Butlin's Skegness removes 5 trans women from female toilets

Good on them but you'd never get me in a Butlins. Enjoy your weekend though 😂

Oh shit, I better break the news to DH that hes gay

I’m pretty certain any hypothetical list would include:

wearing lipstick
tilting your head to one side when listening
heels
flicking your hair
only talking about shoes and handbags
always having sanpro in your handbag to offer other women in public toilets

Same

yes please, I really need to know if I have been "womaning" wrong

What actually happened?

"trying to behave as a woman does" - Could you pop the list of these activities and behaviours onto this thread because I for one would love to know?

I really, really hope that the security staff have not lost their jobs over this. If they have, then I can only hope there's another crowd funder coming.
And five? I thought the narrative is that trans women are supposedly rare and shy occurrences, not a whole gang of male people in the women's toilets kicking off at security when asked to leave.

I just called Butlins and asked for a copy of their policy on single-sex spaces.
I also asked if it was true that 5 men in a dress were removed from a single-sex space, and the security then lost their jobs.
Reception: it was a separate event you need to contact this email.
Me: It was held at Butlins.

Reception: yes but it was an outside event
Me: I said yes, but held at Butlins. Mothers, & Grandmothers will be reading this and I will never consider taking my grandchildren to Butlins.
Me: Can you send me your risk assessment and policy on single-sex spaces?
Reception: I need to speak to my line manager
Me: Wait for 6 mins
Reception: If you give us some details we will get in touch.
Pfffffffffffffffffffffffffffff

If you want to jam up their phone lines and ask the same the number is
0330 100 6648

I disagree. Loads of people I know are into dance music but also understand female oppression and biological reality. The arts and music are just so fucking captured by this neo religion (and so precarious to be employed in) that it's simply too dangerous to speak out.

I also think that art and music are different from say, shopping, or watching a film, in that one tends to interpret the meaning of the piece for oneself. So I don't boycott musicians I like just because they believe misogynist rubbish, whereas I wouldn't be able to tolerate the same from a comedian because it would probably leak into their work too much.

In general I find dance music events less aggressive for obvious reasons; discovering a man in a theatre / shopping centre / pub toilet would be way more scary than a man on pills in a festival toilet. So maybe that aspect is relevant.

Maybe these guys were reported. Remember a lot of people who self identify as "kind" are still labouring under the false assumption that all transwomen are gay men with no dicks.

For those reading along on this thread, just a reminder that we have recently been shown just how people's transgender identities are based on philosophical belief.

Because to be a person with a transgender identity is not based on having gender dysphoria. We have been told this now by professional academics as well as trans people themselves.

Therefore the only commonality for people with transgender identities is that their philosophical belief. Meaning no one needs to comply with another persons philosophical belief. No one.

No male can ever experience “life as a woman.” They are not living life as a woman. No matter how much they are trying.

They can only ever experience life as a male person who believes they are a woman. Even when they 'act' like a woman, they are acting as they believe a 'woman' should act. They are not a woman. It is rather misogynistic that they believe they are acting like a woman or living as a woman.

Even if they are treated 'as a woman' by some people, they are being treated as a 'male who presents as a woman and believes they are a woman'. Because their every reaction is based on that. Not on them being female in any way.

Even when they have extreme body modifications, it is to be their own concept of what a female looks like to them. It is not what a female is. How can it be?

The only way a person can experience life as a woman, is to have a female body, formed around the production of large gametes, even if it doesn't produce those and to navigate their life based on the decisions they and society makes that revolve around them having that body.

A male can conceptualise what it might be like to be a female, but that is all it ever is - their concept of being female.

They may do it because they don't feel they fit into how they conceptualise how a male person interacts with the world (ie. their own stereotypes around being male) or they do it because they want to be seen as a female (using their own stereotypes of how a female navigates life). It really doesn't matter though. Their motivation is irrelevant to the outcome.

Which is that they will always be just a male person who believes they are something they are objectively not.

How can the material reality be any different? This is why someone's gender is only based on someone's philosophical belief. And philosophical beliefs are fine for people to hold, but not one person in the UK has to comply with another's philosophical belief.
No matter how kind or respectful that person who is trying to shame you into complying to use that language tells you that it is to use the preferred language, it is someone who is demanding that you support their own philosophical belief.

And no one has to pretend that any person on this earth has changed sex or is the sex they identify as but is materially not.
And those attempting to shame others in doing so, are not the 'kind' people that they would have you believe.

And no male person can ‘live as a woman’.

Just acting in line with the law. Personally I think that is more important.

The only difference is whether the male person says they are a woman or not.

Whether they are “living full time dressed as a woman/trying to behave as a woman does.” they are still male people, and never ‘women’.

Because no male person can ever say what it feels like to be a 'woman'. None. And any male at any time can say they are transgender and it has to be considered true, doesn’t it?

It certainly implies that someone assumed her gender and pronouns.

Of course we know only special people get to choose. Skivvies and workers do what the special people tell them.

'At one point, one of the security staff shouted 'right, let's get that out of here' to one of her colleagues while pointing at a trans person."'

Indeed hopping. Surely if it is such an inclusive event, those male people should have been perfectly safe in the male toilets….

It is as if safety isn’t actually the issue for these particular male people.

And why 5 in the female toilets at once? Is this a sign that female people are now a violent threat to these male people.

I've never been to Butlins but I have been to other holiday parks which certainly do have female security staff. I always presumed it was so that they could deal with incidents in female toilets and with female guests misbehaving.

This article implies that the security staff were biological females.

https://ra.co/news/81427

Another article.

https://whatthetrans.com/security-assault-trans-people-in-butlins-bathroom-while-ravers-chant-let-her-pee/

Alleged they followed in a 'person with facial hair'.

'Biological males' is the correct phrasing.

Perhaps mixed sex facilities would have been a better plan for this festival.

As has been said many times, this is preferable to pretend 'single sex' that is actually mixed.sex.

Wonder what they were really doing in the toilets...

Were they cross drawing or trans? There is a difference. Cross dressing is what it says on the tin, they are just dressing in women’s clothes sometimes. If trans they are living full time dressed as a woman/trying to behave as a woman does.

If the ethos of the festival was such, why weren't the males using the male toilets given they would have been perfectly safe - and indeed welcomed - in there? Or perhaps the ethos was 'stfu women, and give the men what they want' - as per.

Absolutely. Maybe they were there for the complimentary sano ...