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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Should I respond to his ridiculous take - Transmen to make a "nuisance" in toilets

64 replies

ICantDoItAll · 22/04/2025 15:15

This post appeared on my feed earlier. I usually appreciate this person’s commentary as he tends to articulate things in the news very clearly, but this one really grated. I’ve considered replying, though I’m unsure if doing so might attract backlash—I don’t know how widely my comments would be seen. But surely I’m not the only one who finds this take absurd? For one thing, trans men have been notably quiet about the Supreme Court ruling. More importantly, the implication seems to be: trans men—who have generally just wanted to live their lives without fanfare—should now perform masculinity to such an extent that it makes women feel threatened?

A call to 'arms' to all trans men.
In light of the recent UK supreme court decision confirming that use of single sex spaces are to be determined by sex at birth or biological sex, I urge every masculine looking trans man in the UK to nuisance protest by using the ladies toilets as often as you can. If you have a beard and muscles, even better. Keep proof of your sex at birth with you for when you are challenged, to show that your birth sex is female. Do it in toilets and in changing rooms all over the UK. When you do so be loud and attract as much attention as possible, and try to use them at the busiest times you can. You go and demand your space and entitlement in any female only space you can find. Do it in gyms, meditation classes, yoga classes, doctors offices and hospitals, anywhere and everywhere. The more sensitive the space, the better. Be loud and be proud. If they try to refuse you or shut you out, make a scene and cite the judgment. The only way to show them the absurdity of this ruling is to be absurd. Nuisance protest. And when you do, let them know politely, that unlike trans women, you are sexually attracted to women.
You owe this to your trans sisters. This affects you as much as it does them.

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Rightsraptor · 22/04/2025 21:09

'You owe this to your trans sisters.'

They just can't stop centering men, can they?

TheaBrandt1 · 22/04/2025 20:59

I was going to post we will look back and see this as mental but actually surely most people would have that view now anyway.

ArabellaScott · 22/04/2025 20:35

CocoPlum · 22/04/2025 15:26

"Unlike trans women, you are sexually attracted to women"

Er ... that's a sentence suggesting that transwomen are gay men who only transition to be seen as straight, surely??

Oh dear.

'when you do, let them know politely, that unlike trans women, you are sexually attracted to women.'

Is anyone going to tell him?

IllustratedDictionaryOfTheDoldrums · 22/04/2025 20:29

I'd just say that 'Deliberately trying to upset and scare women in places that they feel vulnerable might not be the win you think it is'

Keeptoiletssafe · 22/04/2025 20:07

I have some evidence to show that women who campaign for gender neutral toilets don’t actually end up liking them as there’s creepy men in there. Honestly I would have thought this one was made up if I hadn’t been published by the school, to this persons plea: we need more gender neutral toilets because we get late notes as we can’t go the toilet in the allotted time as everyone’s using the gender neutral toilets for sex and vaping.

I really need to collate all these don’t I?!

Hubblebubble · 22/04/2025 19:34

Plenty of women are attracted to women. Has this writer not heard of lesbians or bisexual women?

Apollo441 · 22/04/2025 19:28

The two transmen I've clocked were tiny with wispy facial hair. There was no way you would mistake them for anything but female. And they both appeared to be with boyfriends. I think even the convincing photos we've seen wouldn't be convincing in real life, there is really no hiding how the female skeletal structure animates. Massive giveaway.

In any event they they are welcome in women's toilets and changing rooms as they are women.

Datun · 22/04/2025 18:39

Igmum · 22/04/2025 18:34

Oh FFS 🤦‍♀️. It’s totally juvenile.

In fairness not many TM pass, at best they are rather odd looking women.

And what the fuck do they think is going to happen? That a raging, mumsnetting, flag wielding terf is gonna be in there, with the Supreme Court on speed dial!

🤣🤣🤣

Igmum · 22/04/2025 18:34

Oh FFS 🤦‍♀️. It’s totally juvenile.

In fairness not many TM pass, at best they are rather odd looking women.

Datun · 22/04/2025 18:34

Honestly, the picture this conjures up.

Furious men standing out outside women's toilets, shoving in women who identify as men, urging, go on, go on, tell 'em you fancy them! Go on, show 'em your beard!'

Heaven forfend that I should ever crow, but fuck me, this is exactly why they lost

TheaBrandt1 · 22/04/2025 18:31

If anyone followed this advice I don’t think women in the loos would be scared but the person acting like that would run the real risk of being sectioned.

TheaBrandt1 · 22/04/2025 18:30

I felt uncomfortable seeing my friends slight Dd who identifies as a boy go into the men’s loos at a nightclub (we were seeing a band there) I felt worried for her. As a mother I would far rather people in that category use the womens loos - because they are women.

RufustheFactuaIReindeer · 22/04/2025 18:03

Thelnebriati · 22/04/2025 15:38

''And when you do, let them know politely, that unlike trans women, you are sexually attracted to women.''

