Tomorrow's Mail front page: Labour trying to reverse reverse ferret

The DM is no more cavalier with facts than any newspaper, of any political outlook.

How far these facts go is another matter. I don’t believe Starmer or any other senior Labour figure will push trans issues. They want it all to go away. They hitched themselves to a bandwagon that went off a cliff and they want to cut loose.

What this story shows, though, is that Labour is a rudderless collection of fools stuck in student politics. They spent so long telling the public that they were great and honest and caring that they actually came to believe it. Governing in the real world has come as a terrible shock to Starmer and his talentless cabinet. Their reaction to the exposure of their hypocrisy is the best sign of all that.

Their hearts are in trans crap. But their electoral fears will win out: no law changes for the ‘women’ with, or formerly with, testicles. It’s over.

Replying to myself FFS. Ignore me...

He met with the Darlington nurses and was clear that women needed spaces based on biological sex, I think? Or was there an element of fudging language there?

He's very ambitious and in a very unsafe seat. I can imagine that he won't want to see any course of action that could lost Labour votes.

I hope you're right. What makes you think he's done a 180? I thought so when he announced the ban on puberty blockers, until I realised it's not actually a ban. Existing patients will still get them, and new patients will be put in the clinical trial. So we'll get some data about these drugs (at last!), but at the expense of children's health. The whole thing is really questionable from an ethical perspective. I'm not convinced WS has switched sides; rather I think he's acting strategically.

I remember the very recent time when the guardian published a story about a poor transwomen who wasn't put in a women's prison. The transwomen had been sentenced for burglary, what the guardian didn't tell its readers was the transwomen in question was breaking into women's homes, stealing their underwear and the underwear of teenage girls, to engage is sexual acts. They also failed to report on his convictions for voyeurism and violence.

I'm not going to get into the DM good/bad thing, I'm not in the UK and we have our own media to argue about.

I'd rather comment on the big picture: that there is a movement to subvert the SC ruling in some way - I've heard so many TRAs talking about 'having to find some way to get around this' and so many comments like 'We have to do something for the trans community' - and of course the 'literal genocide' slogans at the recent demonstrations.

Then there's the suggestion that there's no choice but to go on a massive building programme of 'third space gender neutral facilities', instead of people just using the existing facilities designated for them by sex.

Or, as I keep warning, accessible facilities being re-badged as gender neutral toilets - watch out, disabled people - we can't continue co-opting women's spaces, so we're coming after yours now..

There is a backlash going on, and it may find support amongst MPs, even government MPs, and it's good to be prepared for that, whatever the source of leaks/rumours/whatever.

More in Common just did a mega poll. Reform would be in power if a vote ran today. How did Labour get it so wrong in a short 8 months.

I hope you're right. What makes you think he's done a 180? I thought so when he announced the ban on puberty blockers, until I realised it's not actually a ban. Existing patients will still get them, and new patients will be put in the clinical trial. So we'll get some data about these drugs (at last!), but at the expense of children's health. The whole thing is really questionable from an ethical perspective. I'm not convinced WS has switched sides; rather I think he's acting strategically.

Yes. The latest Nowcast is suggesting Labour are in big trouble in the red wall: Nowcast — Election Maps UK

My money’s on Wes Streeting as the source of the leak. He’s done a 180 on trans ideology, is likely to be in this group as he’s gay, and has ambitions to be PM.

Yes. The latest Nowcast is suggesting Labour are in big trouble in the red wall: Nowcast — Election Maps UK

Some areas have voted Labour for a very long time,
but if they start going to Reform Labour could be in trouble.

Wales and other areas.

I will bet money that Reform sweep the Valleys in next year's Senedd election. Welsh Labour to me are looking very much like Scottish Labour circa 10 years ago, when everyone outside the party could see the collapse coming.

And it's not like Plaid can complain. They've had plenty of opportunities to take advantage, and at the moment I can't see that they stand for anything other than Labour's least popular policies in Welsh translation.

Reform are slightly ahead of Labour in polling in Rhondda and Ogmore.

Still, I expect Chris Bryant would rather lose his seat than abandon his completely batshit beliefs.

Exactly.

Having now seen the messages they could just be referring to Ms Falkner coming over as dismissive rather than a comment on the Supreme Court. Although they probably don't like the judgement either.

A few backbench Whats App do not a rebellion make! It is quite normal for MPs not to agree with everything their own government does , and probably not even desirable that they should.

My money’s on Wes Streeting as the source of the leak. He’s done a 180 on trans ideology, is likely to be in this group as he’s gay, and has ambitions to be PM.

Chris Bryant is only objecting to the words in brackets presumably in the steve Race section. Read the whole exchange, ignore the bit in the brackets and its clear they are going after the EHRC and its chair.

No what I’m saying is this is not the threat you’re all making out (hoping?) it is, WhatsApp messages from a few mps is hardly the smoking gun that means Labour, as a party, are likely to challenge the ruling, the Mail (like every paper) just knows how to push its readers buttons, in this case trans ruling + Labour bad. As I said mumsnet has lost it over this a lot of it now feels like seeking out new things to get angry about without much critical thinking. Be like Jk, it’s time to have a cigar.

Exactly.

Having now seen the messages they could just be referring to Ms Falkner coming over as dismissive rather than a comment on the Supreme Court. Although they probably don't like the judgement either.

A few backbench Whats App do not a rebellion make! It is quite normal for MPs not to agree with everything their own government does , and probably not even desirable that they should.

Exactly.

Having now seen the messages they could just be referring to Ms Falkner coming over as dismissive rather than a comment on the Supreme Court. Although they probably don't like the judgement either.

A few backbench Whats App do not a rebellion make! It is quite normal for MPs not to agree with everything their own government does , and probably not even desirable that they should.