Banned from breastfeeding group for objecting to males breastfeeding

Everyone else is as uncomfortable with it as you are, so fuck the group and set up your own.

It's 'about bringing their breasts to full maturity', apparently

For the love of God women are women, men men and trans people are just that.

We have just had the first womb donation pregnancy. Are our law makers going to allow that to be a given right to both males and females?
We are not here for frankenstein experiments. Children were given puberty blockers to keep them suspended in pre pubecent bodies. This is such fucked up thinking.
Gay people have always existed, cross dressers also. We co existed OK.
Now others seek mutilation and shout loudly when others object to the effect it has on us and our families.
Both scientists and doctors have responded to this thread as have I the mother of a transperson.
Transactivists have no business in female spaces and you bloody well know it.

Why would humanity need to do this? There are more important things to research in medicine than this.

Totally agree, but the general population has very little control over what is being researched and how to stop said research going ahead

Yes definitely the odd one or two TRAs have infiltrated this thread but they are fighting a lost battle thankfully.

A man attempting to breast feed is child abuse plain and simple. Anyone defending it is highly suspect in my book.

I tried to breastfeed (and then to express) and it didn’t work. Baby would not latch and I didn’t produce enough milk. The HV and GP initially had a go at me for not bf (accused me of not trying hard enough) but when I asked for domperidone they said no. I eventually got hold of it anyway via other sources because I was so desperate and it STILL didn’t work. So I drank weird herbal teas, I paid for expensive consultants and I even considered getting on a plane to America to see some bf guru there.

Eventually, months down the line, it was brutally but necessarily pointed out to me that the baby was doing just fine with formula and bottles and that this quest had become all about me and my self-perceived inadequacies.

It is the same thing with TW. It is not about their baby at all, it’s all about their own self-actualisation. Truth needs to be spoken to these people.

That picture ! Ugh
@Datun
Look at the fucking smirk on his face, he's really getting off on it isn't he🤬

We were speaking of the near future you recall

You said
“It could be something that happens in the near future, the way things are changing so quickly who knows”

It couldn’t, and most sensible people do know that.

That picture ! Ugh.

It's not the transwoman's presence they are uncomfortable with as far as OP's post indicates - it is the fact the transwoman is there for their own breastfeeding needs, and not to support birthing mother and child on their journey. A father showing up to these groups because they want to breastfeed, regardless of whether that father is in a dress and called Susan or in slacks and a shirt and called Steve should be given short shrift and asked to leave. Figuring out the logistics and practical steps for some future utopia where medicated males take on the postpartum physical load is quite obviously not the purpose of a 'breastfeeding support group'. Of course, if all the members want to do that fair enough, but it then ceases to be a breastfeeding support group and becomes something else. The gender affirmation of trans people in every single space and scenario is not a sensible end goal for trans rights, because many spaces, such as breastfeeding support groups, were not set up for trans people. (Now, if a trans man wanted to attend a group to breastfeed, fine, but that would be the opposite of gender afffirming, so my point still stands).

When the men who have done this make such an effort to let us know why they do this and what was in it for them, we really need to read their words.

take heart. The pushback from women everywhere is dismantling this ideology at rate of knots.

This is from the original article

https://archive.is/ekhDf

This is a medically trained male paramedic who did this by the way.

There have been numerous threads about this in the past and never once have we been offered any benefit for the infant in all this. Not once.

Quite a few issues in that original article about Buckley.

Here are a few statements:

''To know I could breastfeed my own child and have that experience, I wanted to be a part of that. I wanted to know what it was like to be a mum and breastfeed."

and

'I will never know what's it like to menstruate or carry a baby or give birth,' Ms Buckley said.

'But to be told I could have the opportunity to breastfeed, it was something that was nice to be able to experience as a trans woman.'

and

'The first time it came out I just started leaking,' Ms Buckley said. 'Then I pumped and it was a weird feeling having a suction cap suck out milk, but it was exciting.

'I thought, "Oh my God, I am actually producing human milk".'

and

'Apart from the milk he was getting from me he was essentially starving,' Ms Buckley said of the couple's hungry son

'I genuinely believe had I not brought my breast milk into the hospital he could have become very sick with liver and kidney issues from lack of nutrition.'

and

'It was sad. It was frustrating, but as brief as it was, I did get to experience it. I would have preferred to do it a lot longer. But Auden's wellbeing was paramount.'

I am really looking forward to posters telling us just what about this interview is not pointing out that this all about the male. What part of these statements above are about the child.

Even when HCP's pointed out that the baby was starving, it was all about that adult male.

'paramedic Jennifer Buckley was warned by doctors against trying to nourish newborn son Auden from her own chest but she went ahead anyway.'

and

'The controversial practice has been criticised by specialists as experimental and unethical but Ms Buckley believed she had the right to breastfeed her infant.'

and

'Ms Buckley said when doctors at the hospital learnt she was trying to breastfeed Auden they warned Ms Honnery-Buckley it could put her newborn at risk.'

and

'Apart from the milk he was getting from me he was essentially starving,' Ms Buckley said of the couple's hungry son'

Why was the hospital letting an infant ‘starve’? Or did this couple refuse formula and manufacture the need for this male to then ‘rescue’ the newborn by feeding their son? It should be noted the medical team for the baby thought this was not an advisable option. This male did it anyway!

Maybe those posters who support this male feeding secretions to that infant, can also then point out just how that male feeding the newborn, whatever the substance was they were producing was, how are they providing the newborn nutrition if the composition is unknown?

I doubt we will get any answers though.

That this endrocrinologist has spoken at AusPATH about this, and has 'assisted' FIVE other males to do this, I suspect each state in Australia will have some males to have done this already and quite a few more will be aiming for it.

