Bridget Philipson- TW should use toilets according to biological Sex.

That will be the (entirely imaginary) urinary leash.

Best start campaigning for your own loos...

Better how? What did they actually DO in their 14 years In power, during which all this really became an issue?
Edit to add: banging on about wanting an apology when Starmer has clearly said he welcomes the clarity the judgement brings just feels like trying to make it a party political thing.

very much all of the above.

as pp have said, and @Keeptoiletssafehas spent a lot of time setting out, fully contained unisex loos without gaps aren’t safe for other health reasons.

its also a situation whereby the more of these toilets that are built, the more there will be awful data on instances of people collapsing in them and not being noticed.

True safeguarding anticipates risk and puts measures into place to minimise those risks. It will be very difficult to reverse once these spaces are created.

Glad to see this thread. NRTFT but I am worried by what I have read on BBC News coverage of this interview with BP. Will the government start advising businesses and services to simply offer gender neutral toilets provision as a response to the recent Supreme Court decision?

The ministers are not saying ‘but you must also continue to provide single sex women’s toilets’. Obviously we don’t know what EHRC will advise yet, but I am concerned that the government is ‘getting ahead’ on this issue like this in the media. I don’t want men in women’s toilets, and I don’t want women’s toilets to be given away to be gender neutral spaces either. Women’s toilets are our spaces that we need as women. I don’t care at all what gender anyone wants to perform in there as long as they are female.

Gender neutral toilets do NOT provide any equivalent to women’s single sex toilets. It’s about women being able to be privately only in the company of other women. And GN toilets are horrible. No women want to be mopping men’s piss before they or their kids can use public toilets, nor should we have to deal with men leaving the GN cubicle door open so we have to walk in unbeknownst and see them using the toilets.

Following all the years of strife to get to this excellent Supreme Court decision of 2025 re Equality Act 2010, it would be a tragic consequence if women’s toilets start disappearing. I think single sex women’s toilets are under threat.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c5y42zzwylvo
Bridget Phillipson managed a women’s refuge before becoming an MP, and yet even she seems to be saying that gender neutral is the way forward. This is so wrong. It’s fine to have a third space toilet where that can be accommodated, but it’s absolutely not fine to remove women’s single sex provision entirely. Nor to relabel that as ‘gender neutral’ which I can see many cash-strapped businesses doing.

And. which will cause an outrage amongst some men, it needs to be argued loudly that if any single sex provision must be removed to accommodate third spaces, then the provision to be removed must only be taken away from men’s single sex toilets provision. Not from the women’s toilets- women have a lot more reason to need a single sex spaces.

Better how? What did they actually DO in their 14 years In power, during which all this really became an issue?
Edit to add: banging on about wanting an apology when Starmer has clearly said he welcomes the clarity the judgement brings just feels like trying to make it a party political thing.

Slightly off topic but is the gap legally required for H&S?

my work loos have floor to ceiling doors on the cubicles and it’s always made me a bit nervous!!

Wonder what that bloke Eddie Izzard thinks.

I’ve not said anything of the sort. They were better than Labour though, on this issue. We have the receipts, as they say.

The only people here who keep referring to such things, seems to be people protecting Labour and Starmer. ‘Move on’? That’s laughable for people who continually say ‘but the last 14 years..’ hey ho

This is about Starmer and Labour not any other party. And how he needs to provide a statement retracting his previous statements about women having penises (for example), and apologise for the consequences of his party’s ’previous’ position on this. As I have mentioned above in more detail.

Not sure why that’s difficult to grasp.

I'm sure some of them will @Nominative but they can be confronted and the buzz they get from being able to lord it over you has gone with their entitlement. A man can walk into a children's changing room or a breastfeeding rest room or a room with a 'staff only' sign. They can't be stopped without a risky physical confrontation but their entitlement has gone. Most will tow the line. Eddie Izzard has used the ladies loo but whilst he is still trying to forge a political career for himself, I expect he will be giving it a swerve. They are now going to have to learn to navigate the gents and the power balance has shifted.
We are seeing the death throes of this oppressive movement and I'm sure the strategic thinkers amongst them will be scheming but now that no debate has been seen off, they are going to have to change public opinion and so far they haven't demonstrated that they possess the skill set.

Im a taller, more muscular woman who tends to dress in quite typically masculine ways eg jeans and hoodie. I would feel pretty embarrassed if someone challenges me in a woman's toilet and asks me if I'm a man. I'm not going to thank them for it. And then, how do I prove I'm a woman if they don't believe me? Maybe I'll get a badge.

That's going to cause a bit of embarrassment when the people ordered out turn out to be women.

Why third spaces? More importantly, how third spaces? [actually fourth spaces because there already are women's, men's and accessible toilets - which are only for disabled people, and as a PP pointed out 'being trans is a choice not a disability', so hands off the accessible toilets!].

Has anybody given any thought to where these fourth spaces are going to be
located in buildings? How much it is going to cost to construct them? Where are bankrupt local authorities going to find the money to provide 'third' spaces in every public building in case one of the 262,000 transpeople out of a population of nearly 70m wants to pee in that specific building and chooses not to use the toilet designated for their biological sex?

'Third' spaces are being presented as a silver bullet but I'm going to keep repeating: on a practical and financial level, they would be expensive and disruptive and as there's nothing really stopping transpeople from using the toilets designated for their sex, except their own feelings, the expense and disruption is just not warranted.

I love the 'this men's space welcomes transwomen sign', though wouldn't it be better if the 'female' figure was also blue??

A new stickering campaign suggests itself😏

It’s grim.

An example.. ‘The moment trans women are forced to use male spaces, is the moment that the attacks on us go up, we end up with illnesses because we don't want to risk peeing in male toilets or we hide away at home.’

The. Fucking. Irony.

Im a taller, more muscular woman who tends to dress in quite typically masculine ways eg jeans and hoodie. I would feel pretty embarrassed if someone challenges me in a woman's toilet and asks me if I'm a man. I'm not going to thank them for it. And then, how do I prove I'm a woman if they don't believe me? Maybe I'll get a badge.

If anyone wants to look, the frothing from men is quite something.

If anyone wants to look, the frothing from men is quite something.

Slightly off topic but is the gap legally required for H&S?

my work loos have floor to ceiling doors on the cubicles and it’s always made me a bit nervous!!

But it's a bit meaningless, isn't it? It's not as if anyone polices entry to the toilets. I suspect lots of TW who have quietly been using women's toilets for years without anyone noticing will just continue.

Wow, I can’t believe that they’ve actually got comments switched on on a trans article! I guess they can’t avoid it when it’s on the live politics page.

I heard Bridget gulp once, but she seemed pretty clear. It was a smart move to sneak these qns in before school breakfasts (but she seemed to be well briefed to expect to be quizzed).

I’m guessing that Wes is “too busy” to do any interviews for the foreseeable.

FWIW, I tend to avoid using cafe/pub loos, but I can’t think of many that aren’t marked male and female.