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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

What my NHS Trust have said about the Supreme Court verdict

242 replies

Opinionpolecat · 18/04/2025 07:28

The NHS Trust I work at sent an e-mail to all staff yesterday talking about the Supreme Court ruling. They stated that the judges have said that “woman” in UK law is based on biological sex. They go on to say that they want to be clear the ruling does not change the fact that everyone is welcome in the Trust and that they are an inclusive organisation. They say everyone deserves respect and understanding including staff, patients and families. They understand that some staff members may feel they need support at this time and recommend the LGBT+ staff network where LGBT+ staff and allies can find support and advice.

It struck me that they think only LGBT+ plus staff and allies will need support and advice, and the reassurance that the trust is such an inclusive organisation. They say nothing about the fact their policies have discriminated against female staff and patients for many years. They don't even admit to it but say this wasn't their fault, it was due to NHS wide guidance and they offer no apology to female staff, patients and their allies about these years of discrimination. They say nothing about the fact that for many years some female staff and patients may not have felt welcome or included within the Trust. Have any other NHS staff had similar messages?

OP posts:
GreenFriedTomato · 18/04/2025 23:41

CarefulN0w · 18/04/2025 17:24

I’m posting this cautiously, as it is speculative, but there is a rumour that CQC is likely to be abolished in its current form. Possibly quite soon, once parliament returns.

If true, it’s not necessarily great news as there will be a merry-go-round of former NHS England staff looking for employment. The very people who wrote the be kind policies in the first place. But, more positively, it would be good time for a reset.

The CQC needed abolishing years ago. Those 'surprise' inspections they do to monitor quality on hospital wards?
We knew exactly what day/time they were coming and given plenty of notice so things could be covered up, documents falsified, problematic staff who might speak out taken off the off duty that day. The NHS is corrupt and none of them are to be trusted

CamillaMacauley · 18/04/2025 22:03

I suspect any inspection organisation will be a tick box exercise who never actually picks up on anything. Like signing Morecambe Bay maternity dept off as good when actually it really wasn’t. Took a relative pushing and pushing that to uncover it all.

MrsOvertonsWindow · 18/04/2025 21:56

CamillaMacauley · 18/04/2025 17:36

Wow, if the CQC fold and nhs England are going there will be a lot of health care types out of work. Or will they just be employed by the DoH? Surely someone still has to inspect the hospitals? Saying that have outcomes improved since inspections?

The CQC are a Stonewall champion - an allegedly independent regulator being signed up to an organisation campaigning against the rights of women and lesbians and aiming to remove safeguarding for certain groups of children🙄

I recall they gave GIDs a glowing report until the embarrassing scandals of ill treatment of vulnerable children emerged when they suddenly did a hasty reverse ferret and found GIDs to be problematic.

Suspect society would be much better off with a new professional independent body not in hock to trans lobbyists.

HoneymoonSouvenir · 18/04/2025 21:45

KnottyAuty · 18/04/2025 21:41

Yes this. Hand wringing is one thing. Discrimination against women was cheap. Now we see how committed the trans allies will be - I hope they put their money where their mouths are given how they’ve encouraged and lied to trans people so far. They owe it to them

Yes, they were prepared to do it when the “only” cost was women’s rights - which as we all know now are considered cheap.

KnottyAuty · 18/04/2025 21:41

HoneymoonSouvenir · 18/04/2025 21:33

Fortunately, Kemi Badenoch got the Building Regs updated just before the Conservatives lost power last year.

New non-residential buildings (and major refurbs of existing buildings), must provide separate single sex toilets. The only exception is where the building is too small to have more than a few loos. In which case, it can be universal design for mixed sex use.

This does not prevent universal facilities being provided too, but single sex is then minimum requirement.

Let’s see which organisations claiming to be trans inclusive continue to be so when it means putting their money where their mouth is and paying to install additional universal facilties.

