Pulled up at work for ‘trans views’

When you email asking for the position in writing copy in their manager, their manager’s manager and HR. Shit ‘em up.

What point could be made?

What is the difference between being a woman who identifies as agender and being a woman who doesn't identify with a gender identity?

I suppose it could be an interesting philosophical discussion, which would necessarily involve discussing what 'cis' means. Maybe next week they could get their Catholic and Protestant employees to discuss transubstantiation and see how that works out. However, they would get into difficulty if they suggested one belief was correct.

I am angry in your behalf OP. If I had been on the receiving end of I’m not sure I would have been able to keep calm. In fact I know I would react. I can’t bear to hear the word casually used, without perhaps acknowledging that the term can offend. Yes to having things in writing.

So he can have two 'I'm special' badges instead of one interesting personality?

I always misread agender as agenda.

I think if someone can choose how they are referred to then everyone can....and that includes defining how they refuse to be referred to....so if someone can refuse to be called "he or she" you can refuse to be called "cis" and I say this as someone who doesn't mind the term being used about me but would not use it about another unless they asked me to. Saucy goosey and all that.

Has this been a formal warning OP? Are you expected to respond?

Part of me would want to take this further, get them to put it in writing, then wipe the floor with them, quoting Forstater , SC ruling etc.

But part of me would want to just laugh at them and say “yeah whatever”!

I’d probably do something in between. Maybe send an email saying that as an experienced healthcare professional you will always treat your colleagues and patients equally, and will respect their chosen pronouns. But that in return you expect them to respect your view of yourself as a women, not a cis woman.

I would feel the same as you OP, but in all honesty I would have just answrred the question in their context as the very fact they have arranged this session would have signalled to me that they would have issue with me raising it.
I am the higger earner in my house and can't afford to lose my job.
I do think you did a brave thing and without people speaking up then nothing changes. So you are right, but I would be cowardly in this particular scenario.

Imposing the trans agenda on the workplace is done via coercive control - as you've just discovered. Everyone is compelled to smile and nod and accept whatever language is bestowed on them by members of the sacred caste - sometimes enabled by useful idiots in an organisation.

If that sounds harsh, remember women have been bullied into compliance over all this for years.

Oh Chris, you silly billy!

"Cis" doesn't mean "someone who isn't trans" at all!

"Cis" means "someone whose gender identity aligns with their gender assigned at birth"

So it can only apply to people who actually have a gender identity, which a great many people do not.

Gosh, this has been explained to you so many times now, it really is very odd you never seem to remember.

i will gently remind you again that many people, especially women who live with the social and physical consequences of how society treats people of their body sex regardless of how they may personally "identify", find being assumed to be "cigender" quite offensive. Please do better to be more considerate and inclusive.

It's clearly your management who need to learn to be "inclusive", since they've decided that people who maintain a sex-realist worldview (which is the majority of the population) can be censured and discriminated against for doing so.

Legally, they are certainly in the wrong, as many organisations have found to their cost.

I think they were out of order putting you on the spot like that in the training.

Hahaha, no. Yet again, here you are touting your false information, do give it a rest.

Definitely get this down in writing, OP. Your position is watertight.

This

Turn that around to someone who identifies as they/them and see how that pans out. This is compelled speech and is unlawful. Respect works two ways, the OP doesn’t recognise herself as ‘cis’ so shouldn’t have to accept it.

Do fod

Are you working for the NHS?

Can you contact the legal department or is there a whistleblowing process?

They don't seem to be up to date on the law.

CIS is bullshit, entirely appropriated to make biological women a subset of womanhood. I, and other adult human females reject CIS/don't recognise it because it is meaningless to us. Women (as a sex-class) do not need descriptors.

Good advice!

It's a load of nonsense.
As PP says, if they want to make an official complaint about you then they need to follow the proper procedures. Otherwise just ignore and get on with your life.

Another healthcare setting that has fallen into this bollocks trap.

It's enraging.

This whole 'living as a woman' stuff is complete bollocks. Not a single person in the whole world can define what it actually means, and the sooner brave women like OP can kick it out of the park, the better.

Depressing how many people in healthcare have been seriously captured by the trans stuff.

Recently, a colleague at my company has declared that they are ‘agender’ and asexual and has asked to be addressed as ‘they’.

I can't get past this. Nobody cares other than the colleague in question. They are nothing more than an attention seeker. This nonsense needs to stop, especially at work.

OP, you did nothing wrong. In like of the recent SC ruling coupled with Forstater's win, your management is on very dicey ground. To echo others, ask them to put into writing what their concerns are about what you said, more so as you didn't not say anything remotely transphobic. (Not that they said that per se but that's what they are implying.)

Nope. For a long while the term 'cis' completely enraged me, without me really understanding why.
I am not a 'cis' anything, I am a woman. I was born female, and I will remain female. Nobody anywhere is going to force on me a term to describe a woman who isn't trans.
We already have a word for that. It's WOMAN.

@wherearethemarsbars the benefits of threads like this are you can safely talk it through and have a laugh.

The direct approach by some posters is great in theory but not in reality.

As a pp has pointed out you need to find the right approach in a work environment.

Putting it in writing is a good way of getting it on the record.

A soft response along the lines of you found the season interesting and useful but are surprised that identifying as a woman rather than a cis woman is not considered inclusive.

I have always believed inclusivity is about respecting people how ever they identify. There are people who identify as Cis Women and there are people who identify as women.