Should trans people have fewer rights? ‘Not in our name’, say over 35,000 women

Yes, given that people like Bee don't seem to care what they say, how they say it, or how bad they look, I'm sometimes rather surprised that they don't just say well we want the right to enter your spaces, even, or especially when, you don't consent.

being hung for a sheep as a lamb, and all that.

He's not going to.

He was asked umpteen times on the Drs vote for "identity based care" what rights transwomen had lost and couldn't name one

Well, having now read that Yorkshire Bylines piece, I'm more than happy for the link to be disseminated. It's a classic "Look how awful they are!" piece which most people would read and think "I dunno, it seems reasonable to me?".

Astroturf away, Buzzy Bee!

More like fluttered off

Yep. Astroturfing.

I expect the OP is following the advice in this Reddit post

https://www.reddit.com/r/transgenderUK/s/kAQBJn2yFu

Presumably those women are the same kind of woman as the author Jennie Kermode... as in no kind if woman at all!

Well said.

You know that could sound like a threat from you dead pan!

Crucified, : put (someone) to death by nailing or binding them to a cross.

Oh god. Prepare to be crucified

That's an important distinction, and very succinctly put.

Yeah i see your point flirts

but those types of posters lie about be censured and idiots believe them 🤷🏻 so its lose lose for us

and plop plop for them

exactly autumn

and by any thread i mean any….want to ask what sofa you should go for? Tough fucking tits DELETED

💯

Trouble is that then feeds into the narrative that people are being censored,

Either delete with a meaningful message as to why, or keep it and add a sort of official MN warning after the post. Something like "Before replying MNers should be aware that this poster's style tends to broadcast only so they are unlikely to engage meaningfully with any subsequent discussion".

(In the interests of balance I'm happy to carry a warning myself "this poster tends to be verbose and not let go")

I expect at least 80% of the "women" signing that petition are actually male.

Hard agree.

Are supposed to keep ‘playing nice’, like this nonsense is a game of two halves? I think MNHQ need to have a more serious look at this man and his occasional tag-team.

Personally i think MNHQ should delete every thread started by posters who have a track record of starting goady plop threads and not returning

starting these threads is absolutely and completely not in the spirit of mumsnet

Sufragettes fought for women not to be defined by their sex

Suffragettes fought for women’s LIVES not to be defined by their sex - in other words they were gender critical

Or “rights and entitled demands” or “rights and being a brass necked chancer” or rights and colonisation and appropriation”

I love that men think they can be suffragettes.

Thanks, I've added 'appropriating the Suffragettes' to my short but growing list of examples of reversals, i.e. things that have been said to challenge TRAs, which they are now reversing to use again the 'GCIM' , e.g.

-we are displaying 'cognitive dissonance'
-we have a deliberate Dentons-style strategy of bowdlerising our beliefs to be more mainstream-acceptable
[that one was in one of Bee's articles - which are turning out to be quite useful sources of evidence of TRA misinformation and DARVO, thank you Bee.

@BeeSouriante

As a trans woman you clearly do not believe "womanhood" is dependant on being female, as evidenced by the simple fact that you believe yourself, a male person, to be a woman.

So given that, I really do want to understand why is it so important to you that a group of people who you don't even belong to, who have nothing to do your definition of "woman", who by number alone have historically been marginalised, exploited and abused more consistently than any other group of humans, whose problems are different to the problems you may or may not face, be denied legal rights, social acceptance and even our own name and language with which to speak of our own experiences?

Why is it so important to you to take away the tools we need to fight our historic and onoing marginalisation, abuse and oppression, things that are nothing to do with you or womanhood as you experience it but are centred in our female bodies and how society treats us because of them?

It seems axoimic to you that female people must lose their rights for trans people to be safe but I really really do not see the connection here. It's not like female people don't actually exist or anything 😂 we are real, our bodies are real, and sometimes our bodies are a really significant factor in what happens to us so removing our rights and protections and the language to talk about that really does hurt us. So I just don't get what is wrong with acknowledging that and allowing us to continue to have female-only spaces, rights, resources and opportunities for those times that our sex is significant and does make a difference.

Can you explain?

Because honestly, I'd really love to know

Nobody has ever said 'trans' people should have fewer rights....

So that petition is all for nothing then.

So it’s quite important that multiple posters clearly say, ‘what a load of unevidenced, debunked old shite?’ to the goady poppers and astroturfers?

I hope MNHQ understands this.