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Original poster

New Pride window in Belfast City Hall

262 replies

TheWitchWon · 23/05/2025 17:23

https://x.com/ripx4nutmeg/status/1925882503417454717?t=LdPsR5-OaXqN7CJw6pFKlA&s=19

The slogan on the window

"Save Sodomy from Ulster"
It celebrates inclusivity apparently and is the Lord Mayor's proudest moment as the city's Mayor.

https://x.com/ripx4nutmeg/status/1925882503417454717?s=19&t=LdPsR5-OaXqN7CJw6pFKlA

OP posts:
Thread gallery
7
suggestionsplease1 · 24/05/2025 01:27

ScrollingLeaves · 24/05/2025 01:09

To me LGB rights are about somebody's sexuality being irrelevant. The fact that he is gay should be irrelevant.

Exactly.

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This is the age old technique to silence, shame, and diminish gay people.

Make us invisible and then we are easier to isolate and eventually dismiss.

Pretend we don't exist and you don't have to have to acknowledge the harms that are done to us.

Make us invisible so we can not find each other, and can not support each other.

Visibility enables us to combat the prejudices and hostilities that have always existed, and are returning with more force in the world today.

"Just keep quiet won't you, we don't want to hear this" That is what this thread is all about.

ScrollingLeaves · 24/05/2025 01:09

TheWitchWon · 23/05/2025 23:55

Not really.
I posted for a number of reasons.
Being upset wasn't one of them.
Firstly I posted because I disagree with the need to include the slogan on the window. Why was it necessary? People will argue that it was instrumental in achieving gay rights. I don't believe that to be accurate. Others obviously will disagree.
Secondly I posted because I wanted to open a conversation about this.
I don't see gay rights as being about slogans about sodomy, as being about celebrating fetishes at Pride marches or about forcing a religious family to bake a 'Support Gay Marriage' cake.
I think it's OK to say that.
No single group should be given immunity from criticism.
That's not what equality is about.
Of course, as expected, the best immediate response was homophobia and an attempt to shut down the discussion. A few posts gleefully anticipated that the pile on would be enough to scare me off.
People will have different opinions on the window, but to accuse people of homophobia for not automatically fawning over it is bullying behaviour and indicative of a culture of entitlement that will only result in resentment.

The second part of my OP is about the mayor.
To me LGB rights are about somebody's sexuality being irrelevant. The fact that he is gay should be irrelevant.
Yet, it's his proudest day as Mayor?
A window? Really?
I would have hoped he had greater ambitions for the city than that.

Show quote history

To me LGB rights are about somebody's sexuality being irrelevant. The fact that he is gay should be irrelevant.

Exactly.

ScrollingLeaves · 24/05/2025 01:07

TheWitchWon · 23/05/2025 18:29

I know the history of the slogan.
It was designed to be offensive at the time to pack a punch.

LGB rights were won precisely because they are just the same as everyone else.
The overwhelming majority of people understood that and rejected homophobia.
What anyone does in their bedroom between 2 consenting adults is their own business.
Not anyone else's.

The need to put slogans such as that on Belfast City Hall isn't progress.
It isn't inclusive.
It's Paisley in another guise.

Show quote history

You are so right.

No it isn’t inclusive. Far from being inclusive it has put gay men in a separate category of their own, and emphasised the word ‘sodomy’ which will not help them ( just as Paisley intended).

(Note how it ‘inclusively’ is only about gay men and leaves out lesbians - although this is lucky for them.)

It is absolutely hideous too.

moggly · 24/05/2025 00:53

It's a bit garish in design but the overall message is provocatively defiant against homophobia, and I like it for that.

RhannionKPSS · 24/05/2025 00:43

What an ugly thing, how embarrassing for Belfast

PandoraSocks · 24/05/2025 00:13

Thunderpants88 · 23/05/2025 23:59

Brick.

That is an old fashioned phrase to describe Micky Murray. But a nice sentiment, I guess.

TempestTost · 24/05/2025 00:10

I'd be interested to know what other stained glass windows are in the building. I suspect one thing that turns people off this kind of thing is the feeling that it's very faddish and flavour of the day, and that LGBTQ+ stuff seems to get all the money and attention now with things like arts grants.

It is also rather ugly, I think there are quite a lot of gay and lesbian people who are tired of being seen as the ultimate kitsch lovers.

Thunderpants88 · 23/05/2025 23:59

Brick.

Original poster
TheWitchWon · 23/05/2025 23:55

PandoraSocks · 23/05/2025 20:03

But that is not why OP posted, is it?

She didn't post saying she was against spending 25K on the window. She posted because she was upset about the use of a famous gay rights slogan.

Show quote history

Not really.
I posted for a number of reasons.
Being upset wasn't one of them.
Firstly I posted because I disagree with the need to include the slogan on the window. Why was it necessary? People will argue that it was instrumental in achieving gay rights. I don't believe that to be accurate. Others obviously will disagree.
Secondly I posted because I wanted to open a conversation about this.
I don't see gay rights as being about slogans about sodomy, as being about celebrating fetishes at Pride marches or about forcing a religious family to bake a 'Support Gay Marriage' cake.
I think it's OK to say that.
No single group should be given immunity from criticism.
That's not what equality is about.
Of course, as expected, the best immediate response was homophobia and an attempt to shut down the discussion. A few posts gleefully anticipated that the pile on would be enough to scare me off.
People will have different opinions on the window, but to accuse people of homophobia for not automatically fawning over it is bullying behaviour and indicative of a culture of entitlement that will only result in resentment.

