Gender Critical and Transphobic Trans Allies

I do think OP makes an interesting point which I have come across time and again. Lots of people believe they should #bekind, parrot TWAW, and agree that they don’t really understand the trans experience. It makes them really uncomfortable if you ask questions, because it makes them confront the conflict between what they know to be true, and what they’ve been socialised to say.

That discomfort is exactly why it’s been socially unacceptable to ask the questions (not ok to make people feel uncomfortable). It’s also why, if #nodebate can be effectively broken down, and people feel empowered to say what they really think, the whole thing will crumble like a pack of cards - the vast majority of people just don’t agree with the GI premise.

I’d also highlight that we don’t know whether pharma/surgical interventions are actually in anyone’s best interests. Proper medical trials may well show that all this was built on a pile of sand, and some doctors’ conceit about being able to perform ‘treatments’ that nobody actually needed

It's the people who say they are allies but also use "woman" as interchangeable with "female" who don't seem very clear on what it is they're actually supporting.

Lots of trans people have come out with this after the ruling - saying male toilets would only have men in them (surely they'd be mixed gender?)

But I believe that some people are only able to live a life they feel is worth living if they have hormonal and surgical interventions to make them look more like the opposite sex and have no issue with them doing so.

That's sex, not gender. The eternal issue of them either meaning the same thing or entirely separate things depending on who you're talking to!

I agree, but we have a whole host of women who know their sex and are taking similar steps to modify their bodies to great risk.

Once you see it OP, you cannot unsee it.

And a thread often helps you clarify in your head just what it is that you are perceiving. The dissonance is real. And it is great to keep reevaluating what you think.

Are we allowed to mention trans allies who lose their shit when they are mistaken for trans women?
We've had threads where we've shared our experiences of being called 'sir', most of us just laugh it off and I don't think anyone has tried to get a low paid worker sacked for it.

Oh yeah she said "this is a safe space" too, and I thought 'actual TRAs would eat you for breakfast if they saw you had any issues with them being in women's sports.'

Yes I saw one the other day "transphobes who agree with the SC ruling get off my Facebook" then in the comments when someone brought up women's sports the OP conceded this was a huge issue but claimed she "didn't have the spoons" to think about it. 🙄 IDK how I feel about people like this because on one hand they know that there are problems with e.g. self ID but on the other hand they refuse to think about them or address them.

Some people say racist things while trying to promote anti-racism to actual racists.

You might put me in this catagory, although I wouldn't describe myself as an ally and never shouted abuse at transphobes.

I don't think that people can change sex or that transwomen are actually women.

But I believe that some people are only able to live a life they feel is worth living if they have hormonal and surgical interventions to make them look more like the opposite sex and have no issue with them doing so.

I think transgender children exist, in that some children have gender dysphoria that persists into adulthood. I don't think they should be given puberty blockers / hormones / surgery because we don't know if they will grow out of it. But I don't think this means they don't exist.

But sadly, OP, I suspect that your thread may be lost because you used the words such as cult, and if it is deleted, maybe you should contact MNHQ and ask to restate it with different wording.

"But there is also a massive group of people who genuinely believe they are allies, and genuinely believe they are 100% TQ+ friendly. They are happy to shout abuse at "transphobes". Yet stick them in a room to speak with a protest-attending TRA and they would either be condemned as a disgusting transphobe, or they would be browbeaten into being quickly educated and forgiven so long as they do penance as instructed."

This has long be recognised.

There are quite a few posters on MN who in their defence of people they support as being transgender, end up being arbitrators of who is and is not transgender. And there are even people who have transgender identities who will declare who is and isn't transgender.

Obviously, this revolves around the concept of there being a 'true' transgender group.

And let's not forget that so many of them forget the rest of the 130+ genders!