Trans sibling in law

I don’t think you need to do or say anything. Call her by her preferred name. Avoid debates about identity. This is my strategy anyway, it’s not something I’m interested in talking about, although I like to be respectful

You have your baby to focus on, this is all a red herring. I'd park it, keep calm, and focus on your well being.

It seems like an attempt to take the focus off you and your DP and your baby, just think about you three. Best of luck.

It is kind of you to worry about this woman, OP, especially since it appears that no one else in her family appears to. Her Mum ( according to your DH , and I tend to agree with him) just wants to get this person out of her home, the other siblings don’t seem to be involved, even DH doesn’t seem to be particularly concerned. Although it appears that she will find it difficult to access ‘affirmative’ healthcare interventions in Germany, this will probably lead to more disappointment and disassociation: the envisaged ‘solution’ has been denied.

But…. You are going to be very, very busy soon, with a new baby, and ironically your hormones are going to be disrupted so your emotions may be more volatile. Put on your own life jacket, OP. Call your SiL by her new name, that’s a courtesy and on the whole Male names used by women seem less grating than the excessively ‘female’ names often used by TIM ( ‘Barbie’ springs to mind). Pronouns in address don’t matter as ‘you’ in English is not gendered. I would use the pronouns DH uses when she is not present, but I hope you will have other and more joyous things to discuss soon.💐

You wouldn't need pronouns in their presence, they are used when the person isn't there and can't hear them, so that's OK. I'd step back from the whole thing and let your husband deal with his sister, if he wants to.

Hi, German here. Nah, the German system does not take people in who don't have German health insurance, which is either employer-based (affordable) or private (excruciatingly expensive).

Probably your in-law is taken in by the fact that many German institutions, including much of healthcare, are currently thoroughly captured, though there are the usual determined women slogging along trying to push back.

It all smacks of social contagion and I'd try to offer the mother some critical perspectives. I'd respect the in-law's wishes regarding pronouns in her presence, but not otherwise. Not good to mangle biological fact. Good luck!

Sure, @RareGoalsVerge , but the question is, why? This is a recent phenomenon, which hardly ever happened decades ago, and I think we all treat that "Joan of Arc was trans, and so was Liz I" bollocks with the contempt it deserves. Young people (mostly girls) should not be put under this kind of pressure.

@RareGoalsVerge that is the perfect response. No need for drama, virtue signalling, opposition or rifts. Each to their own without compromising your own ethics. Amen!

Honestly it's not really necessary for you to have an opinion. The person in question doesn't need much in the way of support or contact from their brother's wife. I see my siblings' spouses and my spouse's siblings once or twice a year, we are polite, we share a drink or a meal, and that's it, I don't have reason to talk about them much so don't tend to need to use pronouns about them. If any of them transitioned I don't think that would change at all because as I'm not sexist there's no fundamental difference in how I treat men and how I treat women. If they are going to emigrate to Germany to get medical treatment you'll probably see even less of them for the many many years until that multi-stage process is done. Your spouse can decide independently how to interact with his sibling.

People can't change sex, but a 26 year old of either sex has the right to choose their own path and choose their own beliefs and if their beliefs lead them to think they need to have major surgery to feel better about themselves they have the right to do so and to pursue any legal means to achieve that. Whether or not you or I or anyone thinks they are making a massive mistake and will regret it when they find out they are still facing the same problems post-surgery (but now with permanent post-surgical issues) it is none of our business.

@Primrose86 from what you’ve written it definitely feels you should keep this person close in a rescpectful, open but not totally captured way. The mum sounds like she has her own issues and your partner will also, inevitably. Alll their years of family/ sibling relationships will be overlaid on this issue.

Honestly? I’d just try and have some downtime with your sibling in law. Sounds like she just need someone who takes an interest in her and loves her for who she is. And also like she needs some levity and fun.

Great advice here.

I'd be worried for them, they sound very vulnerable.

I'd suggest if you have already backed away somewhat from the complex family dynamics that you don't put yourself in the midst of a big family fall out.

I would think about finding out HOW easily they could end up having life changing surgery. If the reality is it will be very hard for them to access I'd not worry too much.

In Germany, as in the UK, citizenship and language skills have nothing whatsoever to do with whether an individual has a right to free at the point of use non emergency, planned medical treatment.

In the UK residency is the key issue.

In Germany you have to be paying into health insurance, and you have to be a resident AND either an employee in Germany (or the spouse or minor age child - in some cases child up to age 27 if still in uninterrupted full time education - of a person employed in Germany and resident in Germany) for state health insurance.

Unemployed people who have previously worked in Germany remain insured, but someone who moves to look for work remains/ legally has to remain insured in their country of origin for two years or until they begin employment in Germany, and in that time is only entitled to emergency care and pregnancy and childbirth care. Self employed people have to pay for private health insurance which often means paying up front or being billed personally for any non emergency treatment and being reimbursed afterwards (if employed, the employer pays half the insurance and the employee half, if self employed the individual pays both contributions).

Basically to be entitled to free at the point of use non urgent health care, a new arrival needs to be employed in Germany. The individual also needs to register a residential address and have a German bank account, but being on an employer's payroll is the tricky part for someone not actually seeking employment but just arriving to access healthcare.

This is easy to look up on the official German government website.

Anorexia is a real thing. However affirming someone as fat when they are actually dangerously skinny is bad for them. This is the same thing.

Trans women are men in dresses and it’s not hate to say so.

@zoono I am a middle ground type person, and dont think trans is always wrong, or GC is always 100% right.

However, everyone should be concerned about an autistic, socially isolated, young adult outside of education or training who is (apparently) considering moving to Germany to live with their nonagenarian relative in the hope of having radical life changing surgery which will likely remove their sexual function before they are adult.

My opinion is different to your own, as I believe that being transgender is a real thing and isn't a problem at all. Regardless though, no good will come from op not supporting her now bil. Shed risk her marriage and the love of her in laws ,if she can at least try to be there for her now bil

Dont be so dramatic. There are lots of people on MN that are just as deluded as you are on this topic.

@Primrose86 She is your husbands sister. She always will be his sister. Whatever stuff she does to herself, whatever she tries to insist you call her etc - she will always be your SIL, your husbands sister. No amount of messing about with her body will ever mean she has magically become a man. Hold onto what you know is true.

I recommend getting hold of Helen Joyces book "Trans" and "irreversible damage" by Abigail Shrier. Or start by looking up Helen on you tube (shes done a huge number of interviews and is always an intelligent, reasoned, common sense person to listen to)

Sadly your SIL has got herself caught up in ROGD (rapid onset gender dysphoria). Its very common in young/ish people who are autistic, spending hours on the internet etc. Its an online contagion, a cult. (all of which probably sounds massively OTT, hyperbole but its true sadly)

So do I but that doesn't mean I qualify for medical treatment in Germany. She will once she lives there, has a job and pays into a health insurance, or receives benefits and is part of a health insurance that way, but she can't just go there and demand treatment.

Yes, you refer to them as he. I have a trans niece, she’s like a different person compared to how she was. So much happier. Lovely to see.