Young Vic theatre: gender neutral loos... with urinals

There's lots of evidence that mixed sex facilities enable predators and pose a risk to women. Yet this is always ignored:
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Sorry, the above was in response to @ZeldaFighter . Quote fail.

I believe this was Creation nightclub in Cardiff. They reverted back to single sex toilets after the owner’s son was charged with raping an underage girl in the toilets.

😂
Don't worry Daisies. Your mates will already have identified all the witches women concerned for the safety of women and girls, the law on provision of single sex spaces and women's rights to privacy and dignity and will be burning them on a stake outside the theatre.
So you can be all warm and toasty as you watch the play in your smug anti women bubble.

Well don't go there again, if you dont' like it. And thank god, I'd rather not share the theatre with someone who think this is worth getting angry over.

This. It’s basically an invitation to potentially predatory men, including all those who wouldn’t have done it without an invitation, who will now join the small number of super-predators who would have invaded anyway.

Used to be the same at the Barbican cinema 1. Except men were quie frequently using the gender neutral wine without urinals. I started using the one with urinals.

Much to my fully stonewalled TWAW friends horror. “But what about the men using the urinal?”

I give up. Only men matter.

Even in single sex toilet it's increasingly common to have cubicles with no gaps - does give me panicked moments if lock then sticks.

Over a year ago we went to a venue with two sets of toilets no indication which had urinals - put us off going there. We ended up the again recently as no where else had space to get a meal - they'd redone them to open plan to reception area mixed sex floor to ceiling cubicles - and it was packed full of pushchair and young kids -turns out changes were popular with families and it felt safer to leave pushchair outside cubicle and there was more space. Staff said it had increased family traffic to venue but had no effect on market they'd thought they were aiming at.

Also noticed a trend for more coffee shop style loos ie single self contained toilets with basin and dryers in- recent trip to Uni museum had about 6 opening directly onto corridor.

I know changing villages get a back rep on here - but 3 out of 4 I've encountered were better for us especially when kids were young - the fourth was a bad designed nightmare with gaps and had constant voyeur complaints to point regulars just used the toilets to change in.

I'm not sure I'm keen on mixed toilets personally but if venues are going down that route they need to do more than just change signs.

Everyone used to know this. It's a bit akin to the two-week dustbin collection because everyone seems to have forgotten it's not about recycling and saving carbon footprints, so only send out half the bin lorries, it's about public health, control of vermin and the prevention of diseases, so the dustbins need emptying at least once a week. Ditto gaps under doors - they are for safety, so single-sex provision is not only about privacy and safety from assault but also about saving lives.

I went back to the Young Vic after not being there for a while, and what they've basically done is re-brand their single sex loos as unisex loos without making any interior changes. And the same with the Lyric Hammersmith - although there are still some single sex loos there - they're just quite well-hidden. In my experience, it is always worth checking with venue staff as to whether there are any single-sex loos on the premises, as a lot have retained them in less prominent positions.

OnAPostItNote · Today 17:19

Gents always stinks and some of the men insist on peeing on the seat. No matter how many awkward emails etc. My husband says men’s loos are alway dirtier. Don’t attack me over this as I have no evidence.

You're not wrong, I used to dislike it intensely when my daughter was small and I needed to take her to the loo. Always, always had to wipe piss off the seat, the drill her to wait whilst I washed my hands and then get back to hold her, so she didn't fall in.

To me these loos are the worst of all. The vast majority of women and decent men go in the sex appropriate toilet - it is obvious which is which, but any perv can access the opposite sex toilet without anyone being able to say anything.I don't think it is fair to make men like my son and husband who would only ever use the correct sex toilets feel uncomfortable.

Same thing in the Old Vic London. Bloody stupid - one door saying “10 cubicals” and another door saying “2 cubicals and 10 urinals”

So basically men’s loo and women’s loo.

