engage with the world as themselves, to join clubs that fully celebrate and welcome them as who they are.”

Mmm. And female people? Let’s just change the focus…

Female people have a right to public life, and dignity in social interaction, they have a right to use the toilet safely, to leave their homes knowing that they can. They have a right to privacy, a right to engage with the world as themselves, to join clubs that fully celebrate and welcome them as who they are.

It really is something to see the neglect of female people in this focus on prioritising male people. Particularly from a group calling themselves the equality group.

I suspect it is not about female equality at all.

Do please piss off.

You mean flouncing off this thread, or in general?

I think Bee has become a bit of a fixture, starting threads with poorly-researched statements and dodgy sources, failing to engage in any debate or answer any simple questions: what is wrong with using the men's toilet? what rights do trans people not have in the UK?

The only reaction will be that we are being horrid and unfair, as proven by the fact that the Feminism: Sex and gender discussions is full of discussions about ....feminism, sex and gender!

Bee seems too committed to spreading his mansplaining around the very limited bit of MN he is familiar with - I asked him on another thread if he goes onto the MN Pets board and berates them for talking about non-human life forms all the time, but I think he only targets this board.

This X a million.

No man has ever experienced a single sex female space and no man ever can. What a waste of a life to chase an impossible dream. Fucking capitalism.

I suspect we're in the flouncing stage of Spamming, complaining and flouncing.

I've been mulling over this comment. Who invited OP to MN, and why did OP need an invite anyway? Did OP think the invite was from a person of MN power which gave them bigger rights over us ordinary posters? Was it implied within the invite that FWR was desperate to change its wicked thoughts and needed someone of OPs calibre and intelligence to beat FWR into submission? It's a very weird statement to make.

Feel free to tell me to piss off and I will go - you asked me to be here and I responded ffs.

So the European Commission just finished their consultation on their LGBTQ+ strategy 2026-2030. Is this where the transgender campaigners urged the EC to berate the UK for finding a balance between gender identity and sex based rights? Because I read quite a few and responded myself and it was about 50-50 promote gender identity versus ‘also protect women, children and homosexual people, so don’t take it too far’, out of a total 1682 responses.

A lot of the responses pro gender identity were obvious cut and paste exercises or from lobby groups. The pro sex based rights came in all different shape and sizes and were more often from ordinary people. And of course there were a few very religious answers, but people’s religion based answers also have to be taken into account, as those people have rights too.

It will be interesting to see where the EC lands. If they don’t take the respondents for sex based rights seriously, then they risk alienating the ordinary citizens of the European countries even further and destabilizing the support for the EU. If they balance both conflicting rights, then they risk irritating a small minority of people. I know which one I would chose, so lets see what happens. For the UK government, I would just ignore this all, it has nothing to do with them.

If you can't deal with actually responding to points made, what does that say about your movement?

Do you consider yourself an effective and authentic representative of your movement?

Exactly.

I'm sure there are loads of women on here, like me, who aren't actually talking to Bee at all in their responses. I know exactly what he thinks and what he wants,

Any post I make addressing Bee's comments is being directed at lurkers.

Exposing transactivists, and transactivism, for what they are, is the quickest route to terfdom.

'Scolding, sneering and dictating' not generally considered persuasive.

Classic example of man in women's space, demanding a whole lot of attention, showing a great deal of issues, particularly with women, and desperate to use those women for his own need-meeting. I really don't know or care what that is.
Not feeding this any further.

Thank the gods for AI:

I want to understand YOU, so why can't you explain your thoughts on the article? Don't you read the body of any article at all and just get AI to summarise it for you, because going that route is asking for trouble - you don't know what AI has left out that might actually be really relevant to the whole conversation.

What rights do you believe trans not have that others do? And i mean you, not AI.

Not the only trans person at all. The only one who is anti women’s rights, but absolutely not the only TW (male).

Absolutely… See also repeated use of Wikipedia as a source!

Absolutely this.

But you've not discussed anything!

You've linked an article, added and AI summary, and then whinged that people are being mean. How are people meant to respond when you don't actually provide anything to respond to.

I've seen plenty of trans people come on this forum and actually discuss and engage, you're not one of them.

transwomen, who are male, don’t have the right to go into women’s spaces. That’s it Bee. It’s really rather simple.
Also, there’s no CIS: women are women and female. Trans women are transwomen and male. The end.

Yes. But it just keeps being used as the 'right' that is foundational.

It is just all built on falsity because the exemptions are deliberately neglected to be mentioned or are ignored.

The problem has been the misrepresention of the right to privacy.

The right to privacy has extensive exemptions on the grounds of impact to others - all of which relate to wellbeing and safety.

I would actually like this to be make perfectly clear, to be honest.

That no human right exists to separate out publicly accessed spaces based on the expectation of privacy or safety from another person of the same sex class. To be clear, there is no human right that says a group of male people should be given the additional privilege of accessing female single sex provisions for any reason.

The right of privacy needs to stop being misused. Because that right of privacy does not over ride female single sex provision rights.

It is a falsity that has been allowed to be repeated over and over. Perhaps it needs to be challenged at the Human Rights Court for once and for all. Has any lobby group for transgender campaigning done this?

Exactly.

We don't have to and we don't want to and that's an acceptable position in line with our legal rights which WE had taken away from us UNLAWFULLY.

This is different from transpeople who never had certain assumed 'rights' due to unlawful discrimination against women thanks to activist overreach and misrepresentations.

Human Rights require the understanding of the principle of balancing competing issues and the minimisation of harm.

Ultimately it comes down to the following: a single transwomen (or man claiming his right to be treated equally with other males) entering a female only space affects and removes the privacy and dignity of potentially thousands of women over the course of a lifetime. Therefore the solution is to create third spaces or for males to simply use male spaces and address the lack of tolerance of men. Rather than force women to tolerate their presence at the expense of their privacy and dignity.

This is not our problem to fix.