Toilet accommodation: Approved Document T: www.gov.uk/government/publications/toilet-accommodation-approved-document-t

Yes this. Hand wringing is one thing. Discrimination against women was cheap. Now we see how committed the trans allies will be - I hope they put their money where their mouths are given how they’ve encouraged and lied to trans people so far. They owe it to them

HoneymoonSouvenir · 18/04/2025 21:33

Shortshriftandlethal · 18/04/2025 09:26

I suspect some committed trusts may attempt to get around the ruling by providing only universal mixed sex spaces with full length doors. Sarah Montague, on Radio 4 yesterday suggested that all spaces could be named 'gendered' spaces rather than sex based spaces, for example, to get around the 'problem'.

You couldn't make this shit up. Astonishing!

Fortunately, Kemi Badenoch got the Building Regs updated just before the Conservatives lost power last year.

New non-residential buildings (and major refurbs of existing buildings), must provide separate single sex toilets. The only exception is where the building is too small to have more than a few loos. In which case, it can be universal design for mixed sex use.

This does not prevent universal facilities being provided too, but single sex is then minimum requirement.

Let’s see which organisations claiming to be trans inclusive continue to be so when it means putting their money where their mouth is and paying to install additional universal facilties.

Toilet accommodation: Approved Document T: www.gov.uk/government/publications/toilet-accommodation-approved-document-t

TragicTess · 18/04/2025 20:48

Thanks @KnottyAuty have copy & pasted mine to the comments rather than a PDF - if that hasn’t worked let me know & I will try to upload

TorturedParentsDepartment · 18/04/2025 17:43

CarefulN0w · 18/04/2025 17:24

I’m posting this cautiously, as it is speculative, but there is a rumour that CQC is likely to be abolished in its current form. Possibly quite soon, once parliament returns.

If true, it’s not necessarily great news as there will be a merry-go-round of former NHS England staff looking for employment. The very people who wrote the be kind policies in the first place. But, more positively, it would be good time for a reset.

We had them in my workplace recently and they were chatting (very nice supportive and wanting to understand and improve - not bash us down - inspection team by the way) to us that they were only contracted to this particular inspection for a limited time with no word of what was going to happen after that was over.

CamillaMacauley · 18/04/2025 17:36

Wow, if the CQC fold and nhs England are going there will be a lot of health care types out of work. Or will they just be employed by the DoH? Surely someone still has to inspect the hospitals? Saying that have outcomes improved since inspections?

CarefulN0w · 18/04/2025 17:24

I’m posting this cautiously, as it is speculative, but there is a rumour that CQC is likely to be abolished in its current form. Possibly quite soon, once parliament returns.

If true, it’s not necessarily great news as there will be a merry-go-round of former NHS England staff looking for employment. The very people who wrote the be kind policies in the first place. But, more positively, it would be good time for a reset.

KnottyAuty · 18/04/2025 15:59

Haulage · 18/04/2025 15:53

Are they all similar KnottyAuty? Do you think there was a template?

Sorry I’ve just popped out - didnt look in detail. Will do later

thenoisiesttermagant · 18/04/2025 15:58

SidewaysOtter · 18/04/2025 07:45

I guess it’s par for the course (though sad) that the first thoughts for transactivists have invariably been defensive. They have been playing the victim card for so long that it will be difficult to shift out of that mentality.

Those at the top of NHS trusts and the like have been thoroughly indoctrinated with EDI policies and the “trans people are the most vulnerable and oppressed” idea will die very hard. As will the need by these people to signal their Correct Think virtue at every turn, it’s almost an instinctive reflex by now.

This is why it’s not over yet, we still have to fight back against the organisations that will try to weasel their way around the clarified law in order to be seen to put trans rights over and above women’s rights.

There need to be job losses. First up, the person who made the decision to gaslight and abuse a rape victim raped by a male bodied NHS-defined "woman" by denying the crime - a crime only made possible by their mixed sex by stealth policies.

If it wasn't for CCTV presumably the NHS would have got away with the abuse of this woman.

Haulage · 18/04/2025 15:53

Are they all similar KnottyAuty? Do you think there was a template?

KnottyAuty · 18/04/2025 15:45

Wow that was quick - 3 letters!

MarieDeGournay · 18/04/2025 14:41

These statements from the NHS, and other similar ones, are proof of their disregard and disrespect for women.

