Why are you trying to use someone with a DSD as some sort of ‘gotcha’? They have nothing to do with a male cosplaying at being a female (and are sick of being used in the gender ideology debate by TRAs I believe).

Another drive by poster, there have been several of these of late, is there any particular reason, have I missed something. 🤨

Do you think men like this https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-64796926 should use women's bathrooms?

You're very welcome, Elizabethbd.
Always happy to set out the issues for women who are genuinely interested in how trans rights and women's rights interact.
But lots of women aren't so happy to have to go over it for the umpteenth time, so the
https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/3145470-Break-it-down-for-me
thread saves a lot of time and effort.

Do you believe women like this should have to use men's toilets? https://www.facebook.com/share/v/1AZvSbYFqQ/

This. How can you define a rape if we can’t define a woman.

No one should be anti-trans.

they should be pro women being defined as a class of people that can be defined and protected. From birth to death and in multiple facets of our lives, women face unique issues because of the role we play in the perpetuation of the species whether we choose to become mothers or not.

they should also care about making sure gender nonconformity, including people who identify as trans, do not face discrimination.

the two things can and should exist simultaneously. The problem is that recently some people tried to create legal fiction.

I agree

which is why i asked about her thoughts before starting the thread.

PRO WOMEN

not anti trans.

Getting so sick of wilful misinterpretation.

The fact the question is always asked this way round gives you the answer.

Are trans women ever asked why it's so important for them to be in female sports? Why aren't they focussing on much more important things like violence and poverty?

Seems like it's only female people who are asked to give up "unimportant" rights.

But whhhy are women’s rights so important?

why do you keep expecting to be treated like actual people huh? Just stop going on about it!

🥱

I think this op might actually just be thinking

rare I know but it does happen

Jesus. Another one of these threads. From barely (not at all ) disguised TRA’s. Go away.

2/10.

Must try harder.

I’m thinking rape and violence towards women, homelesness, sex trafficking and honour killings. Why are these issues not more important and worthy of attention, as they affect so many more women than those who come into contact with trans women (or men)?

Are these instances of rape, violence, sex trafficking and honour killings doing themselves? Obviously not, they’re a direct result of women coming into contact with men. Because when you say ‘ … they affect so many more women than those who come into contact with trans women (or men)’ you linguistically remove the perpetrator of those offences against women and girls. Why would you do that?

”I’m not in the U.K.” = “I’m on a gap year in Nicaragua”

What was your understanding of the issue before posting here?

Sigh.

Imagine, if you will, that the Spanish Inquisition has time-travelled to the modern day and, as a result, the UK government has passed the following laws:

At least a pretence of belief in the doctrine is mandatory, on pain of punishment.

Children must be taught it as fact.

All laws must be based on it:

For example, abortion and contraception are illegal, as is homosexuality, and women are excluded from positions of influence in the faith and thus in society.

Is anyone who campaigns against this a secularist or anti-Catholic?

Actually, on reflection, both you and I have chosen examples of ideologies the practice of which harms everyone except adult straight men (🤔), so maybe I am both anti-Catholic and anti-trans.

The thing that makes my views non-hateful is that I don't want people banned from adhering to their non-truth-adjacent beliefs, as a matter of individual conscience. I just don't want them imposed on the rest of us. I don't hate people, just bad ideas.

I hope that no Catholics were psychically harmed in the making of this post.

I think there’s a fancy Latin name for this logical flaw, or should be:

I think A is more important than B. Many people think B is important. Therefore anyone who thinks B is important thinks A is not important.

@Waitwhat23 @Igneococcus Apologies - you've already done it! Agree that it should be posted at the top of thread - how do we do this?

What is it that you now understand, if you could explain?

I really think engaging in these constant bad faith questions is not helping - it bumps the thread up in the active, giving the impression that it is a real issue.

Is there a thread explaining these issues that we could link to when yet another of these 'questions' are posed in niaive terms.

I am fully aware that posting this is doing what I'm moaning about :(

Why are trans rights activists so anti women?