Sun total of zero women using the urinal one nor any men using the cubical only. Prob because there was a fucking massive queue (as always) for the “Cubical” only loo aka women’s lav!!!!!

So irritated by this stupid, mimsey “gender neutral” fucking language. Just pay the money to put in a “gender neutral” loo and stop fucking about with the women’s loos!!

I think one of the issues for me is the use of language. They aren't gender neutral, they are mixed sex. Doesn't sound quite as warm and fuzzy that way though.

A letter to the Young Vic congratulating them on that very point sounds like a good idea.

My family business. Gents always stinks and some of the men insist on peeing on the seat. No matter how many awkward emails etc.
My husband says men’s loos are alway dirtier. Don’t attack me over this as I have no evidence. But he says it’s true. So that’s just another thing to deal with.

My friends and I rescued a student in a nightclub by going over a loo door and unlocking it from the inside. I saw a blue hand sticking out the door gap. She was covered in vomit and unconscious and we pulled her away from the door to open it (it opened inwards) and called staff who called an ambulance. Would not have seen her had the door been full length.

I agree. I've never been able to articulate it that clearly, but the lack of gaps always worries me.

I have a very dim memory of being sent under a door gap as a tiny child because the lady on the other side couldn't undo the door lock. (In hindsight, maybe she had arthritis in her hands?) If it had been a floor to ceiling one, what would have been done?

And she was merely locked in, not actually unconscious!

@Datun thank you. It is so obvious.

And the thing is, five minutes ago, everybody knew this. Everybody knew what the gaps were for.

We're reinventing the bloody wheel, all the time.

I predict it will change when somebody collapses behind the door and nobody realise, or if they do realise then they can’t get to them. Then hopefully it will get publicised and the theatre will feel that they can justify changing them back to single sex ‘for the greater good’.

My Dd (with epilepsy and no awareness before seizures) wanted to go to the theatre so I asked the manufacturer of their new mixed sexed toilets how to get in in an emergency. He said no one had asked that before. I told him there is no toilet door gap so you don’t have the visibility to see if someone has collapsed but when people do they fall forwards against the door. He admitted they was no way of knowing and that to open the inward-opening door you would have to take if off its frame that involves special tools. Theres a video on YouTube that goes into detail how to do it apparently but theatre staff wouldn’t know that.

If someone feels ill in the theatre, (pre heart attack, stroke, concussion, drug issues, fever, diabetes etc) they normally head to the toilet. That’s true of any sex or gender.

Toilets that are mixed sex are designed without a door gap or ability to climb over as it is recognised that they are less private and the phone problem.

The safest toilets for everyone (could literally be a matter of life/death) are single sex toilets with door gaps so people at their most vulnerable have more chance to be safeguarded. That also includes risk of sexual assaults and drug use. The increase in mixed sex toilets in schools is of particular concern knowing that Parliament discussed there was at least one rape reported per school day inside a British school premises in 2015.

Nobody likes it, no one. Everyone would prefer single sex facilities. The only people who don't, are those who enjoy violating boundaries.

And yes, it will have to be men making their feelings felt that will make the difference, because as PP have already said, no one listens to women.

I don't disagree with making a fuss in the men's toilets, to be honest. Much as I don't want them to be uncomfortable, we need their support.

You could even just say, surely you don't like this chaps, can you please complain because they're not listening to us.

Can you imagine asking your mate in the next door cubicle for a tampon/bit of loo roll/tissue? Or coming out with blood on your hands? Or helping your elderly female relative past all the men pissing?

it's pointless virtue signalling, that does nothing except signal their craven stupidity.

There aren't issues for me if everybody is in cubicles. You are only sharing a sink and I'm happy to do that with whoever and have done for years, also showers at the swimming pool. I get that other women don't like it and the "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" argument but for me it's not a problem.

I don't think it has been that common at all.

I don't see how you don't understand the issues as they've been described?

Do you also feel comfortable using such facilities in the night time economy?