Anyone else also tired of the protests trying to focus only on toilets?

Yes I have read same. I think there are MSPs who try and raise these issues in parliament and get dismissed.

I read that they are often going to nearly supermarkets instead!

There are girls self excluding from using school toilets in some Scottish schools where mixed sex facilties have been provided. It’s appalling to treat young girls this way

I have to say that it’s a very good point OP said about girls at school !
my god … isn’t it sensitive enough age for all teens and when girls start their periods .. having boys strolling into their toilet rooms is just outrageous. I would have been very disturbed about this as would all my schools “female biological “ friend …
This debate must never lose its heat … keep going fellow biological females … we must always remember the suffragettes and what they died for … I’m not a dramatic speaker either but this has got my fears ground so much … I respect that trans people want to be heard but daubing paint and defacing the statues of the suffragettes movement is doing a disservice to you all quite frankly.
yes dress up and express how you wish … but please know boundaries in life is what keeps us all safe including yourselves !! We would never stand by and watch a trans man or lady feel threatened by anyone who is a bigot …Just please keep away from our “safe spaces “ and accept the fine line that is there for preventing those who want to exploit our safe spaces for sinister reasons … which I will add is not the majority of the trans community.but the threat is there and real

I agree

Oh little Stephen and Fred were both on LBC about this when the Sullivan Review was published. Apparently they are grown adults and can take responsibility for their own health and have fabulous relationships with the staff at their GP surgeries so there is no problem 🙄

Absolutely, when discussing it I say "it isn't really about toilets" and start talking about prisons/intimate searches/hospital wards/chaperoning youth camps etc.

The other point that can be persuasive to avoid being shut down by the be kind brigade as "a bigot terf" is asking how a transwoman will get appropriate prostate screening or transman their smear test if there is no appropriate recording of biological sex at birth.

Absolutely. They have already tried to remove all meaning from words like ‘woman’ and ‘female’ but the sheer idiocy of arguing that some can be a woman for some purposes but not others, ie toilets vs sport and prisons is incoherent

But is that what the aim is? To break down society so much that anything goes and nothing works?

Something to lighten the mood anyway always makes me giggle when I think of it. About 15 years ago l arrived on duty and went to say hello to my male patients! We were always running out of mens pj’s but when I spotted a big burly chap squashed into a pink nightie, I went to the nurses station and said ‘who the hell put a nightie on that chap! Well that was my first brush with the trans issue. Thank goodness common sense prevailed and he was put in a male bay!

It's a really good question to ask as many others will also be thinking the same thing. Debate draws upon real situations helps to highlight why it's not appropriate for men to be in women's spaces for privacy, safety and practical reasons.
Women are biologically different to men.

I think we have to be firm across all spaces.

If a man is a woman for the purpose of toilet provision then why is he not for sports?

It is not just about safety it is about dignity and holding the line.

To be more specific. They also are where women and children are sexually assaulted and many people die. It’s the privacy that’s the problem.

Why do we have a gap under public toilet doors? For health and safety
Why do we get rid of the gap when toilets are mixed sex? For privacy
What are we getting rid of by doing that? Health and Safety

They also are more expensive, dirtier, less efficient (meaning more waiting for women) and make it more difficult for women to support one another. There is a place for single occupancy units, but it should not be the norm.

It is not resolved by individual private self contained cubicles. These are more dangerous for everyone - they are least dangerous for healthy men.

Where else are you in often a public place with your pants around your ankles and a thin cubicle wall with a lock that can be forced quite easily (assuming it’s working already). Toilets make women a lot more vulnerable because they are already in a state of undress. There is a reason why unisex loos are supposed to be a single room with proper walls and a lockable door. It makes perfect sense to me to prioritise single sex toilets.

I don't think toilets are trivial but I think the trans activists are using them to trivialise the debate.

On X there are loads of posts from tras mocking us, saying we want inspections at the door.

They have nothing similar to say re eg sport.

When I mention anything on X I tend to use the changing room example rather than toilets because they just go on and on about showing ID or how will we police it or why don't we have single stalls.

As it happens my daughter has epilepsy and special needs and toilets are a big issue for me but it is the hardest one to debate with tras.

Just an attempt to deflect attention away from why this is actually a crucial ruling.

I do agree that the trans rights activists are focussing on toilets as they think they can spin women's needs as unimportant in that context. I just think that rather than trying to shift the focus elsewhere, we should be tackling them head on. It may be more difficult to engage people in the arguments that toilets should be single sex (largely because they are so mundane that the general public understandably don't really consider them much at all, let alone as an important women's issue), but if we can get the general public to recognise the importance of single sex toilets (as a proportionate means to achieve a legitimate aim), then we are ensuring recognition of women as a distinct sex, with distinct needs every day, and that it is proportionate to consider those needs in daily life, not just in niche circumstances.

Sorry that was meant to be in response to @Shortshriftandlethal

Naturally I know all this, I realise my comment was short sighted, my apologies for that, I think I’ve been so disgusted and traumatised by dirty unusable public loos over the years I avoid being in situations where I need to use them. London Bridge and pub or restaurant loos are the rare places I’ve used in the past few years, I’ve left reviews of trendy east london bars that have decided to unisex theirs & have piss everywhere, Somerset house where men openly chose the ladies over the men caught the sharp end of my tongue. I suppose I’m just so sick of the tra brigade obsession with it, why can’t they have a third bog. Again, sorry for my flippancy, im firmly on the same side as you,

I think they must, on some level, know it isn't about anything some may think is petty, but about power. That man's poster "I will make you listen", sums that up for me.

Couldn’t agree more.

Most immediately and with the biggest impact for individuals, I agree with pps: my concerns are for women in situations they cannot control. Prisons, hospitals, detained by authorities for search, requiring facilities like rape counselling and refuges.

But on a societal level, the wholesale acceptance of what is logical crap and the willingness to demonise anyone who disagrees is the single most concerning aspect of all.

Human beings categorise and name things. It’s how we organise society, for good or ill. And there has to be some sort of coherence to what these things are for this to make sense. Yet we now have people claiming it is a matter of life or death to be considered a man or woman while making those categories utterly meaningless. It’s not that they have an alternate definition - there is simply none.

And swathes of our societies have not only accepted this, but vehemently engaged in moralising and castigation of those who have pushed back. It really is incredible.

I agree that the focus on toilets is strategic on the part of TRAs. When posters suggest that toilets are ignored, this doesn’t mean that they are agreeing to all loud being mixed sex, they are saying that they are not an effective focus for debate.

Sport is a better example of why single sex should mean single sex.

Intimate care or intimate searches is a better example of how dignity is impacted.

Reducing the arguments to loos to discuss substantive issues isn't helpful. Bizarrely, it is the most easily resolved as third spaces or self contained single units solve the problem. The examples above pose more difficult challenge for trans people.

Yes! Men need to go to the toilet more if they have an elarged prostate or have had their prostate removed due to cancer. They may have to wear incontinence pads. Women often have to wear pads too as bladder function can deteriorate with age.

Dementia, or any number of other conditions can can also cause incontinence.