The second part of my OP is about the mayor.
To me LGB rights are about somebody's sexuality being irrelevant. The fact that he is gay should be irrelevant.
Yet, it's his proudest day as Mayor?
A window? Really?
I would have hoped he had greater ambitions for the city than that.

OP posts:
SirChenjins · 23/05/2025 23:22

suggestionsplease1 · 23/05/2025 23:18

😂I think you might be under another delusion here - how the mainstream reader of Mumsnet is reading the FWR boards.

Believe me, they see what is happening here, and posts like yours are seen for what they are.

Show quote history

It called reality. It’s a wonderful thing.

MayaPinion · 23/05/2025 23:20

😂😂😂 It would look amazing in Peppa Pig World at Paultons Park. Exactly the same colour scheme 😂

suggestionsplease1 · 23/05/2025 23:18

SirChenjins · 23/05/2025 23:15

I didn’t think you could - it’s impossible to refute the truth. You demonstrate this inability constantly on these threads.

Edited
Show quote history

😂I think you might be under another delusion here - how the mainstream reader of Mumsnet is reading the FWR boards.

Believe me, they see what is happening here, and posts like yours are seen for what they are.

SirChenjins · 23/05/2025 23:15

suggestionsplease1 · 23/05/2025 23:14

😂 Well, I already have enjoyed reading your delusions which you have laid out fully for us.

To equate that stained glass window which has designed to be a display of support and solidarity for LGBT people as a depiction of homophobia is a fevered delusion indeed.

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I didn’t think you could - it’s impossible to refute the truth. You demonstrate this inability constantly on these threads.

suggestionsplease1 · 23/05/2025 23:14

SirChenjins · 23/05/2025 23:08

Please tell, which bits of my previous posts are you claiming have never, ever happened in the whole of history ever? I shall enjoy reading your newest delusions.

Edited

😂 Well, I already have enjoyed reading your delusions which you have laid out fully for us.

To equate that stained glass window which has designed to be a display of support and solidarity for LGBT people as a depiction of homophobia is a fevered delusion indeed.

Original poster
TheWitchWon · 23/05/2025 23:12

TooBigForMyBoots · 23/05/2025 20:17

No, we don't have slogans celebrating sodomy, what a weird way of looking at it for someone who lived through it.Confused It's a small part of a stained glass window that represents a nasty chapter in our history.

But good art provokes a response so it's doing its job.Smile

Show quote history

To you it's weird.
To me it's not.
I just don't think it was a necessary part of the window.
Good art might provoke a response. But so does bad art. We obviously differ in our opinions as to which this is.

OP posts:
SirChenjins · 23/05/2025 23:08

Please tell, which bits of my previous posts are you claiming have never, ever happened in the whole of history ever? I shall enjoy reading your newest delusions.

suggestionsplease1 · 23/05/2025 23:06

SirChenjins · 23/05/2025 23:03

It’s a window that celebrates the banning of a long-established organisation that fights against homophobia and has significant elements within it that supports violence, intimidation and intolerance against the legally established rights of women.

So no, it’s not just a fucking window.

Please tell, which groups are you frequenting that are preying on your vulnerable mind in such a way?

SirChenjins · 23/05/2025 23:03

It’s a window that celebrates the banning of a long-established organisation that fights against homophobia and has significant elements within it that supports violence, intimidation and intolerance against the legally established rights of women.

So no, it’s not just a fucking window.

suggestionsplease1 · 23/05/2025 22:59

SirChenjins · 23/05/2025 22:53

Whereas women are hounded out of their jobs, out of single sex spaces, lose their places on sports podiums , physically assaulted, threatened with death, decapitation and rape.

Your sympathies are misdirected .

Show quote history

It's a fucking window.
It offers a little bit of support in the world to people who are experiencing increasing discrimination and hostility.
Get over it.

suggestionsplease1 · 23/05/2025 22:56

Screamingabdabz · 23/05/2025 22:51

What a wonderful symbol of disadvantaged and vulnerable people - a white male punching the air. Brilliant. 👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻

Interesting. Normally when it is a non-white person FWR is the first place to moan about tokenism and bewail intersectionality.

Good to see you leave no stone unturned.

SirChenjins · 23/05/2025 22:53

suggestionsplease1 · 23/05/2025 22:47

At a time when LGBT people are frightened to walk the streets at night this visible show of support and solidarity is needed more than ever

https://www.irishnews.com/news/northern-ireland/lgbt-people-fear-walking-home-in-belfast-over-hate-attacks-6M2QLSPE45BN7IINA6AZNFMYRY/

Whereas women are hounded out of their jobs, out of single sex spaces, lose their places on sports podiums , physically assaulted, threatened with death, decapitation and rape.

Your sympathies are misdirected .

Screamingabdabz · 23/05/2025 22:51

What a wonderful symbol of disadvantaged and vulnerable people - a white male punching the air. Brilliant. 👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻

PandoraSocks · 23/05/2025 22:49

SionnachRuadh · 23/05/2025 22:31

There are boys who paint muriels on the estates who, well, their work isn't popular with everyone on political grounds, but they know not to make their image too busy.

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"Muriels" always makes me think of Hilda Ogden.

TooBigForMyBoots · 23/05/2025 22:47

SionnachRuadh · 23/05/2025 22:31

There are boys who paint muriels on the estates who, well, their work isn't popular with everyone on political grounds, but they know not to make their image too busy.

Show quote history

It's not popular with everyone on artistic grounds either.😆