The syrupy sympathy being ladled on to LGBT staff who may be feeling 😕at the Supreme Court ruling is in stark contrast to the 'get over yourselves' attitude to women asking for their basic rights.

It's so blatantly anti-women, these people clearly have zero self-awareness😡

CarefulN0w · 18/04/2025 14:40

For the person who asked about trusts upthread. They can be hospitals, groups of hospitals, community services, mental health services or a combination of these.

PruthePrune · 18/04/2025 14:03

My trust has put out a very similar message, with no mention of women.

KnottyAuty · 18/04/2025 13:52

Haulage · 18/04/2025 13:49

Thanks, I’ve requested access.

Not sure what happened there - can you try again to access - should be open now

BlueLimes · 18/04/2025 13:51

KnottyAuty · 18/04/2025 10:36

Would people be prepared to share the letters somehow? Redacted obvs to remove personal details

identical letters across all trusts - if they’re not particularly neutral is potentially newsworthy…

Upload screenshots here?

Yes I would. Some of them are between groups ie women’s group to lgbt grouo but I’ll be able to get them, plus the executive team are in the emails. I’m not a member of either) but someone in my team showed me while 🙄

Merrymouse · 18/04/2025 13:49

CranfordScones · 18/04/2025 13:47

"We acknowledge that our legal interpretation (along with most HR departments) wasn't based on the stated law but on a narrow ideological strand of how a small but powerful minority would wish it to be. We further acknowledge that an entrenched groupthink led us to pursue an unjustified witch hunt against those brave enough to speak out. We did nothing to address the legitimate concerns of those women except to enable their bullies. We acknowledge our wrongdoing and unreservedly apologise to the courageous women and others who were wrongly victimised and made to feel excluded. We embrace diversity - including diversity of thought and opinion - and will do more to live up to those values in future."

There's a draft for any official body that's still confused.

Good - but would their lawyers allow such an admission of fault?

Haulage · 18/04/2025 13:49

KnottyAuty · 18/04/2025 13:28

Ok here you go - if people upload them here I can pass them on to the journalist who has been looking into the NHS policies on single sex:
https://form.jotform.com/251073597264361

Noone will know who uploaded the file - including me

Thanks, I’ve requested access.

surreygirlzz · 18/04/2025 13:48

Rainbowpug · 18/04/2025 07:54

I love my social media,I'm on ticktok far to much ,I tend to avoid trans issues as it just winds me up
But since the ruling every second post is by a trans person,bleeting away .
Trans women almost threatening, "saying well let's see how all your husband's like being in the men's toilets with me ,let's see how that goes ,all those men having a party in the men's toilets with me ,see how you like that "...
What the hell is that about

Ignore them they are just vacuous

CranfordScones · 18/04/2025 13:47

"We acknowledge that our legal interpretation (along with most HR departments) wasn't based on the stated law but on a narrow ideological strand of how a small but powerful minority would wish it to be. We further acknowledge that an entrenched groupthink led us to pursue an unjustified witch hunt against those brave enough to speak out. We did nothing to address the legitimate concerns of those women except to enable their bullies. We acknowledge our wrongdoing and unreservedly apologise to the courageous women and others who were wrongly victimised and made to feel excluded. We embrace diversity - including diversity of thought and opinion - and will do more to live up to those values in future."

There's a draft for any official body that's still confused.

TwentyKittens · 18/04/2025 13:32

Rainbowpug · 18/04/2025 07:54

I love my social media,I'm on ticktok far to much ,I tend to avoid trans issues as it just winds me up
But since the ruling every second post is by a trans person,bleeting away .
Trans women almost threatening, "saying well let's see how all your husband's like being in the men's toilets with me ,let's see how that goes ,all those men having a party in the men's toilets with me ,see how you like that "...
What the hell is that about

They're men, so it's the same old male aggression when they don't get their own way bollocks.

KnottyAuty · 18/04/2025 13:28

TwoLoonsAndASprout · 18/04/2025 11:00

I wondered about a jotform? Like for the auditors?

Ok here you go - if people upload them here I can pass them on to the journalist who has been looking into the NHS policies on single sex:
https://form.jotform.com/251073597264361

Noone will know who uploaded the file - including me