The usual 'only one / two/ a few' rhetoric would be misinformed.

see below:

Dr Naomi Achong, a former president of Australian Professional Association for Trans Health (AusPATH), is the Brisbane endocrinologist who recommended Ms Buckley breastfeed Auden.
It is understood she has helped five other transgender women breastfeed.
Dr Achong spoke on the topic of 'lactation induction in transfemales' at a AusPATH conference last weekend and her talk was one of the most booked events.

I believe that I have since read that there have been more male people assisted. I think I remember nine being mentioned.

My body will never allow me to conceive and bear a child, and I've always wanted to at least be able to nurse one. That was the main motivation for this. The secondary motivation was that I wanted to bring my breasts to full maturity.

The lactation thing for me just affirmed my womanhood, I think that was the most important part.

Me, me, me - demonstrating the polar opposite of motherhood

Thank you .

i feel really upset reading the whole thread. I cannot believe how hard the pushing is against woman’s protected characteristics.

Be trans / bi /gay straight whatever I have no problem with that. But I feel so scared for the future of what woman are being made to accept. I rarely hear if what Transmen want. But that’s probably because they were once a woman , but they have decided to change gender.

It really isn’t ignorant, I would say it’s thoughtful and takes into account the wider context.

In what future do we need men to take drugs in order to breastfeed? Presumably women are still giving birth, and lactating afterwards? Why do men need to do this at all, and if they don’t, why would anyone put so much time and energy into pursuing this except as a medical experiment?

Why would humanity need to do this? There are more important things to research in medicine than this.

For those who are interested in the science, here is some more to read.

A transitioned male expert was the one who was putting up alerts about this, not the two people who carried out the treatment.

www.newscientist.com/article/2161151-transgender-woman-is-first-to-be-able-to-breastfeed-her-baby/#ixzz6f2Pil0Ik

However, the woman’s breastmilk has not been assessed yet, so we don’t know if it has the same mix of components as in milk from new gestational mothers. This means the practice cannot yet be recommended, says Madeline Deutsch at the University of California, San Francisco. She says she can see the potential benefits of breastfeeding, but that the long-term impact of this milk on the baby – including on subtle measures like IQ – is unknown.

Deutsch herself is a transgender woman with a six-month-old baby who is currently being breastfed by Deutsch’s wife, who was the gestational mother. “I am very sad not to be able to breastfeed her and at the same time I did not consider doing this for the above reasons,” she says.

This was February 2018. I have not seen anything to prove that any in-depth studies have been released since to counter this expert's opinion. And there has been plenty of other threads since this that where these studies would have been posted by activist posters.

So, there we have it. A transitioned male, Associate Professor, Family Community Medicine, is telling the world that this is not advisable until further research.

And this is key too:

After three months of treatment, this increased to 227 grams of breast milk per day. Once the baby was born, she was able to exclusively breastfeed the infant for six weeks – during which time a paediatrician confirmed the baby was growing and developing normally and healthily.

Although significant, this is below the average of around 500 grams that a baby consumes by the time the it is 5 days old. After six weeks, the woman supplemented her breastfeeding with formula.

So.... for how many weeks did this infant receive half the nutrition it needed? This male only supplemented the feeding regime at SIX WEEKS!!!

And this was supposed to be monitored surely. It was an experiment. Why was this allowed!

From the New Scientist article.

It’s about feeding the dysphoria.

Any doctor who prescribes medication to a man for the sole purpose of enabling him to lactate into a babies mouth should have their license to practice medicine revoked.

It’s not just medication to induce lactation - there needs to be a cocktail of drugs including synthetic hormones and some supplements that shouldn’t be taken if you intend a child to drink the fluids it produces.

It’s not what is best for the child. It’s feeding a kink.

The issue is multi faceted.

What benefit does this give to an infant?
The results are not analysed even adequately.
It is known to be sexual fetish for some male people.
The male breast lacks the receptors that a female breast has that allows milk to be tailored to that infants unique needs.

And so we cycle around to What benefit does this give to an infant?

Honestly. Men and bloody breasts.

It would appear particularly amongst this cohort of men. Breasts occupy their every, fucking, waking moment.

But any other dads would not also trying to breastfeed.

(I think OP also said that there are no other men there).

Don't forget Women who discuss it online in Australia can be told they have broken the law. Because a male centred experience (there is no proven robust study done on these secretions to show they are safe in the long term) must only be celebrated apparently.

Two Australian Women Told They Broke The Law After Criticizing Trans-Identified Male Breastfeeding Child - Reduxx

No. Men can't produce enough fluid to sustain life.

Exactly!! I feel a few men have infiltrated the comment section of this thread.

I couldn’t imagine something like this happening in my community. The area I live in is quite conservative. Even the left side of politics is conservative about this sort of thing. When our Labor Prime Minister was asked his opinion on trans issues he shut it down.

Has this been shared yet?

https://www.theparadoxinstitute.com/read/the-ugly-truth-of-male-breastfeeding

This is a review of the studies often discussed here on MN in regards to males feeding infants the secretions from their breasts. It confirms what we have been posting.

Conclusion

Given all the available data on the amount of milk produced as well as the lack of studies on the safety of these medications at such high doses, it is safe to say there is no sufficient evidence to prove transwomen can safely breastfeed an infant. Transwomen cannot produce enough to give adequate nutrition and the unknown dangers to the infant from the medications is not worth the risk.

But even further, it is concerning that it was of great importance that breastfeeding was affirming for the transwoman.

Breastfeeding is about providing nutrition and immunity benefits to the infant. It should be concerning to everyone that affirmation is addressed at all. Given the risk to the infant, the ethical question must be asked: is a transwoman nursing really about feeding the infant, or is it about feeding the dysphoria?