Thats gonna be one fuck of a random conversation 😳

i don’t usually lead with my sexuality….usually its what the weather is like or how annoying it is to queue

Keeptoiletssafe · 22/04/2025 17:55

Xenia · 22/04/2025 17:16

There are just about no public toilets near me anyway sadly as the local authority has let them die out. However most trans "men" (biological women) look like women anyway and don't have male anatomy so I doubt there will be any problems with them in with other women unless they are protesting. men using public toilets for all kinds of weird reasons sadly has always been an issue -some men see them as a sexual place - never understood that as they are usually dirty with mess all over the ground even in the ladies!

Ahh I have a story about that. The American
‘Stud’ journal had an article about sight lines in male public toilets and the excitement of their mirrors and gaps in doors etc. The American architect who was inspired by this article and has built a body of work based on these concepts, was then quoted by Arup as the evidence source to enclose toilets for people with long term health conditions in this country. Bizarre but true things I never expected to find out when I began to research why the safety gaps were disappearing.

Justme56 · 22/04/2025 17:27

To be honest, I’ve always felt that transmen probably felt quite vulnerable in men’s facilities - the fear of being found out that you are actually female could be quite daunting. There was a ‘non - passing’ influencer recently who obviously thinks they are the big I am, who seemed to get a bit paranoid about men looking.

Being constantly told that it’s cis men who are the issue, I think the odd male looking female should be okay.

Xenia · 22/04/2025 17:16

There are just about no public toilets near me anyway sadly as the local authority has let them die out. However most trans "men" (biological women) look like women anyway and don't have male anatomy so I doubt there will be any problems with them in with other women unless they are protesting. men using public toilets for all kinds of weird reasons sadly has always been an issue -some men see them as a sexual place - never understood that as they are usually dirty with mess all over the ground even in the ladies!

OestreBunny · 22/04/2025 17:14

I think there is a case, as the SC ruling points out, for not allowing TM into spaces that are specifically for very traumatised women such as RCCs and refuges. I am not blind to the fact that there will also be traumatised women in every day SS spaces. However, in general I would be happy to accept TM (beardy or otherwise) into our spaces where we can interact with them and show them sisterhood and support. Many of them have borne the brunt of this wicked, misogynistic ideology

Lentilweaver · 22/04/2025 17:13

why do they think we will object? Transmen are women. They are welcome even if they have beards.
I don't care if they are sexually attracted to women either. I have no issue with lesbians.

SirChenjins · 22/04/2025 17:12

We've coped thus far with being called chest feeders and pregnant people, and are supportive of females using the correct single sex spaces - I think we'll manage just fine with a few shouty women with beards. Many of us have raised toddlers and teenagers, there's not much we can't deal with.

Does anyone else feel quite nostalgic for the simpler days of Greta Thunberg and school kids taking the day off school to protest about climate change?

Fimofriend · 22/04/2025 17:10

StressedLP1 · 22/04/2025 15:37

I don’t know know why he thinks this is such a “gotcha”. I have an issue with transwomen in women’s toilets not because they are trans, but because they are male. I have no issue whatsoever with trans men in women’s toilets.

It is because he thinks we can't see that they are biological women.
They don't have Adam's Apples. I fully acknowledge that some men don't have very visible Adam's Apples either but the trans men have

  • smaller hands than men their height
  • smaller feet than men their height
  • thinner facial skin than men
  • a different walk than men.
OuterSpaceCadet · 22/04/2025 17:01

MySweetGeorgina · 22/04/2025 16:56

I am totally fine with trans men (biological women) to use the ladies changing room

the fact that they “might be attracted to me” (LOL) makes no difference. I have no problem, obviously, with bisexual women or lesbians in female changing rooms either.

i imagine many women feel the same way

transmen, and lesbians are not a problem to society and not a threat to women and women do not fear them the way they can fear biological males

women are NOT te problem here

I 100% agree but, unlike transwomen, a minority of transmen do pass.

The amazing Keira Bell has said that, despite detransitioning, she often uses mens spaces as she's aware of how she can appear male and of the effect that has on people.

OuterSpaceCadet · 22/04/2025 16:58

Its like left wing misogynists saying we have to accept their creepy demands or they'll let the right wing misogynists take our abortion access away.

It shows us they understand the issues women face perfectly well but instead of using that as a basis for empathy and towards working together, they weaponise it.

MySweetGeorgina · 22/04/2025 16:56

I am totally fine with trans men (biological women) to use the ladies changing room

the fact that they “might be attracted to me” (LOL) makes no difference. I have no problem, obviously, with bisexual women or lesbians in female changing rooms either.

i imagine many women feel the same way

transmen, and lesbians are not a problem to society and not a threat to women and women do not fear them the way they can fear biological males

women are NOT te problem here

TheOtherRaven · 22/04/2025 16:52

It's always been the threat. Let the men in and shut up or we'll send in women with beards.

Fine, bring them on, women with facial hair are very welcome. Frankly I'd much rather be in an enclosed space with women kicking off than men.

JoyousEagle · 22/04/2025 16:50

“Let them know that unlike transwomen, you’re sexually attracted to women”

Firstly - that’s a bold assumption about the sexuality of all transwomen and transmen.

Secondly, it suggests women in general have an issue with lesbians in female toilets etc. because they’re attracted to women.