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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Graham Linehan lost defamation case

53 replies

Christinapple · 08/02/2025 19:48

Post from David Paisley on bluesky on Feb 5th. See also a summary screenshot of the statements.

bsky.app/profile/davidpaisley.bsky.social/post/3lhhcgpjkmc2c
"The High Court has ruled in my defamation case against Graham Linehan, finding that the statements he published were defamatory at common law. Huge thanks to my legal team for their support throughout this process. You can read the full judgment here:

caselaw.nationalarchives.gov.uk/ewhc/kb/2025/228"

Hopefully IMO this judgement along with the UK's Online Safety Bill should send a message and clear up any ambiguity that unfounded accusations made against gay or trans people may be defamation with legal consequences, and that platforms now have legal responsibility over the content they publish.

Graham Linehan lost defamation case
OP posts:
seXX · 13/02/2025 07:53

It's interesting that @Christinapple is making assumptions based on a random reply from bluesky, while @Bosky has read and quoted the ruling. Very different approaches; I know which one I'm more likely to believe!

Bosky · 13/02/2025 03:47

Christinapple · 13/02/2025 00:02

Quote from one of the replies on the bluesky thread:

"The next stage would presumably be for Graham to provide a defence as to how his defamatory opinions were legitimately/reasonably founded, and as to what reasonable cause he had to believe the rest of his defamatory statements were factual."

So the onus would now be on Mr Linehan to prove the published statements? Is he able to do that?

My understanding from the ruling in David Paisley v Graham Linehan [2025] EWHC 228 (KB) is that the case does not relate directly to Graham's opinions, nor to any article that Graham wrote, but rather to three defamatory comments posted by someone else ("Ferguson") in reply to the transcript of a speech (by Ceri Black) that Graham published on his Substack:

"The Claimant now complains of only 3 comments"

https://caselaw.nationalarchives.gov.uk/ewhc/kb/2025/228#para_8

The comments were only visible for a matter of minutes before being deleted and Judge Eardley remarks:

"it is for the Claimant to prove whether the comments were actually published to anyone during any of the relevant timeframes."

https://caselaw.nationalarchives.gov.uk/ewhc/kb/2025/228#para_19

"If the party cannot establish that the material would have been seen by all readers who read the statement during the specified timeframe, it must be ignored."

https://caselaw.nationalarchives.gov.uk/ewhc/kb/2025/228#para_27

I think that the latter two parts of the ruling mean that the onus is now on Paisley to prove that anyone, apart from him, actually read the defamatory comments before they were deleted - but I am happy to be corrected.

It seems that the reason that Graham, rather than the person who commented, has been taken to court is that Graham has been identified as the "publisher", ie. in that the comments were posted on his Substack. Again, I am happy to be corrected as IANAL and I am just making the best sense that I can of the ruling.

However . . . hypothetically . . . I rather suspect that if defamatory comments had actually been posted by Graham, but on someone else's Substack, that Paisley would have elected to take Graham to court, ie. rather than the publisher of the hypothetical other Substack.

It will be interesting to see what happens at the next stage.

The first sentence of the judgement starts,

"This is my second judgment on certain preliminary issues in this case"

The first judgement was on 1 Aug 2024:

https://www.bailii.org/ew/cases/EWHC/KB/2024/1976.pdf

Now that the "preliminary issues" have been dealt with, my understanding is that the case will next go to trial to determine whether the comments caused Paisley "serious harm". Again, I am happy to be corrected.

Defamation, Libel & Slander in the UK

Serious harm

For a statement to be defamatory, it must be seen to have caused, or be likely to cause serious harm to the reputation of the individual it refers to.

This requirement of ‘serious harm’ was introduced in the Defamation Act 2013, and later court rulings have clarified the degree that meets this standard.

The decision on whether the element of serious harm is present in each individual case will be down to the court to decide but situations where it may be difficult to prove serious harm include, but are not limited to:

  • where the individual affected already has a ‘bad’ reputation
  • where the reach of the defamatory statement was very limited
  • where the statement criticises services or goods
  • where the statement was withdrawn, corrected or an apology was made
In the case of a defamatory statement affecting an organisation, serious harm can only be proved if the statement has caused, or is likely to cause, the organisation serious financial loss.

Publication

The defamatory statement must be expressed or conveyed to another person or persons.

www.lawble.co.uk/defamation/#elementor-toc__heading-anchor-5

There are usually a few lawyers hanging around FWR so hopefully one will pop by at some point and confirm, correct or clarify what is going on with this case.

Mittens67 · 13/02/2025 00:14

Tbh as soon as I saw the name of the OP in this thread I knew it would be the same old nonsense.

MrsTerryPratchett · 13/02/2025 00:09

Mumsnet gave permission for the topic to be reposted with clarification.

All the Gin to you MNHQ. All of it.

Christinapple · 13/02/2025 00:02

Quote from one of the replies on the bluesky thread:

"The next stage would presumably be for Graham to provide a defence as to how his defamatory opinions were legitimately/reasonably founded, and as to what reasonable cause he had to believe the rest of his defamatory statements were factual."

So the onus would now be on Mr Linehan to prove the published statements? Is he able to do that?

OP posts:
tobee · 12/02/2025 16:44

TheUnusuallyQuerulentMxLauraBrown · 12/02/2025 15:17

Did Chris jump the gun then? Or the shark?

😆

TheUnusuallyQuerulentMxLauraBrown · 12/02/2025 15:17

Did Chris jump the gun then? Or the shark?

Spin Watersports GIF by PureADK
Maaate · 12/02/2025 15:04

Don't let the facts get in the way of a good story Bosky...

Bosky · 12/02/2025 14:51

It's not over until the Fat Man at the Bus Stop sings, "Ribbons!!! Aargh!!!" 😱

"For clarity: This was a Trial of Preliminary Issues (TPI) ruling, in addition to a previous ruling, this means the court has now found all statements defamatory at common law. However, this is not the end of the case. This is an important step forward but further legal proceedings are likely ahead."

https://bsky.app/profile/davidpaisley.bsky.social/post/3lhhmfnzhqc2c

So this ruling was just about whether the statements were defamatory - not that Glinner has been found guilty of defamation.

Brokenrecordroundround · 10/02/2025 09:52

Such a good use of the over £100k people donated to him to fight this 🙄 When will people stop funding these grifters

petesdragfrom · 08/02/2025 23:09

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

Bannedontherun · 08/02/2025 23:03

Zzzzz

sam winchester yawn GIF
Foxgloverr · 08/02/2025 22:56

I'm just going to repeat what I said on your last thread.

Let s/he who is without sin cast the first stone.

Clabonysisi · 08/02/2025 22:43

theteachesofleeches · 08/02/2025 21:52

😂post on reddit, no one here gives a fuck 😂😂😂

Clear and to the point.😍

theteachesofleeches · 08/02/2025 21:52

😂post on reddit, no one here gives a fuck 😂😂😂

JanesLittleGirl · 08/02/2025 21:41

@Christinapple What crime do you think that Glinner was guilty of? And why?

Rightsraptor · 08/02/2025 21:30

I did try to read that judgment, honestly, but it was so tedious I had to skip bits. Long bits.

But it was clear that the case was essentially extremely petty, given that Paisley took the case out against Linehan who didn't even write the offending comments. I can only hope the damages will be cursory.

KilkennyCats · 08/02/2025 20:47

seXX · 08/02/2025 20:45

@Christinapple "unfounded accusations made against gay or trans people may be defamation"

Why specifically gay or trans people? Does defamation not cover anyone else?

Nobody else matters to @Christinapple

seXX · 08/02/2025 20:45

@Christinapple "unfounded accusations made against gay or trans people may be defamation"

Why specifically gay or trans people? Does defamation not cover anyone else?

BunburyInATizz · 08/02/2025 20:32

It's rather sweet to see some people's wish to be a main character. It's very touching to see that the thread has been retouched and relaunched after a rocky start although it's become no more accurate.

OP might have revisited the discussions from long ago as to what constitutes publication and conferred a duty to remove adverse comments. Rather like the wish of so many people to censor women's discussion on places like MN.

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/3438714-Bunbury-s-Public-Service-Announcement-2?

tom cruise i want the truth GIF
IwantToRetire · 08/02/2025 20:30

Its worth reading the ruling which isn't that long and in fact it sounds like the court this was a complete waste of time and piffle.

And the poor Judge had to sit down and read SubStacks guidance on comments.

I'm not going to paste in the final judgement because it includes the phrase that caused the problem.

https://caselaw.nationalarchives.gov.uk/ewhc/kb/2025/228

But agree with comment up thread that maybe commentators should think twice before posting in a grandstanding manner, is the outcome is not them, but the person whose article they are commenting on end up paying the price of their need to be bombastic.

David Paisley v Graham Linehan - Find Case Law - The National Archives

https://caselaw.nationalarchives.gov.uk/ewhc/kb/2025/228

Legitiny · 08/02/2025 20:06

eatfigs · 08/02/2025 19:55

This is about comments left on Glinner's blog by third parties, and not anything directly published by him, isn't it?

The problem for him is that it was his substack and he didn't delete the comments (which he responded to).

RoyalCorgi · 08/02/2025 20:06

Glinner didn't write the defamatory comments, neither did he endorse them. In fact, he reprimanded the commenter for writing them.

This kind of judgement is very worrying, because neither Glinner nor anyone else can realistically stop people writing defamatory comments on their blog.

Paisley could have chosen to sue the person who made the defamatory comment, but no doubt he has his own reasons for pursuing Glinner.

It raises the alarming prospect that anyone could go onto someone else's blog and, using a pseudonym and VPN, make defamatory comments that then get the blog owner sued. If I were a TRA, I wouldn't be gloating about this ruling, I'd be very worried. Of course, TRAs are not known for their capacity for critical thinking.

PronounssheRa · 08/02/2025 19:58

I do hope your last, now deleted, attempt at this thread taught you a thing or two about defamation

eatfigs · 08/02/2025 19:55

This is about comments left on Glinner's blog by third parties, and not anything directly published by him, isn't it?